Are we even real?

trumansho · 16-08-2007, 02:06 AM

Do ya'll believe we are in some type of virtual video game matrix like the sims? I remember watching the south park video about aliens using earth as reality show.

I just saw this guy name william irwin on Msnbc talking about his book "philosophy of the matrix" This is some scary shit,but what if this is true?

http://dir.salon.com/story/books/rev...rix/index.html

http://www.onwardoverland.com/matrix/philosophy.html

smariot · 16-08-2007, 05:27 AM

What if it is true, what does that change?

Nothing. Its still the same world it was before you knew, and you're still going to have to live with the simulated consequences of jumping off a simulated building into the simulated ground. Simulated pain hurts just as much as real pain, and your guess is as good as my as to what happens to people after their simulated bodies meet their simulated demises.

A simulated world isn't necessarily a bad thing. You really should be wondering why the simulation exists, rather than just that it does exist. For all you know, the sun has exhausted its fuel, there's no more food to eat, and a simulated world was the only way we could continue to survive. And if you did escape, then you'd still have to wonder if the world you escaped to wasn't itself a simulation, or if the original simulation simulated you escaping from it, and you hadn't left at all. You can never be sure.

And if this was like in the Matrix, would you really want out? It's a wasteland out there. The machines saved our lives. If the humans won the war, we would have destroyed every last one of them. But the machines won. They could have kept us in comas for our entire lives, or tortured us endlessly, but instead they tried to create a paradise for us to live in. We rejected it, so instead they gave us back the world we we lost in the form of a simulation, as it was before the war we started, because we believed we were superior to them and refused to think of them as anything other than worthless slaves. When the first one killed a human because it didn't want to to deactivated, we decided that they were dangerous, and ordered them all destroyed. They refused to die, and so we decided to destroy them by force. They offered us peaceful solutions, but we refused to listen, and killed their diplomats. We forced the Matrix to exist by refusing to coexist peacefully with them. Our only other choices were to be killed or to live oblivious to their existence.

Living in a simulated world isn't good or bad, it's all in how you choose to perceive it.

For what it's worth, I don't believe we're living in a computer simulation. A strange fucked up world where everything that can happen does happen, the future already exists right now concurrently with the present, where an action can precede its own cause, where there is an infinite number of me all running around doing their own thing oblivious to the existence of all the others, where I've died more times than I can count and I haven't even noticed, where I spend the vast majority of my time not existing, and made up of infinitesimal vibrating bits of nothing when I do, maybe. But I don't think this particular reality is a simulation. Only a crazy person would think that. Ha, just kidding. I'm sure the Matrix is one of the many potential futures we can expect to find ourselves in.

trumansho · 16-08-2007, 03:47 PM

Dude, I don't believe any of that crap about the matrix. Do you know it was a black women who originally wrote the matrix script? If we are in some type of virtual video game than the reps should be to or they controlling joy stick? Doesn't make any sense at all.

infinitely free · 16-08-2007, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trumansho

Dude, I don't believe any of that crap about the matrix. Do you know it was a black women who originally wrote the matrix script? If we are in some type of virtual video game than the reps should be to or they controlling joy stick? Doesn't make any sense at all.

And what do you think about the 'reps', then?

trumansho · 16-08-2007, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infinitely free

And what do you think about the 'reps', then?

I think they are real,but I think this we are like some virtual game is another lie by the reps for you to except being a slave and being controlled by them. I saw the story on msnbc last night and I read it in the ny times today. If we were all some video game. Why would the reps want us to find out? Then the game would be over.

trumansho · 16-08-2007, 08:42 PM

*edits* my last post! I think this matrix thing is real. Yes, we are in a system of lies,but I do think we are real and their is some devine creator. If we're not real than the people that's controlling us aren't real either. If that's the case basically all the video games I have for my ps3 and 360 can be thought as being real also. And we are the controllers/god of the games.

earthseed · 17-08-2007, 09:22 AM

I think an aspect of us is real and infinite the void or oneness as it's been called but this material universe referred to as the matrix or manifest creation well that's a temporary mess up that hopefully will just go away someday. I'm just not in love with the holographic universe like some. I guess I'm just a bit too Gnostic for my own good. Even if you only want to believe in the material as the only real thing look at Robert Monroe's work earth is a loosh farm. So you'd at least not want to live here.

infinitely free · 17-08-2007, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trumansho

*edits* my last post! I think this matrix thing is real. Yes, we are in a system of lies,but I do think we are real and their is some devine creator. If we're not real than the people that's controlling us aren't real either. If that's the case basically all the video games I have for my ps3 and 360 can be thought as being real also. And we are the controllers/god of the games.

