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NIST WTC7 by Underwriters Laboratories' Kevin Ryan
The NIST WTC 7 Report: Bush Science reaches its peak Kevin R. Ryan September 10, 2008 In a famous book by Antoine de Saint Exupery, a little prince from another planet asks the narrator to draw a sheep. After several unsatisfactory attempts, the narrator simply draws a box and tells the little prince that the sheep is in the box. The little prince then exclaims -- "That is exactly the way I wanted it!"1 Just so, the Bush Administration asked its scientists at the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) for an explanation as to what happened at the World Trade Center (WTC) on 9/11. In response to this request, NIST drew up a series of fanciful stories over a period of years, each story differing from the previous one. Finally, after seven long years, NIST published its last story for WTC 7 by simply saying, in effect: "The explanation is in our computer."2 As expected, however, this explanation in a box leaves much to be desired for those of us who prefer to live in reality, instead of in a fictional world. On the other hand, we are learning something from NIST with this new report, and that is that when government scientists begin working for a political agenda above all else, there is no limit to the extent of deception that they will engage in. We also know that those who have produced the NIST WTC reports must now assume personal responsibility for the ongoing 9/11 Wars, and the millions of deaths that will result from those wars. NIST begins with a few little white lies, and never looks back NIST unveiled its WTC 7 report by making a new diversionary claim that it worked only three years on the investigation. But, to the contrary, we know that NIST began its work in August 2002 and decoupled its WTC 7 report in June 2004, after creating hundreds of pages of detailed reports for WTC 7.3 The investigation ostensibly began anew in September 2005, after the report for the towers was sputtered out. Since then -- other than for several "responses to FAQs" on the report for the towers -- NIST has focused entirely on WTC 7. This means that, in full, NIST worked on its final explanation for the destruction of WTC 7 for at least five years, not three. However, as the reader will see, NIST did learn from its experience in deceiving the public about the towers. One way in which NIST learned to avoid criticism was to pretend that it had considered alternative theories. In its presentation on the draft WTC 7 report, NIST claimed, "We were very open to alternative theories." But that claim could be seen as true only if one turned a blind eye to many facts indicating the exact opposite was true, including the following: NIST ignored all invitations from independent investigators to discuss or debate its findings or the alternative theory. NIST's previous reports show no evidence that NIST considered alternative theories at all. Only one small disclaimer was made in the final report for the towers, and only after public criticism that no mention of alternative theories was made in the draft report for the towers. 9/11 family members and independent investigators have had to pursue legal avenues to seek the truth from NIST, including a request for correction that has ultimately been ignored by NIST.4 Those citizens who have successfully criticized NIST in public have lost their jobs for doing so. NIST makes no mention of the mainstream scientific articles published in support of the alternative theory.5 Another important lesson NIST learned from its report on the towers was this: if you perform actual physical tests to support a politically motivated conclusion, those tests had better support that conclusion. The physical tests NIST and Underwriters Laboratories (UL) performed for the investigation on the towers did not support the predetermined conclusions that NIST, and its bosses at the Bush Administration, sought to maintain.6 NIST avoided that problem with the WTC 7 investigation by simply not performing any physical tests to support its theory. Instead of throwing a few beams and columns together and heating them to see what might happen, NIST built its final story on nothing but computer models that it said took excruciatingly long periods of time to process ("... a 25 s analysis took up to 8 weeks to complete.") In other words, for NIST, avoiding problems means avoiding reality. Oh, forget about the diesel fuel In its new draft report based entirely on computer models, NIST contradicts its previous statements that suggested the building was destroyed due to fires caused by diesel fuel. This was despite the fact that, after several years of investigation, NIST still believed that the diesel fuel had made all the difference. NIST used its partner, Popular Mechanics, to communicate the diesel fuel theory. In a March 2005 article that was later expanded into a farcical book, Popular Mechanics (PM), claimed "investigators believe the fire was fed by tanks of diesel fuel." Sivaraj Shyam Sunder, the leading deceiver for NIST and PM, expounded on this claim by stating "Our current working hypothesis is that this pressurized line was supplying fuel [to the fire] for a long period of time."7 But like the previous explanations for the towers (remember the pancake theory?), the final explanation for WTC 7 bears no resemblance to the earlier versions. NIST simply states in its new report that the diesel fuel played no role in the destruction of WTC 7. "However, fuel oil fires did not play a role in the collapse of WTC 7." (NCSTAR 1A, p xxxii) Oddly enough, no one in the major media seemed to notice. Even the New York Times, which had published scores of articles referring to WTC 7 and diesel fuel since 9/11, played along with this complete reversal without skipping a beat. Reporter Eric Lipton, who previously had written of WTC 7's "disastrous blaze fed by diesel fuel", simply suggested that NIST's Sunder, in explaining his new theory, was being very patient with the "conspiracy theorists".8 Oh, and forget about the damage caused by the falling towers, too For years, we were also told that WTC 7 fell because 25% of the building was "scooped out" by falling debris from the towers. This completely unsupported claim came from a media driven exaggeration of another statement Sunder made to his supporters at PM. Sunder claimed that "On about a third of the face to the center and to the bottom -- approximately 10 stories -- about 25 percent of the depth of the building was scooped out."9 Of course, one third of one quarter only makes one twelfth, not 25%, but that was not important. As with the other official stories and exaggerated media versions of them, everyone knew that the goal for NIST and the Bush Administration was to make people stop thinking about it. That's probably why so many of the official/media legends centered on food analogies. There was the pancake theory, and licorice steel, and the donut (WTC 6). And as with those, the "scooped out" phrase sent the blood running quickly from the brain to the stomach in anticipation of an ice cream treat. Celebrities like Denis Leary and Alan Colmes just ate it up and regurgitated it, as did Matthew Rothschild, Manuel Garcia, and every other pretentious supporter of the official conspiracy theory. It turns out that the "scooped out" nonsense was just more speculative deception. NIST knew that it would never be able to support such a claim with real science, as even the simplest evaluations disputed it. It was evident that the debris pattern at Ground Zero was incredibly asymmetrical, and