2001: The Shining / Analyses of Kubrick's Films - Page 29

dr steam · 20-04-2012, 11:10 AM

All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy

All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy........?

"All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy" is a proverb. It means that without time off from work, a person becomes both bored and boring."

Though the spirit of the proverb had been expressed previously, the modern saying appeared first in James Howell's Proverbs in English, Italian, French and Spanish (1659),and was included in later collections of proverbs. It also appears in Howell's Paroimiographia (1659)
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy,
All play and no work makes Jack a mere toy.

All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Maybe there could be one more layer from the good Kubrick .In that simple sentence "All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy"

Jack the Ripper-Jack The Caretaker

There are many theories about Jack the Ripper's identity and motive,and as I have no intentions making a subject here .I would just note that the expression 'became an archetype, and disappeared without trace, like Jack The Caretaker originally following Kubrick should have been.The intention was that the writing on the wall should ignite racial hatred, just like Charles Manson's Tate murders should ,besides the ritual value of course...There is also the mental-ill Jack D Ripper From Strangelove...
http://movieclips.com/YW8C-dr-strang...s-motivations/

"Dear Boss.1888 25 september
I keep on hearing the police have caught me,but they won't fix me just yet. I have laughed when they looked so clever and talked about being on the right track.that joke about leather apron gave me real fits,I'm down on whores and i shan't quit ripping them till I do get buckled.Grand job the last one was I gave the lady no time to squeal again how can they catch me now,I love my work and want to start again.You will soon hear of me and my funny little games,I saved some of the proper red stuff in a ginger beer bottle over the last job to write with but it went thick like glue and I can't use it,red ink is fit enough I hope HA HA"

"The next job i do i shall clip the lady's ears off and send it to the police officers just for jolly wouldn't you,
keep this letter back till I do abit more work then give it out straight,
my knife's so nice and sharp I want to get to work right away if I get a chance. Good luck
Yours Truly
Jack The Ripper
Don't mind me giving the trade name wasn't good enough to post this before I got all of the red ink off my hands.curse it no luck yet they say I'm a doctor now HA HA"

"I was not kidding dear old Boss,when I gave you the tip you'll hear about saucy jacky's work tomorrow,double event this time number one squealed abit couldn't finish straight off,had not got time to get ears off for police,Thanks for keeping last letter back till i got to work again.
Jack The Ripper"

The expression and nature of the Ripper letters reminds me of "All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy" indicating a bloodthirsty mad Entity/spirit who just are looking forward to the next time he goes to real work as we all know what means, and the games he plays with the police in not getting caught

1888-1921 = 33...

All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy

1977 · 20-04-2012, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mata

foamy bed to sleep in [...]

I definitely realized, so hopelessly late in the day, how much she looked-had always looked-like Botticelli's russet Venus-the same soft nose, the same blurred beauty. (Nabokov)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mata

because I could go over and really take a swipe at him for not giving you a lovely, comfortable, sleepy, 'movie-star' bed. You know what I mean - I mean, you know, what? Has he got you on the floor or something?". Humbert tries to resist the porter's entry to Room 242 with The Cot, which is folded, like a book of The Law (that they're surrounded by 'Police' raised that association for me). Lolita awakens: "Hello, The Cot came, hmm, well - good night". Humbert lays down, in The Cot / The Law (?) which descends to the floor, with a thud. The End. I can see I'm going to have to watch this many more times than once! Have any of you guys worked out what happens between the Hotel and the Mansion? I wonder if there's a description of events encoded in Quilty's dialogue through-out the film? Surely he's not as cryptic as he is for nothing? but I've no idea how that could be plotted out even if it is the case. Yellow chair? escape from the 'movie-myth'? Humbert in 'real life'? Static bystander whilst an execution takes place? of Lolita? Back to Humbert entering the Mansion, at the top of the Stairs to his right, a throne - or chair - covered by a white sheet. The print of the wallpaper behind it aligned to create the impression of a stylised Baphomet 'head'?

The Law association is a good one--Quilty is, essentially, the mask of the Father who will enforce the Law (that is, his Karmic debt--"my dear Mr. Humbert, you were not an ideal stepfather") and dash James the Mason's attempt to unite himself with the Shekinah. The Law is delivered by the black porter; Osiris is a black god. This duplicates the scene where Charlotte finds his secret diary.

"Throne": Quilty as the Rex Nemorensis (Roman priest of the goddess Diana--"Roman ping-pong"):

Rex Nemorensis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Rex Nemorensis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

quilty - YouTube

Quote:

Those trees in whose dim shadow
The ghastly priest doth reign
The priest who slew the slayer,
And shall himself be slain.