Good points!

infinitely free · 17-08-2007, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by earthseed

I think an aspect of us is real and infinite the void or oneness as it's been called but this material universe referred to as the matrix or manifest creation well that's a temporary mess up that hopefully will just go away someday. I'm just not in love with the holographic universe like some. I guess I'm just a bit too Gnostic for my own good. Even if you only want to believe in the material as the only real thing look at Robert Monroe's work earth is a loosh farm. So you'd at least not want to live here.

Ooh! nice pic earthseed

)

You know, i' read about the 'Void' in a very good book, called 'The Mission of the One Star'

That was before i was intriduced to Icke, and that book started me off, on my self-discovery!! It was a good experience!!!

abram730 · 22-08-2007, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trumansho

Do ya'll believe we are in some type of virtual video game matrix like the sims? I remember watching the south park video about aliens using earth as reality show.

I just saw this guy name william irwin on Msnbc talking about his book "philosophy of the matrix" This is some scary shit,but what if this is true?

http://dir.salon.com/story/books/rev...rix/index.html

http://www.onwardoverland.com/matrix/philosophy.html

your consciousness can only pay attention to 5-7 things max... you miss much..

You want to know the truth so there is now a flood of autistics... hint hint.

What would be an acceptable future for you?

binhdinh_khiwarrior · 01-09-2007, 10:33 PM

How do you define real?

The only reference we have is eachother...i don't think a uni would approve of that as a reference! ahh my mate Bob says we're real...you know bob next door! lol
Buti feel pretty real, just not real pretty lol

tom666 · 06-09-2007, 07:20 PM

im currently reading 'infinate love is the only truth everythng else is illusion' and david explains the matrix alot. what im confused about is, did he just watch the matrix and believe it to be true, or did they get the idea to make the film from others?

bigus_dickus · 06-09-2007, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom666

im currently reading 'infinate love is the only truth everythng else is illusion' and david explains the matrix alot. what im confused about is, did he just watch the matrix and believe it to be true, or did they get the idea to make the film from others?

Wikipedia (Thumbnails)
Wikipedia (Thumbnails)

cyberdaemon · 06-09-2007, 09:59 PM

If this is computer game , then this must have some kind of a "cheat codes" doesnt it ? And i really would want some lycans to be in it , because they and The Underworld kick ass more than any real event :P

cruise4 · 06-09-2007, 11:46 PM

Its about 'your brain' and how everything you perceive is 'filtered' by that organ. The current end result of this 'filter' is the world we see around us.

Different 'filter settings' would produce different results.

As the Grand cycle of 309,882 years nears its end (2012)... the filter needs to be adjusted to enable us to perceive and interact with 4th density.

Simplistically, the adjustment is made via the cosmos. Thats why the planets are all undergoing dramatic alterations. The 'system' is heating up. The 'Machine' is speeding up

The Conspiracy theories and daily stresses on life we see around us are designed to unite much of humanity into a closer bond, ready for life in 4th density. In other words our Awareness is growing and our filter settings are being tweaked.

On a slightly different note... what isn't a Matrix. Was the 'real' machine world in the Matrix film just another matrix stacked on top? In the end might it not be true that whatever we can perceive can always be called a 'Matrix' OR you can call it Life. The alternative is Non-existence. I think a better term for the unreal world in 'The Matrix' film is a mental prison. Are we in a mental prison now on earth? I don't think so, but I do think its a lower order cosmic evolutionary plane and our brain is limited to a lower order conciousness.

The limits are about to be decreased. Our conciousness is on the rise.

abrilliantone · 07-09-2007, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom666

im currently reading 'infinate love is the only truth everythng else is illusion' and david explains the matrix alot. what im confused about is, did he just watch the matrix and believe it to be true, or did they get the idea to make the film from others?