NIST probably didn't want to have to explain that anyway. But no one would believe that falling debris had "scooped out" so much of WTC 7, while the buildings immediately adjacent to WTC 7 incurred essentially no damage at all from the falling towers. Not even Larry could be so lucky. Additionally, it was clear that such extreme, asymmetric damage would have caused an asymmetric collapse, not a straight down free-fall speed collapse as we see in the videos. In the end, NIST gave up on the "scooped out" explanation, stating: "Other than initiating the fires in WTC 7, the damage from the debris from WTC 1 had little effect on initiating the collapse of WTC 7." NCSTAR 1A, p xxxii For those who were looking for easy answers, this new story means that the blood must leak back to the brain after all. But NIST is hoping that, by now, we've forgotten how to think altogether. Molten metal? What molten metal? NIST, in its final report on WTC 7, ignored all of the evidence relating to molten metal, even though numerous reliable witnesses spoke of the presence of molten metal at Ground Zero. These witnesses included Richard Garlock, a structural engineer at Leslie E. Robertson Associates, an engineering firm involved in the design of the towers and the clean up of the site, who said "Here WTC 6 is over my head. The debris past the columns was red-hot, molten, running."10 The witnesses to molten metal also included University of California, Berkeley engineering professor Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, who was the first scientist given access to the steel at ground zero. Dr. Astaneh-Asl referred to the WTC steel he found as "kind of melted."11 Years later, when asked again about his experience he clarified, "I saw melting of girders in World Trade Center."12 There are many other reports of molten metal at ground zero, including quite a few from those who support the Bush Administration's ever-changing fire-induced collapse theories. There are also photos supporting the reports of molten metal.13 But NIST continues to ignore all of this evidence in its new report. Paper thin steel and sulfidation? What paper thin steel and sulfidation? Since the WTC report from the Federal Emergency Management Administration (FEMA) came out in 2002, the most intriguing aspect of the official stories given was the problem that the New York Times called "perhaps the deepest mystery uncovered in the investigation."14 This mystery referred to the extremely thinned pieces of steel discovered by FEMA investigators, and also by Astaneh-Asl.15 These samples were found to exhibit sulfidation, and evidence of a eutectic formation, that could not be explained by any of the "fire-wise" professors. The fire-wise professors originally said this about the mystery, after seven to eight months of investigation. "The severe corrosion and subsequent erosion of Samples 1 and 2 are a very unusual event. No clear explanation for the source of the sulfur has been identified. The rate of corrosion is also unknown. It is possible that this is the result of long-term heating in the ground following the collapse of the buildings. It is also possible that the phenomenon started prior to collapse and accelerated the weakening of the steel structure. A detailed study into the mechanisms of this phenomenon is needed to determine what risk, if any, is presented to existing steel structures exposed to severe and long-burning fires."16 But that "detailed investigation" never got done, it turns out. And although NIST never mentioned any of this in its new WTC 7 report, Sivaraj Shyam Sunder did have to answer a question about it in his recent press conference. Sunder simply said that those fire-wise professors had thought more about it, and told the BBC that it wasn't a mystery after all. We can be sure that those professors did think more about it. But without the detailed study they originally called for, the deepest mystery remains officially unsolved. Explosive thermite? What explosive thermite? An actual explanation for the sulfidation and extreme thinning of steel has been offered by independent investigators, and is fully consistent with the alternative theory that NIST has avoided all these years. The thermite reaction, available in several useful variations for the purposes of cutting steel, can explain this thinning and sulfidation quite readily. The thermite hypothesis for the WTC was first detailed by Derrick Grimmer of the Scientific Panel Investigating Nine Eleven (SPINE).17 This hypothesis was later expanded into an experimentally supported theory by Professor Steven Jones.18 When asked about thermite in the WTC 7 press conference, Sunder pretended that NIST was not aware of the explosive forms of this chemical mixture, called super-thermite or nano-thermite. Instead, Sunder claimed that thermite could not be applied adequately in order to serve the purpose of a deceptive demolition. Sunder's answer, apart from being vague and unsupported, is also in direct contradiction to the fact that a number of the NIST WTC investigation leaders had expert knowledge of nano-thermites, and that such materials can be sprayed onto surfaces like steel.19 NIST's new report ignores many other important pieces of evidence that support the alternative theory. This evidence includes the many witnesses to explosions, the many people who were warned that the building was coming down, and the prediction, by several major media outlets, that the building was coming down well before it actually did.20 As we see with the explanation that took NIST five years to provide, no one could have possibly predicted anything like it. "The reason for the collapse of World Trade Center 7 is no longer a mystery" If the public reaction to this report were not so important to the future of all people around the world, this statement by NIST would be laughable. The destruction of WTC 7, never mentioned in the 9/11 Commission Report at all, was clearly a great mystery to government investigators since 9/11. But more importantly, after several years of investigation, it was still a great mystery to NIST and Sivaraj Shyam Sunder. In fact, Sunder reported to New York Magazine in 2006 that "But truthfully, I don't really know. We've had trouble getting a handle on building No. 7."21 That statement is quite different from what he says today, of course. When interviewed by the Associated Press immediately after presenting this new report, Sunder glibly said, "The public should really recognize the science is really behind what we have said," adding, "The obvious stares you in the face."22 Let's take a look at what is suddenly so obvious about this new story, remembering that no actual scientific experiments are behind it, other than computer simulations that we will likely never be allowed to examine. Thermal expansion, not weakening, softening, shortening or sagging In NIST's computer, steel can do just about anything. We saw that in the report for the towers, where we were told that similar computerized office fires made floors sag, columns shorten, and large quantities of steel melt soften weaken. This time, we have what NIST calls a "new phenomenon" for structural steel, called thermal expansion. "Fire-induced thermal expansion of the floor system surrounding Column 79 led to the collapse of Floor 13, which triggered a cascade of floor failures. In this case, the floor beams on the east side of the building expanded enough that they pushed the girder connecting Columns 79 and 44 to the west on the 13th floor." "The displaced girder and other local fire-induced damage caused Floor 13 to collapse, beginning