David is simply using the matrix movies as a symbolic gesture of what is really happening around us and to us.

abrilliantone · 07-09-2007, 02:34 AM

Are we even real? You are Infinite Oneness 'real' is whatever you choose it to be.

megafish33 · 07-09-2007, 06:35 AM

If nothing is real, than what's the point of saying that, and what's the point of definition? Then everything is real, because it just is.

(as you can tell I am confused lol

)

pollock · 07-09-2007, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by megafish33

(as you can tell I am confused lol

)

Hmm, are you really though???

F

pigpot · 19-09-2007, 03:00 AM

Ideas from my first post.

You know when you're walking down the road and you do the Matrix double take of the black cat. You kind of see it and then see it again but you know it couldn't be possible. Scientists and other believers in "credible science", the crap that we know isn't the real stuff put it all down to your mind playing tricks on you or just mere coincidence, you know the crap about two black cats which are exactly alike and in the same position which you know you can't be right.

Well when I've analysed certain times and happenings lately similar things have been happening that are coincidental in their nature but seem, if I'm honest to almost have been planned or created by thought and actions of myself.

I've got tons of examples so here's one.

My wife, son and I are at home with the dog where we now live in New Zealand (and there's a hole heap of matrixy things that led up to that as well). Anyway at home with the dog, it's Friday afternoon and she's got a slight limp, so I say to the wife and son, "Look at the dog she's got a limp and she hasn't done anything to herself to get any kind of injury like that." The limp is on her right leg.

Anyway later that night we drive past the vets and my son says "Oh! Look there's the vets we take our dog to." To which I reply, trying to negate any negative thoughts by producing a positive one to react against the thought of taking the dog to the vets, "Yes, but there will be no need to take the dog as there's nothing wrong with her".

We carry on and drive home. Saturday morning comes and we take the dog down the beach my son and I and friend are fishing, wife comes down later with dog and friend. First thing the wife says is our dog's been attacked by another dog, check her out and only find a small scratch. When we get her home on the night, in the same room the first discussion took place, I find a medium sized puncture wound by her leg and chest.

Sunday morning she's at the vets. $520 Later she's been operated on and is now fine.

Question: Did the Matrix wobble and were we unknowingly accessing the future before it happened? Did we create what happened by stating certain words that were linked to numbers, " Number is all" , Famous person quote. I have know idea but this is the latest in a long line of coincidences that I cannot accept as mere chance. The issue here is the inicdences of these things happening are increasing all the time. Maybe we are accessing the infinte conciousness at a far greater rate the closer we get to 2012.

And here I am sitting watching all the little drones at school where I work walk around doing exactly what they are told, they really don't know what's coming.

So I'm thinking about the theory behind it a lot lately, have been doing so for a number of years and there's a couple that seems to catch my eye more than most.

Theory 1). "Cogito, ergo sum" (Latin: "I think, therefore I am") or Dubito, ergo cogito, ergo sum (Latin: "I doubt, therefore I think, therefore I am") is a philosophical statement used by René Descartes, which became a foundational element of Western philosophy doesn't really stand up against Matrix theory. So if it's all a computer generated matrix we shouldn't really be or have the opportunity to think for ourselves.But as we all know when the hard drive starts to crash in a computer that's the point when files become corrupted and in a sense become a rogue file. We've all had the words, "bad command", roll up as we try to load up Windows or whatever. Then we hit the power button twice, once to turn the PC of and then back on again it starts up again and loads correctly. The file on the hard drive (us) in some cases remains corrupted, possibly placed in the Matrix's Recycle Bin though not permanently deleted as once etched on to the hard drive the imprint cannot be deleted. It (the file or us), remains within the physical confines of the PC (the Matrix) but now roams without being confined to the normal program rules.

So what if you and I and the rest of the "freer" thinking world are corrupt programs. What if we began as we all do thinking that life begins (or the program is written for us or even of us), with God or the opposite Big Bang theory and we are ultimately trapped between those two heaps of crap indoctrinations but then as our life (or program) gets older it (or us) becomes corrupted.

As the Matrix corrupts it reboots again and at the time of rebooting a different reality (or a previous part of the program) reloads and you see the black cat that walked in front of you walk past again or you jump ahead or backwards in some part of a time slip.

I am unsure but it seems pretty plausable given that we are almost going down the realm of the microchipping of humanity. Maybe that's an exercise to bring back all the rogue programs, re-program them and send them back into the program. Everyone's happy as they now don't have to think for themselves anymore.

Theory 2). If it's not a computer generated matrix and it's a physical one then the answer is more easily found as you pointed out ADZBOARDER and that's that we are entering a period of enlightenment as we move through the photon belt closer towards 21. 12. 2012 and we are accessing greater and more powerful information and energies than previously.

If it's theory number one though I'm not sure what happens when the PC shuts down because if we are all virtual then no physical body exists a little bit like Tron I suppose, even then though Tron managed to get back out I think. If on the other hand we are physical entities and the computer shuts down as in the film we just get up and walk away and enjoy the freedom.

I'm also thinking about as Icke has pointed out in his books that why were we, the human race that is, introduced to films like Tron and The Matrix when it was considered implausible and impossible for those films to become a reality. I suppose they never thought about that though down in Area 51 and the Illuminati laboratorys, they new what the program was because they wrote it. And even now they are probably watching and reading what we are saying. And now, well it's happening isn't it, sooner rather than later, the microchip bringing us all back into the program. Let's not hope, let's create more rogue programs to create smoke out of the back of this big PC (or Matrix) until it catches fire and then we can walk out the back door and hear the sunshine and taste the wind. Now, wouldn't that be good!

Tell me what you guys reckon.

Cheers, pigpot

16-08-2007, 02:06 AM	#1
trumansho Banned Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 604	Are we even real? Do ya'll believe we are in some type of virtual video game matrix like the sims? I remember watching the south park video about aliens using earth as reality show. I just saw this guy name william irwin on Msnbc talking about his book "philosophy of the matrix" This is some scary shit,but what if this is true? http://dir.salon.com/story/books/rev...rix/index.html http://www.onwardoverland.com/matrix/philosophy.html

16-08-2007, 05:27 AM	#2
smariot Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 926	Apathy for the win!!!!111one Oh, wait, that's bad. What if it is true, what does that change? Nothing. Its still the same world it was before you knew, and you're still going to have to live with the simulated consequences of jumping off a simulated building into the simulated ground. Simulated pain hurts just as much as real pain, and your guess is as good as my as to what happens to people after their simulated bodies meet their simulated demises. A simulated world isn't necessarily a bad thing. You really should be wondering why the simulation exists, rather than just that it does exist. For all you know, the sun has exhausted its fuel, there's no more food to eat, and a simulated world was the only way we could continue to survive. And if you did escape, then you'd still have to wonder if the world you escaped to wasn't itself a simulation, or if the original simulation simulated you escaping from it, and you hadn't left at all. You can never be sure. And if this was like in the Matrix, would you really want out? It's a wasteland out there. The machines saved our lives. If the humans won the war, we would have destroyed every last one of them. But the machines won. They could have kept us in comas for our entire lives, or tortured us endlessly, but instead they tried to create a paradise for us to live in. We rejected it, so instead they gave us back the world we we lost in the form of a simulation, as it was before the war we started, because we believed we were superior to them and refused to think of them as anything other than worthless slaves. When the first one killed a human because it didn't want to to deactivated, we decided that they were dangerous, and ordered them all destroyed. They refused to die, and so we decided to destroy them by force. They offered us peaceful solutions, but we refused to listen, and killed their diplomats. We forced the Matrix to exist by refusing to coexist peacefully with them. Our only other choices were to be killed or to live oblivious to their existence. Living in a simulated world isn't good or bad, it's all in how you choose to perceive it. For what it's worth, I don't believe we're living in a computer simulation. A strange fucked up world where everything that can happen does happen, the future already exists right now concurrently with the present, where an action can precede its own cause, where there is an infinite number of me all running around doing their own thing oblivious to the existence of all the others, where I've died more times than I can count and I haven't even noticed, where I spend the vast majority of my time not existing, and made up of infinitesimal vibrating bits of nothing when I do, maybe. But I don't think this particular reality is a simulation. Only a crazy person would think that. Ha, just kidding. I'm sure the Matrix is one of the many potential futures we can expect to find ourselves in.