a cascade of floor failures down to the 5th floor ... This left Column 79 with insufficient lateral support in the east-west direction. The column buckled eastward, becoming the initial local failure for collapse initiation." NCSTAR 1-A, p 19-20 With this summary statement, NIST begins its explanation with a sleight of hand. The "initial local failure" is not a column buckling according to this new story, but is the displacement of a girder by means of the thermal expansion of up to five floor beams. It is there that we must begin our analysis of NIST's new story, and if that is not realistic, then none of the remaining explanation for WTC 7 is realistic. We should begin with a fact described in one of NIST's earlier reports on WTC 7. "Most of the beams and girders [in WTC 7] were made composite with the slabs through the use of shear studs." NCSTAR 1-1, p 14 NIST now contradicts this earlier finding, in order to support the new story. "In WTC 7 no studs were installed on the girders." NCSTAR 1-9, p 346 For the thermal expansion story, this presence of shear studs holding the concrete floor to the beams and girders is important. The studs were 0.75 in x 5 in long, and were positioned every 1 to 2 ft along the beam or girder, according to NCSTAR 1-1. There were 28 of these studs for each of the five beams that supposedly expanded. NIST deceptively played down all those shear studs in its recent presentation, where a simple diagram falsely suggested there were only three studs for each beam. For the allegedly displaced girder, according to NIST's first report there would have been a similar number of shear studs, placed at intervals of 1 to 2 feet, for a total of at least 22 studs. But NIST's new report removes all of these in order to make it easier for the girder to be pushed out. Some of NIST's other diagrams indicate that the girder was fastened to column 79 with only two seat bolts. There were, in fact, two seat bolts and two clip bolts for each girder/column connection. Additionally, NIST unconvincingly tells us that it "found no evidence that the girders or beams in WTC 7 were welded to the seats" (NCSTAR 1-9, p 348). Of course, by now we know what NIST means when it says it "found no evidence." This is what the basic premise of NIST's new story looks like, if we assume there was no seat welding, and all the shear studs have been removed, or have broken away from, the beams and the girder. NCSTAR 1-9, p 346 As we can see, it appears NIST is telling us that the loose beams (only one shown) deflected the loose girder a distance of several feet. Even if we believe that WTC 7 was built in such a shoddy manner, is this hypothesis realistic? First, note that thermal expansion is not a new phenomenon, and structural steel was not just invented for use at the WTC. Such effects have been a possibility in all of the thousands of other situations in which structural steel was heated throughout history. So what enormous new difference did thermal expansion make for WTC 7? The floor beams that NIST is speaking of, that supposedly pushed the girder between column 79 and column 44 completely out of place, were each about 52 feet, or 15.8 meters, in length. The equation for linear thermal expansion is as follows: ΔL = α Lo ΔT That is, the increase in length of the object considered is a function of the product of the coefficient of linear expansion (a), the original length, and the change in temperature. The coefficient of linear expansion for steel is about 0.000012 m/m/°C. Using the equation above, the beams could have expanded 0.019 m for every 100 °C increase in temperature. Remember also that any thermal linear expansion would have been acting on the external columns of WTC 7's east wall as well, because thermal expansion does not affect just one end of a beam. Whatever distance the beams pushed NIST's critical girder, the same distance in bowing out of the east wall of WTC 7 would have had to occur, unless WTC 7 was a very unstable structure to begin with. Therefore, half of the total expansion length (0.01 m) would have affected NIST's critical girder for every 100 °C increase in temperature. For NIST's new story, those floor beams would have had to not only expand linearly, but also break 28 high-strength shear studs, 2 seat bolts, 2 clip bolts (and seat welds), and then cause the buckling of a gigantic girder (which also had 22 shear studs) before the beams themselves buckled or even weakened. This is quite the opposite of what NIST says happened in the towers, where the official story is that the floors sagged dramatically. In WTC7, NIST now says the floors did not sag or weaken a bit, but remained fiercely rigid as high-temperature linear expansion caused them to wreak havoc on the surrounding structure. Highly exaggerated temperatures leave beams rigid To accomplish the linear expansion, the beams first had to get very hot. NIST says that its computer models suggest that "some sections" of these beams reached 600 °C. "Due to the effectiveness of the SFRM, the highest column temperatures in WTC 7 only reached an estimated 300 °C (570 °F), and only on the east side of the building did the floor beams reach or exceed about 600 °C." NCSTAR 1A, p 19 "The temperatures of some sections of the beams supporting Floors 8, 12, 13, and 14 exceeded 600 °C." NCSTAR 1A, p 48 These extremely high steel temperatures would most certainly have resulted in the weakening of the beams, once the shear studs had been lost, allowing the thermal expansion to be relieved through downward sagging. This fact is supported by the experimental data produced by the Cardington tests, described in NCSTAR 1-9 (section 8.4.3), where much shorter floor beam spans experienced significant sagging. Therefore, this rigid beam linear expansion hypothesis is not realistic. In any case, although NIST does not state it clearly in the new report, a 575 °C increase in temperature would have caused the girder end of the beams to experience a maximum of 2.2 inches of deflection. And if it were only a "section," for example only a third of a beam length, then the increase from thermal expansion would be correspondingly smaller (or 0.7 inches). This makes NIST's story of all those bolts and studs breaking in unison, and that critical girder buckling, quite unbelievable. But how did the beams reach 600 °C in the first place? In the real world, this would have required very hot fires for a very long time. In NIST's computer, of course, this was not a problem. As with the report for the towers, these cyber-space investigators only needed to fudge a few numbers, like the thermal conductivity of the materials involved. Structural steel has a thermal conductivity of 46 W/m/K, which means that any heat applied is easily wicked away. But if that value were set to zero, or near zero, any heat applied would allow the temperature to rise dramatically at the point of application. "The steel was assumed in the FDS model to be thermally-thin, thus, no thermal conductivity was used." NCSTAR 1-5F, p 20 "The interior walls [including insulated steel columns] were assumed to have the properties of gypsum board [0.5 W/m/K]." NCSTAR 1-5F, p 52 "Although the floor slab actually consisted of a metal deck topped with a concrete slab...the thermal properties of the entire floor slab were assumed to be that of concrete [1.0 W/m/K]." NCSTAR 1-5F, p 52 Fudging the thermal conductivity values, and extrapolating the localized computer results across vast sections of the building, appears to be how NIST scientists convinced themselves that they could promote the high steel temperatures. But also note that