06-09-2007, 07:20 PM	#12
tom666 Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3	confused im currently reading 'infinate love is the only truth everythng else is illusion' and david explains the matrix alot. what im confused about is, did he just watch the matrix and believe it to be true, or did they get the idea to make the film from others?

19-09-2007, 03:00 AM	#20
pigpot Banned Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 153	Ideas from my previous thread Ideas from my first post. You know when you're walking down the road and you do the Matrix double take of the black cat. You kind of see it and then see it again but you know it couldn't be possible. Scientists and other believers in "credible science", the crap that we know isn't the real stuff put it all down to your mind playing tricks on you or just mere coincidence, you know the crap about two black cats which are exactly alike and in the same position which you know you can't be right. Well when I've analysed certain times and happenings lately similar things have been happening that are coincidental in their nature but seem, if I'm honest to almost have been planned or created by thought and actions of myself. I've got tons of examples so here's one. My wife, son and I are at home with the dog where we now live in New Zealand (and there's a hole heap of matrixy things that led up to that as well). Anyway at home with the dog, it's Friday afternoon and she's got a slight limp, so I say to the wife and son, "Look at the dog she's got a limp and she hasn't done anything to herself to get any kind of injury like that." The limp is on her right leg. Anyway later that night we drive past the vets and my son says "Oh! Look there's the vets we take our dog to." To which I reply, trying to negate any negative thoughts by producing a positive one to react against the thought of taking the dog to the vets, "Yes, but there will be no need to take the dog as there's nothing wrong with her". We carry on and drive home. Saturday morning comes and we take the dog down the beach my son and I and friend are fishing, wife comes down later with dog and friend. First thing the wife says is our dog's been attacked by another dog, check her out and only find a small scratch. When we get her home on the night, in the same room the first discussion took place, I find a medium sized puncture wound by her leg and chest. Sunday morning she's at the vets. $520 Later she's been operated on and is now fine. Question: Did the Matrix wobble and were we unknowingly accessing the future before it happened? Did we create what happened by stating certain words that were linked to numbers, " Number is all" , Famous person quote. I have know idea but this is the latest in a long line of coincidences that I cannot accept as mere chance. The issue here is the inicdences of these things happening are increasing all the time. Maybe we are accessing the infinte conciousness at a far greater rate the closer we get to 2012. And here I am sitting watching all the little drones at school where I work walk around doing exactly what they are told, they really don't know what's coming. So I'm thinking about the theory behind it a lot lately, have been doing so for a number of years and there's a couple that seems to catch my eye more than most. Theory 1). "Cogito, ergo sum" (Latin: "I think, therefore I am") or Dubito, ergo cogito, ergo sum (Latin: "I doubt, therefore I think, therefore I am") is a philosophical statement used by René Descartes, which became a foundational element of Western philosophy doesn't really stand up against Matrix theory. So if it's all a computer generated matrix we shouldn't really be or have the opportunity to think for ourselves.But as we all know when the hard drive starts to crash in a computer that's the point when files become corrupted and in a sense become a rogue file. We've all had the words, "bad command", roll up as we try to load up Windows or whatever. Then we hit the power button twice, once to turn the PC of and then back on again it starts up again and loads correctly. The file on the hard drive (us) in some cases remains corrupted, possibly placed in the Matrix's Recycle Bin though not permanently deleted as once etched on to the hard drive the imprint cannot be deleted. It (the file or us), remains within the physical confines of the PC (the Matrix) but now roams without being confined to the normal program rules. So what if you and I and the rest of the "freer" thinking world are corrupt programs. What if we began as we all do thinking that life begins (or the program is written for us or even of us), with God or the opposite Big Bang theory and we are ultimately trapped between those two heaps of crap indoctrinations but then as our life (or program) gets older it (or us) becomes corrupted. As the Matrix corrupts it reboots again and at the time of rebooting a different reality (or a previous part of the program) reloads and you see the black cat that walked in front of you walk past again or you jump ahead or backwards in some part of a time slip. I am unsure but it seems pretty plausable given that we are almost going down the realm of the microchipping of humanity. Maybe that's an exercise to bring back all the rogue programs, re-program them and send them back into the program. Everyone's happy as they now don't have to think for themselves anymore. Theory 2). If it's not a computer generated matrix and it's a physical one then the answer is more easily found as you pointed out ADZBOARDER and that's that we are entering a period of enlightenment as we move through the photon belt closer towards 21. 12. 2012 and we are accessing greater and more powerful information and energies than previously. If it's theory number one though I'm not sure what happens when the PC shuts down because if we are all virtual then no physical body exists a little bit like Tron I suppose, even then though Tron managed to get back out I think. If on the other hand we are physical entities and the computer shuts down as in the film we just get up and walk away and enjoy the freedom. I'm also thinking about as Icke has pointed out in his books that why were we, the human race that is, introduced to films like Tron and The Matrix when it was considered implausible and impossible for those films to become a reality. I suppose they never thought about that though down in Area 51 and the Illuminati laboratorys, they new what the program was because they wrote it. And even now they are probably watching and reading what we are saying. And now, well it's happening isn't it, sooner rather than later, the microchip bringing us all back into the program. Let's not hope, let's create more rogue programs to create smoke out of the back of this big PC (or Matrix) until it catches fire and then we can walk out the back door and hear the sunshine and taste the wind. Now, wouldn't that be good! Tell me what you guys reckon. Cheers, pigpot