raising those five floor beams to a temperature of 600 °C would require an enormous amount of energy, far more than was available from the burning of the office furnishings underneath the floor beams. Of course, NIST has not had any trouble selling such leaps of imagination before, as its media sponsors don't ask detailed questions and NIST does not discuss its reports with independent investigators. Brief office fires in an environment designed for fire resistance Further problems for NIST's new story result from admissions NIST has made about the state of the fires in the building, and the design of the structure. NIST admits that the fires in WTC 7 were typical office fires, and that the fires could not move from floor to floor. "Their growth and spread were consistent with ordinary building contents fires." NCSTAR 1A, p xxxii "There was no evidence of floor-to-floor fire spread until perhaps just before the WTC 7 collapse. Thus, the fire-rated floors were successful as fire penetration barriers." NCSTAR 1A, p 55 NIST also admits that the building was designed to comply with New York City Building Code, requiring fire resistance of 3 hours for columns and 2 hours for floors. "The instructions to the bidders for the WTC 7 job were to bid on a 3 h rating for the columns and a 2 h rating for the fluted steel decking and floor support steel, which corresponded to the more stringent fire resistance requirements for Type 1B (unsprinklered) construction." NCSTAR 1A, p 7 "Private inspectors found that the applied SFRM thicknesses were consistent with these values." NCSTAR 1A, p 7 (also see NCSTAR 1-9, table 8-1, p 340) Add to these facts that NIST admitted in their December 2007 advisory committee meeting that the fuel load could only support 20 minutes of fire in any given location. "Question: ...fire moved every 20 minutes; essentially it started and stopped every 20 minutes, so if you do not have fuel in WTC 7, how could fires burn for as long as they had and taken out this major structure that had good fireproofing?" "Answer (Sunder): The fires moved from location to location, meaning that at any given location the combustibles needed about 20 minutes to be consumed. While the combustibles at a location were being consumed, the fire front would be progressing to adjacent combustibles."23 For floors 11 and 12, NIST increased this estimated fuel load from 4 lb/ft2 to 6.4 lb/ft2, presumably giving a new maximum fire time of 32 minutes. Even so, how then did NIST come up with fire times of 3.5 to 4 hours? "However, it appeared likely the critical damage state occurred between 3.5 h and 4 h." NCSTAR 1A, p 32 What could possibly have been burning, under those beams, for another three hours? Without answers to these questions, we must assume that NIST is now suggesting specific corporate culpability for the failure of WTC 7. Basically, NIST is saying Underwriters Laboratories is to blame To sum up, steel components that were certified to withstand hours of fire failed in typical office fires lasting a maximum of 32 minutes in any given location. That means that there must have been negligence, or extremely poor performance, on the part of those who ensured the fire resistance of the structural components. With the report on the towers, NIST pretended that it was a mystery as to who tested the steel components for fire resistance. But, in fact, it wasn't actually that much of a mystery unless you asked UL while the whole country was watching.24 But for WTC 7, NIST comes right out and says that UL was the firm that provided the fire resistance information for the building. "According to the Underwriters Laboratories (UL) Fire Resistance Directory (1983), these ratings required a thickness of 7/8 in. of Monokote MK-5 to be applied to the heavy columns, 1 7/8 in. to be applied to the lighter columns, 1/2 in. to be applied to the beams, and 3/8 in. to be applied to the bottom of the metal deck." NCSTAR 1A, p 7 That's one good reason why UL is not listed as being part of the WTC 7 investigation. Having the company that was responsible for establishing the fire resistance of the building participate in the politically motivated investigation into how the building failed from fire might just be a conflict of interest. The problem NIST and UL have now is that confirming UL's involvement in the WTC 7 design, when the official story is centered only on failure by fire, could lead to greater problems for UL. It is clear that UL must now answer for how the structural components of WTC 7 failed catastrophically, in typical office fires, when UL's Fire Resistance Directory reported that these components would resist fire damage for much longer. The final WTC 7 story and how it was predicted After years of talking about diesel fuel fires and damage from the towers being the causes of the near free-fall collapse of WTC 7, and then acting as if they just couldn't get a handle on it, NIST now has a new "obvious" story. The new story is based on a "new phenomenon" of thermal expansion whereby fully insulated steel beams are exposed to temperatures of 600 °C in only 32 minutes. Believe it or not, NIST actually says this happened in only a few seconds (NCSTAR 1-9, table 8-2, p 353). This extreme temperature, which did not weaken the beams at all, as would have happened in WTC 1 or WTC 2, broke all the shear studs, seat bolts and clip bolts on all the beams of the east wall of WTC 7. The beams then expanded linearly, pushing the girder between column 79 and column 44 by a maximum of 2.2 inches, causing that critical girder to buckle and fall away from columns 79 and 44. We have seen that this "initial local failure" is not realistic. This is because the fire times could not possibly have caused the high steel temperatures cited, the steel would not have remained rigid if those temperatures had been reached, and the very slight thermal expansion would not have been great enough to cause the extensive girder damage imagined by NIST. From that tenuous position, we are led to believe that the one fallen girder caused one column to buckle and that meant the total destruction of this 47-story building in a matter of seconds. But who could have predicted all of this? NIST admits that this is a rare phenomenon that it had to work hard to prove. "Failure of a floor beam in fire is a rare event, and, indeed, there have been many building fires that have not resulted in even local failures of the floor system. The challenge was to determine if a fire-induced floor system failure could occur in WTC 7 under an ordinary building contents fire." NCSTAR 1-9, p 330 What geniuses knew that this new phenomenon of the thermal expansion of several floor beams in unison would cause this one hair-trigger girder to bring the entire building down several hours before it actually occurred? Many people did, including at least 60 fire department employees, more than 25 medical and emergency workers, and both CNN and the BBC.25 And if you believe all that... NIST topped off this most ridiculous of explanations with a truly bizarre consideration of a "hypothetical blast event." First, NIST asks us to assume that it wasn't a planned demolition. We are led to believe that no one would have placed explosive charges around the entire building to cause what appears to everyone who sees it as a completely symmetrical and purely vertical near free-fall implosion. On the contrary, NIST says that if WTC 7 was to have been a demolished, it would have to begin with an assumption that most of their new story is correct. That is, anybody wanting to bring the building down in a demolition event would have obviously placed one gigantic bomb under that one all important column -- column 79. Therefore, let's play along with this dishonest pretense and see what NIST says that would do. A "Blast from the smallest charge capable of failing the critical column would have resulted in a sound level of 130 dB to 140 dB at a distance of at least half a mile. There were no witness reports of such a loud noise, nor was such a noise heard on the audio tracks of video recordings of the WTC 7 collapse." NCSTAR 1-A, p xxxii Essentially, NIST is saying that WTC 7 was not a demolition because a big boom would make a big sound. That, ladies and gentlemen, is the culmination of seven years of Bush Science. No failure of imagination here The 9/11 Commission told us that the attacks on September 11th succeeded ultimately because of a "failure of imagination." NIST will never be accused of that kind of failure, as its new WTC 7 report is nothing but imaginary tripe. This new story contradicts the previous major claims by NIST, ignores the most important of the existing evidence, produces no scientific test results to support itself, and is so obviously false on its face that not even a fictional character from another planet would believe it. Fires that could only last 20 to 30 minutes lasted 4 hours (what was burning?). Imaginary temperatures that, according to NIST would have easily weakened the same steel in the towers, left beams fully rigid so that they could push one girder a full 2.2 inches, somehow breaking numerous bolts and studs in unison, as well as buckling the girder, before the beams themselves were affected in any way. Suddenly this one girder failure caused numerous floors to collapse, one hair-trigger "switch" column to buckle, and the whole building to fall in a total of 8 seconds. NIST tells us that most of these unprecedented, illogical and thoroughly fantastic events were happening within the box of WTC 7 itself, before we saw anything. Of course, they have absolutely no evidence for any of these things happening in the real world. But by now we know that it doesn't matter. The Bush scientists only need to keep their bosses' sadistic political story viable for a few more months. References and footnotes 1 Antoine de Saint Exupery, Le Petit Prince, Harcourt Brace & Co, 1943 2 NIST, Final Report on the Collapse of World Trade Center Building 7, NIST website, http://www.nist.gov/public_affairs/r...wtc082108.html 3 NIST reports prior to September 2005, that focused solely on WTC 7, include these: http://wtc.nist.gov/progress_report_.../appendixl.pdf http://wtc.nist.gov/NISTNCSTAR1-1I.pdf http://wtc.nist.gov/NISTNCSTAR1-1J.pdf Early NIST reports that covered WTC 7, as well as the towers, include the following: http://www.fire.nist.gov/bfrlpubs/bu...PDF/b03040.pdf http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/MediaUpdate...port051303.pdf http://wtc.nist.gov/solicitations/wtc_awardR0028.htm http://wtc.nist.gov/media/PublicUpdateFinal.pdf http://wtc.nist.gov/NISTNCSTAR1-1D.pdf http://wtc.nist.gov/NISTNCSTAR1-1E.pdf 4 James Gourley, et al, "Appeal Filed with NIST, Pursuant to Earlier Request for Correction," Journal of 9/11 Studies, November 2007, http://www.journalof911studies.com/v...ourleyEtAl.pdf 5 Mainstream scientific articles published in support of the alternative theories for WTC 7, include the following: Steven Jones, Frank Legge, et al, "Fourteen Points of Agreement with Official Government Reports on the World Trade Center Destruction," The Open Journal of Civil Engineering, Volume 2 Issue 1, http://www.bentham-open.org/pages/co...1/35TOCIEJ.SGM Kevin Ryan, James Gourley, and Steven Jones, "Environmental anomalies at the World Trade Center: evidence for energetic materials," The Environmentalist, August 2008, DOI: 10.1007/s10669-008-9182-4, http://www.springerlink.com/content/f67q6272583h86n4/ 6 See papers by Kevin Ryan (August 2006), Eric Douglas (December 2006), and James Gourley (November 2007), at the Journal of 9/11 Studies, http://www.journalof911studies.com/ 7 Popular Mechanics editors, Debunking the 9/11 Myths: Special Report, March 2005, http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...w/1227842.html 8 Eric Lipton, "Fire, Not Explosives, Felled 3rd Tower on 9/11, Report Says," New York Times, August 22, 2008; James Glanz and Eric Lipton, "A NATION CHALLENGED: GROUND ZERO; Burning Diesel Is Cited in Fall Of 3rd Tower," New York Times, March 2, 2002 9 Popular Mechanics editors, Debunking the 9/11 Myths: Special Report 10 Public Broadcasting Corporation (PBS), America Rebuilds: A year at ground zero, http://www.pbs.org/americarebuilds/e...debris_06.html 11 Jeffrey R. Young, "Scholars Work to Rebuild the World Trade Center Virtually," The Chronicle of Higher Education, December 7, 2001, http://chronicle.com/free/v48/i15/15a02701.htm 12 Online Newshour, Collapse of Overpass in California Becomes Lesson in Construction, May 10, 2007, http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/scien...ass_05-10.html 13 World Trade Center Hotspots, Nasathermalimages.com, http://nasathermalimages.com/ 14 James Glanz and Eric Lipton, "A Search for Clues In Towers' Collapse; Engineers Volunteer to Examine Steel Debris Taken to Scrapyards," The New York Times, February 2, 2002 15 Robert Sanders, "Report from ground zero: Engineer studies World Trade Center collapse for clues to failure," The Berkeleyan, October 3, 2001, http://www.berkeley.edu/news/berkele...0/03_grou.html 16 FEMA BPAT report, Appendix C, http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evid...WTC_apndxC.htm 17 D.P. Grimmer, "Calculations on the Possible Use of Thermite to Melt Sections of the WTC Core Columns," June 20, 2004, Physics911.net, http://physics911.net/thermite 18 Steven E. Jones, "Why Indeed Did the WTC Buildings Completely Collapse?," Journal of 9/11 Studies, September 2006, http://journalof911studies.com/volume/200609/ Why_Indeed_Did_the_WTC_Buildings_Completely_Collap se_Jones_Thermite_World_Trade_Center.pdf Steve E. Jones et al, "Extremely high temperatures during the World Trade Center destruction," Journal of 9/11 Studies, January 2008, http://journalof911studies.com/artic...CHighTemp2.pdf 19 Kevin Ryan, "The top ten connections between NIST and nano-thermites", Journal of 9/11 Studies, July 2008, http://www.journalof911studies.com/v...and_Nano-1.pdf 20 For the 60 FDNY reports, see Graeme MacQueen, "Waiting for Seven: WTC 7 Collapse Warnings in the FDNY Oral Histories," Journal of 9/11 Studies, January 2008. For the warning given to medical responders, see History Commons (9/11 Timeline), http://www.historycommons.org/contex...0wtc7evacuated. For CNN and BBC, see WTC7.net, http://www.wtc7.net/foreknowledge.html. 21 Marc Jacobsen, "The Ground Zero Grassy Knoll," New York Magazine, March 20, 2006, http://nymag.com/news/features/16464/ 22 The Associated Press, "Report: Fire, not bombs, leveled WTC 7 building," August 21, 2008, http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...wtc-nist_N.htm 23 NIST Advisory Committee meeting minutes, December 18th, 2007, http://wtc.nist.gov/media/NCSTACMeet...utes121807.pdf 24 Kevin Ryan, "Three Years Later: Another Look At Three Claims from UL," 911truth.org http://www.911truth.org/article.php?...70919215921873 25 For the 60 FDNY reports, see Graeme MacQueen, "Waiting for Seven: WTC 7 Collapse Warnings in the FDNY Oral Histories," Journal of 9/11 Studies, January 2008. For the warning given to medical responders, see History Commons (9/11 Timeline), http://www.historycommons.org/contex...0wtc7evacuated. For CNN and BBC, see WTC7.net, http://www.wtc7.net/foreknowledge.html.