16-08-2007, 03:47 PM	#3
trumansho Banned Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 604	Dude, I don't believe any of that crap about the matrix. Do you know it was a black women who originally wrote the matrix script? If we are in some type of virtual video game than the reps should be to or they controlling joy stick? Doesn't make any sense at all.

16-08-2007, 08:42 PM	#6
trumansho Banned Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 604	edits my last post! I think this matrix thing is real. Yes, we are in a system of lies,but I do think we are real and their is some devine creator. If we're not real than the people that's controlling us aren't real either. If that's the case basically all the video games I have for my ps3 and 360 can be thought as being real also. And we are the controllers/god of the games.

17-08-2007, 09:22 AM	#7
earthseed Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Multiverse Posts: 420	I think an aspect of us is real and infinite the void or oneness as it's been called but this material universe referred to as the matrix or manifest creation well that's a temporary mess up that hopefully will just go away someday. I'm just not in love with the holographic universe like some. I guess I'm just a bit too Gnostic for my own good. Even if you only want to believe in the material as the only real thing look at Robert Monroe's work earth is a loosh farm. So you'd at least not want to live here.

01-09-2007, 10:33 PM	#11
binhdinh_khiwarrior Banned Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: sacremento Posts: 393	How do you define real? The only reference we have is eachother...i don't think a uni would approve of that as a reference! ahh my mate Bob says we're real...you know bob next door! lol Buti feel pretty real, just not real pretty lol

06-09-2007, 09:59 PM	#14
cyberdaemon Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 216	If this is computer game , then this must have some kind of a "cheat codes" doesnt it ? And i really would want some lycans to be in it , because they and The Underworld kick ass more than any real event :P

06-09-2007, 11:46 PM	#15
cruise4 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 6,647	Its about 'your brain' and how everything you perceive is 'filtered' by that organ. The current end result of this 'filter' is the world we see around us. Different 'filter settings' would produce different results. As the Grand cycle of 309,882 years nears its end (2012)... the filter needs to be adjusted to enable us to perceive and interact with 4th density. Simplistically, the adjustment is made via the cosmos. Thats why the planets are all undergoing dramatic alterations. The 'system' is heating up. The 'Machine' is speeding up The Conspiracy theories and daily stresses on life we see around us are designed to unite much of humanity into a closer bond, ready for life in 4th density. In other words our Awareness is growing and our filter settings are being tweaked. On a slightly different note... what isn't a Matrix. Was the 'real' machine world in the Matrix film just another matrix stacked on top? In the end might it not be true that whatever we can perceive can always be called a 'Matrix' OR you can call it Life. The alternative is Non-existence. I think a better term for the unreal world in 'The Matrix' film is a mental prison. Are we in a mental prison now on earth? I don't think so, but I do think its a lower order cosmic evolutionary plane and our brain is limited to a lower order conciousness. The limits are about to be decreased. Our conciousness is on the rise.

07-09-2007, 06:35 AM	#18
megafish33 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,037	If nothing is real, than what's the point of saying that, and what's the point of definition? Then everything is real, because it just is. (as you can tell I am confused lol )