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06-04-2012, 12:09 AM
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http://www.911review.com/articles/ryan/letter.html
From: Kevin R Ryan/SBN/ULI To: frank.gayle@nist.gov Date: 11/11/2004 Dr. Gayle, Having recently reviewed your team's report of 10/19/04, I felt the need to contact you directly. As I'm sure you know, the company I work for certified the steel components used in the construction of the WTC buildings. In requesting information from both our CEO and Fire Protection business manager last year, I learned that they did not agree on the essential aspects of the story, except for one thing - that the samples we certified met all requirements. They suggested we all be patient and understand that UL was working with your team, and that tests would continue through this year. I'm aware of UL's attempts to help, including performing tests on models of the floor assemblies. But the results of these tests appear to indicate that the buildings should have easily withstood the thermal stress caused by pools of burning jet fuel. There continues to be a number of "experts" making public claims about how the WTC buildings fell. One such person, Dr. Hyman Brown from the WTC construction crew, claims that the buildings collapsed due to fires at 2000F melting the steel (1). He states "What caused the building to collapse is the airplane fuel . . . burning at 2,000 degrees Fahrenheit. The steel in that five-floor area melts." Additionally, the newspaper that quotes him says "Just-released preliminary findings from a National Institute of Standards and Technology study of the World Trade Center collapse support Brown's theory." We know that the steel components were certified to ASTM E119. The time temperature curves for this standard require the samples to be exposed to temperatures around 2000F for several hours. And as we all agree, the steel applied met those specifications. Additionally, I think we can all agree that even un-fireproofed steel will not melt until reaching red-hot temperatures of nearly 3000F (2). Why Dr. Brown would imply that 2000F would melt the high- grade steel used in those buildings makes no sense at all. The results of your recently published metallurgical tests seem to clear things up (3), and support your team's August 2003 update as detailed by the Associated Press (4), in which you were ready to "rule out weak steel as a contributing factor in the collapse". The evaluation of paint deformation and spheroidization seem very straightforward, and you noted that the samples available were adequate for the investigation. Your comments suggest that the steel was probably exposed to temperatures of only about 500F (250C), which is what one might expect from a thermodynamic analysis of the situation. However the summary of the new NIST report seems to ignore your findings, as it suggests that these low temperatures caused exposed bits of the building's steel core to "soften and buckle"(5). Additionally this summary states that the perimeter columns softened, yet your findings make clear that "most perimeter panels (157 of 160) saw no temperature above 250C". To soften steel for the purposes of forging, normally temperatures need to be above 1100C (6). However, this new summary report suggests that much lower temperatures were be able to not only soften the steel in a matter of minutes, but lead to rapid structural collapse. This story just does not add up. If steel from those buildings did soften or melt, I'm sure we can all agree that this was certainly not due to jet fuel fires of any kind, let alone the briefly burning fires in those towers. That fact should be of great concern to all Americans. Alternatively, the contention that this steel did fail at temperatures around 250C suggests that the majority of deaths on 9/11 were due to a safety-related failure. That suggestion should be of great concern to my company. There is no question that the events of 9/11 are the emotional driving force behind the War on Terror. And the issue of the WTC collapse is at the crux of the story of 9/11. My feeling is that your metallurgical tests are at the crux of the crux of the crux. Either you can make sense of what really happened to those buildings, and communicate this quickly, or we all face the same destruction and despair that come from global decisions based on disinformation and "chatter". Thanks for your efforts to determine what happened on that day. You may know that there are a number of other current and former government employees that have risked a great deal to help us to know the truth. I've copied one of these people on this message as a sign of respect and support. I believe your work could also be a nucleus of fact around which the truth, and thereby global peace and justice, can grow again. Please do what you can to quickly eliminate the confusion regarding the ability of jet fuel fires to soften or melt structural steel. 1. http://www.boulderweekly.com/archive...overstory.html 2. CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics, 61st edition, pg D-187 3. http://wtc.nist.gov/media/P3Mechanic...sisofSteel.pdf 4. http://www.voicesofsept11.org/archive/911ic/082703.php 5. http://wtc.nist.gov/media/NCSTACWTCS...101904WEB2.pdf (pg 11) 6. http://www.forging.org/FIERF/pdf/ffaaMacSleyne.pdf Kevin Ryan Site Manager Environmental Health Laboratories A Division of Underwriters Laboratories
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06-04-2012, 12:13 AM
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The NIST WTC 7 Report is False by Kevin Ryan
The official explanation for the destruction of WTC Building 7 was given by NIST in late 2008. This presentation will help you understand why that official NIST explanation is false. The collapse of Building 7 can never have started the way NIST says it did. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=ArnYryJqCwU Here is a partial transcript of that presentation: Early fire-based hypotheses could not be supported : Early fire-based hypotheses could not be supported Diesel fuel fires were not the cause “Diesel fuel fires did not play a role in the collapse of WTC 7.“ NIST final report Damage due to falling debris from WTC 1 was not the cause " Other than initiating the fires in WTC 7, the damage from the debris from WTC 1 had little effect on initiating the collapse of WTC 7.” NIST final report Design over Con-Ed substation was not the cause “ Neither did the Con-Edison substation play a significant role in the collapse of WTC7.” NIST final report NIST started in 2002 and was stumped for years…: NIST started in 2002 and was stumped for years… " But truthfully, I don't really know. We've had trouble getting a handle on building No. 7 .” Shyam Sunder to New York Magazine in 2006 " The reason for the collapse of World Trade Center 7 is no longer a mystery “ Shyam Sunder in 2008, when WTC 7 report was unveiled " The public should really recognize the science is really behind what we have said,” "The obvious stares you in the face .“ Shyam Sunder to Associated Press in 2008 …then said it was obvious NIST’s contradictions on shear studs: NIST’s contradictions on shear studs NIST’s Interim Report 2004 -- NIST NCSTAR 1-9 (2008 ) -- Slide 7: NIST’s interim report on WTC 7 (2004) referred to a paper by Salvarinas , who knew about the shear studs …the critical girder had 30 shear studs Slide 8: How did beam expansion break 28 shear studs on each beam, 30 shear studs on the critical girder, and 4 bolts at the column seat? Differential linear expansion is where the expansion of the beam is greater than the expansion of the floor Slide 9: What do other experts say? Column 79 and the critical girder: Column 79 and the critical girder NIST’s hypothesis is that the critical girder was pushed at least 5.5 inches: NIST’s hypothesis is that the critical girder was pushed at least 5.5 inches Force from expanding floor beam 5.5 inches Center of mass Girder web After beam push Slide 12: NCSTAR 1-9, p 536 The NIST model simulated all of this as occurring in a matter of seconds At what temperature did this happen? How did differential thermal expansion occur?: How did differential thermal expansion occur? NCSTAR 1-9, pp 349 to 352 How much thermal expansion could the beams have experienced?: How much thermal expansion could the beams have experienced? NIST’s example calculation: (NCSTAR 1-9, p 344 ) But the beams were 53 -foot long floor and NIST said the temperature maximum was 400 C (to retain rigidity)… Therefore the beams would experience a maximum linear expansion of… (0.000014 / C ) x (400 C – 25 C ) x (636 in) = 3.3 inches ...not the 5.5 inches NIST said was needed for the girder to “walk-off ” its seat Critical girder would still be on its seat: Critical girder would still be on its seat Maximum possible deflection is 3.3 inches, which is 2.2 inches short of the minimum need for the center of mass to come off the seat Web still well seated Seven hour fires?: Seven hour fires? NIST reported that --“ WTC 7 endured fires for almost seven hours… ” and “ Fires were ignited on at least 10 floors; however, only the fires on Floors 7 through 9 and 11 through 13 grew and lasted until the time of the building collapse .” NIST simulations begin at 12:00 pm and last until 6:00 pm Fires first photographed at: 12:10 pm on floor 22 12:28 pm on floors 29, 30 02:00 pm on floor 7 02:08 pm on floors 11, 12 02:30 pm on floor 13 03:41 on pm floor 8 04:00 on pm floor 9 05:03 on pm floor 14 Underwriters Laboratories: Underwriters Laboratories UL was the firm that provided the fire resistance information for WTC 7. " According to the Underwriters Laboratories (UL) Fire Resistance Directory (1983), these ratings required a thickness of 7/8 in. of Monokote MK-5 to be applied to the heavy columns, 1 7/8 in. to be applied to the lighter columns, 1/2in. to be applied to the beams, and 3/8 in. to be applied to the bottom of the metal deck ." NCSTAR 1A, p 7 " Private inspectors found that the applied SFRM thicknesses were consistent with these values ." NCSTAR 1A, p 7 (also see NCSTAR 1-9, table 8-1, p 340) “ The debris damaged the spray-applied fire resistive material…only in the vicinity of the structural damage from the collapse of WTC 1.” NCSTAR 1A p xxxvii Only 20 minutes of fire load in a given area : Only 20 minutes of fire load in a given area NIST admitted in their December 2007 advisory committee meeting that the fire load could only support 20 minutes of fire in any given location. "Question (Thornton): “…fire moved every 20 minutes; essentially it started and stopped every 20 minutes, so if you do not have fuel in WTC 7, how could fires burn for as long as they had and taken out this major structure that had good fireproofing ?“ "Answer (Sunder): “The fires moved from location to location, meaning that at any given location the combustibles needed about 20 minutes to be consumed. While the combustibles at a location were being consumed, the fire front would be progressing to adjacent combustibles." NIST did not use the photos as model input: NIST did not use the photos as model input NCSTAR 1-9, p 378 Slide 20: Structural engineer Ron Brookman , SE, made a FOIA request to NIST in 2009 asking for calculations and analysis behind the claim of girder walk-off failures. Can we see the NIST computer models?
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You can read my recent articles here: http://www.activistpost.com/2012/04/...e-writing.html http://wideshut.co.uk/australian-gre...al-governance/ http://wideshut.co.uk/most-britons-g...istence-level/ You can listen to all of my radio programmes here. Last edited by wake_up_bomb; 06-04-2012 at 12:13 AM. |
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06-04-2012, 12:35 AM
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#4 |
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06-04-2012, 12:39 AM
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Banned
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Quote:
I've always wondered why truthers favourite vids of WTC 7 collapses are silent. Real CD's have loud explosions. Got any vids of WTC7 collapsing with big booms? Investigations don't just take into account video. They also use eye witness accounts - especially from first responders. Aural accounts from anyone in the vicinity. They build up a big picture. |
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06-04-2012, 12:48 AM
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#6 | |
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Quote:
I also look forward to reading your responses to my questions listed here: http://forum.davidicke.com/showpost....&postcount=224 http://forum.davidicke.com/showpost....&postcount=225 http://forum.davidicke.com/showpost....&postcount=226
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You can read my recent articles here: http://www.activistpost.com/2012/04/...e-writing.html http://wideshut.co.uk/australian-gre...al-governance/ http://wideshut.co.uk/most-britons-g...istence-level/ You can listen to all of my radio programmes here. Last edited by wake_up_bomb; 06-04-2012 at 12:49 AM. |
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06-04-2012, 12:50 AM
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Quote:
 Massive Explosions - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_A9X_8flGeM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvCU9Z9aWW0 9/11 Firefighters Reveal Bombs Destroyed WTC lobby - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1zED8dy63w Explosions in Basement of WTC Long Before Collapse - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhGcBxONSvc Barry Jennings WTC 7 explosions - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbbZE7c3a8Q William Rodriguez - explosions in the basement, before the plane hit, as well as secondary explosions https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIC0Kl4TKoU 9/11 EyeWitnesses To WTC Lobby Explosion - NIST FOIA - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W1HlV9O65w
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Does it look to you like Time is speeding up? Now we know for sure its not. Creation is speeding up. There's more and more happening in less and less Time and that has been the pattern for 16.4 Billion Years - Ian Xel Lungold (RIP) Last edited by lobuk; 06-04-2012 at 12:54 AM. |
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06-04-2012, 12:53 AM
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Banned
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Quote:
So what were these silent explosives that caused the silent demolition of WTC7? |
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06-04-2012, 12:55 AM
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#9 |
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06-04-2012, 12:55 AM
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06-04-2012, 12:59 AM
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06-04-2012, 01:03 AM
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06-04-2012, 01:03 AM
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06-04-2012, 01:05 AM
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Quote:
According to everything you've posted on all the WTC7 threads it was still structurally intact at the time. |
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06-04-2012, 01:08 AM
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#15 | |
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Quote:
This extreme temperature, which did not weaken the beams at all, as would have happened in WTC 1 or WTC 2, broke all the shear studs, seat bolts and clip bolts on all the beams of the east wall of WTC 7. The beams then expanded linearly, pushing the girder between column 79 and column 44 by a maximum of 2.2 inches, causing that critical girder to buckle and fall away from columns 79 and 44. We have seen that this "initial local failure" is not realistic. This is because the fire times could not possibly have caused the high steel temperatures cited, the steel would not have remained rigid if those temperatures had been reached, and the very slight thermal expansion would not have been great enough to cause the extensive girder damage imagined by NIST. From that tenuous position, we are led to believe that the one fallen girder caused one column to buckle and that meant the total destruction of this 47-story building in a matter of seconds. But who could have predicted all of this? NIST admits that this is a rare phenomenon that it had to work hard to prove. "Failure of a floor beam in fire is a rare event, and, indeed, there have been many building fires that have not resulted in even local failures of the floor system. The challenge was to determine if a fire-induced floor system failure could occur in WTC 7 under an ordinary building contents fire." NCSTAR 1-9, p 330 What geniuses knew that this new phenomenon of the thermal expansion of several floor beams in unison would cause this one hair-trigger girder to bring the entire building down several hours before it actually occurred? Many people did, including at least 60 fire department employees, more than 25 medical and emergency workers, and both CNN and the BBC.25 And if you believe all that... NIST topped off this most ridiculous of explanations with a truly bizarre consideration of a "hypothetical blast event." First, NIST asks us to assume that it wasn't a planned demolition. We are led to believe that no one would have placed explosive charges around the entire building to cause what appears to everyone who sees it as a completely symmetrical and purely vertical near free-fall implosion. On the contrary, NIST says that if WTC 7 was to have been a demolished, it would have to begin with an assumption that most of their new story is correct. That is, anybody wanting to bring the building down in a demolition event would have obviously placed one gigantic bomb under that one all important column -- column 79. Therefore, let's play along with this dishonest pretense and see what NIST says that would do. Essentially, NIST is saying that WTC 7 was not a demolition because a big boom would make a big sound. That, ladies and gentlemen, is the culmination of seven years of Bush Science.
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You can read my recent articles here: http://www.activistpost.com/2012/04/...e-writing.html http://wideshut.co.uk/australian-gre...al-governance/ http://wideshut.co.uk/most-britons-g...istence-level/ You can listen to all of my radio programmes here. |
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06-04-2012, 01:12 AM
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Banned
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Quote:
You've maintained all along that WTC7 was structurally intact at the time of collapse. Where was the big bang that brought it down? |
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06-04-2012, 01:17 AM
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#17 | |
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Quote:
After years of talking about diesel fuel fires and damage from the towers being the causes of the near free-fall collapse of WTC 7, and then acting as if they just couldn't get a handle on it, NIST now has a new "obvious" story. The new story is based on a "new phenomenon" of thermal expansion whereby fully insulated steel beams are exposed to temperatures of 600 °C in only 32 minutes. Believe it or not, NIST actually says this happened in only a few seconds (NCSTAR 1-9, table 8-2, p 353). This extreme temperature, which did not weaken the beams at all, as would have happened in WTC 1 or WTC 2, broke all the shear studs, seat bolts and clip bolts on all the beams of the east wall of WTC 7. The beams then expanded linearly, pushing the girder between column 79 and column 44 by a maximum of 2.2 inches, causing that critical girder to buckle and fall away from columns 79 and 44. We have seen that this "initial local failure" is not realistic. This is because the fire times could not possibly have caused the high steel temperatures cited, the steel would not have remained rigid if those temperatures had been reached, and the very slight thermal expansion would not have been great enough to cause the extensive girder damage imagined by NIST. From that tenuous position, we are led to believe that the one fallen girder caused one column to buckle and that meant the total destruction of this 47-story building in a matter of seconds. But who could have predicted all of this? NIST admits that this is a rare phenomenon that it had to work hard to prove. "Failure of a floor beam in fire is a rare event, and, indeed, there have been many building fires that have not resulted in even local failures of the floor system. The challenge was to determine if a fire-induced floor system failure could occur in WTC 7 under an ordinary building contents fire." NCSTAR 1-9, p 330 What geniuses knew that this new phenomenon of the thermal expansion of several floor beams in unison would cause this one hair-trigger girder to bring the entire building down several hours before it actually occurred? Many people did, including at least 60 fire department employees, more than 25 medical and emergency workers, and both CNN and the BBC.25 And if you believe all that... NIST topped off this most ridiculous of explanations with a truly bizarre consideration of a "hypothetical blast event." First, NIST asks us to assume that it wasn't a planned demolition. We are led to believe that no one would have placed explosive charges around the entire building to cause what appears to everyone who sees it as a completely symmetrical and purely vertical near free-fall implosion. On the contrary, NIST says that if WTC 7 was to have been a demolished, it would have to begin with an assumption that most of their new story is correct. That is, anybody wanting to bring the building down in a demolition event would have obviously placed one gigantic bomb under that one all important column -- column 79. Therefore, let's play along with this dishonest pretense and see what NIST says that would do. Essentially, NIST is saying that WTC 7 was not a demolition because a big boom would make a big sound. That, ladies and gentlemen, is the culmination of seven years of Bush Science.
__________________
You can read my recent articles here: http://www.activistpost.com/2012/04/...e-writing.html http://wideshut.co.uk/australian-gre...al-governance/ http://wideshut.co.uk/most-britons-g...istence-level/ You can listen to all of my radio programmes here. |
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06-04-2012, 01:20 AM
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#18 | |
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Banned
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Quote:
You've said in numerous posts WTC7 was structurally intact at the time of collapse. How did it collapse with these silent explosions so beloved by AE911truth and followers? |
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06-04-2012, 01:22 AM
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#19 |
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Banned
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Posts: 725
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C'mon - just one loud "bang" at the time of collapse.
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06-04-2012, 01:26 AM
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#20 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,985
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Quote:
Also, I haven't said that WTC7 was destroyed with explosives. It is impossible to prove this. Furthermore, I'm not a 'truther', whatever is meant by that. I am merely interested in the blatant inaccuracies of the NIST report, and why people blindly accept it even though it is full of monumental inaccuracies, is completely hypothetical, and states that conditions exist in the buildings, particularly WTC7, that it can be easily observed they do not.
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You can read my recent articles here: http://www.activistpost.com/2012/04/...e-writing.html http://wideshut.co.uk/australian-gre...al-governance/ http://wideshut.co.uk/most-britons-g...istence-level/ You can listen to all of my radio programmes here. Last edited by wake_up_bomb; 06-04-2012 at 01:28 AM. |
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