This is, in a nutshell, the surviving legend of the rex Nemorensis: the priesthood of Diana at Nemi was held by a person who obtained that honour by slaying the prior incumbent in a trial by combat, and who could remain at the post only so long as he successfully defended his position against all challengers.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/oto/418/aetyr6.htm

Quote:

Behold, I stand ever before the Eternal One in the sign of the Enterer13. And by virtue of my speech is he wrapped about in silence, and he is wrapped in mystery by me, who am the Unveiler of the Mysteries. And although I be truth, yet do they call me rightly the God of Lies, for speech is two-fold, and truth is one14. Yet I stand at the centre of the spider's web, whereof the golden filaments reach to infinity15.

But thou that art with me in the spirit-vision art not with me by right of Attainment, and thou canst not stay in this place to behold how I run and return, and who are the flies that are caught in my web. For I am the inmost guardian that is immediately before the shrine.

None shall pass by me except he slay me16, and this is his curse, that, having slain me, he must take my office and become the maker of Illusions, the great deceiver, the setter of snares17; he who baffleth even them that have understanding. For I stand on every path, and turn them aside from the truth by my words, and by my magick arts.

And this is the horror18 that was shown by the lake that was nigh unto the City of the Seven Hills19, and this is the Mystery of the great prophets that have come unto mankind. Moses, and Buddha, and Lao Tan, and Krishna, and Jesus20, and Osiris, and Mohammed; for all these attained unto the grade of Magus, and therefore were they bound with the curse of Thoth. But, being guardians of the truth, they have taught nothing but falsehood, except unto such as understood; for the truth may not pass the Gate of the Abyss21.

But the reflection of the truth hath been shown in the lower Sephiroth. And its balance is in Beauty, and therefore have they who sought only beauty come nearest to the truth.

You will see that this scenario explains a great deal of Kubrick's work, as they all (?) involve the protagonist in some way setting himself up against the maker of illusions and becoming the new King.

And Lolita is quite explicitly Diana:

Being much occupied at the time with
my own literary labors, I did not bother to read the complete text of The
Enchanted Hunters, the playlet in which Dolores Haze was assigned the
part of a farmer's daughter who imagines herself to be a woodland witch, or
Diana, or something, and who, having got hold of a book on hypnotism,
plunges a number of lost hunters into various entertaining trances before
falling in her turn under the spell of a vagabond poet (Mona Dahl). . . .

The red-capped, uniformly attired hunters, of which one was a banker,
another a plumber, a third a policeman, a fourth an undertaker, a fifth an
underwriter, a sixth an escaped convict (you see the possibilities!), went
through a complete change of mind in Dolly's Dell, and remembered their real
lives only as dreams or nightmares from which little Diana had aroused them;
but a seventh Hunter (in a green cap, the fool) was a Young Poet, and
he insisted, much to Diana's annoyance, that she and the entertainment
provided (dancing nymphs, and elves, and monsters) were his, the Poet's,
invention. I understand that finally, in utter disgust at his cocksureness,
barefooted Dolores was to lead check-trousered Mona to the paternal farm
behind the Perilous Forest to prove to the braggart she was not a poet's
fancy, but a rustic, down-to-brown-earth lass-and a last-minute kiss was to
enforce the play's profound message, namely, that mirage and reality merge
in love. (Nabokov)

"Cot": The hotel is also called Enchanted Hunters--Humbert the hunter has been "caught"?

"Movie star bed": Diana as Goddess of the Holy Wood (Hollywood) . . . all of the implications here still aren't clear to me. The poet is Quilty, but it is also Humbert; they both attempt to control Lolita and cast her in a "role" that they wish her to play.

An "escaped convict" undergoes initiation in "Dolly's Dell"--runaway slaves challenged the King of the Wood in the Grove of Aricia.

sugarray · 20-04-2012, 07:57 PM

This is my interpretation of the final picture in the shining and how it corresponds to 2001. Probably a load of shit but since i've enjoyed this thread so much i didn't want to keep quiet any more

size_of_light · 20-04-2012, 08:18 PM

I like the way you've arranged that so Jack's white shirt forms a blade above the monolith.

The blade Wendy and Danny share during the movie. The blade Wendy is never without while Jack is running amok. The blade the starchild slithers down to nestle in Jack's stomach at the end of the overlaid film:

s7r31f · 20-04-2012, 11:17 PM

Make sure you listen to all the Jay Weidner podcast interviews...I think red ice radio and jungle apocalypse interviewed him from memory. They are absolutely awesome, he is the director of "Kubrick's Odyssey" btw

mr_i_disagree · 21-04-2012, 12:58 AM

sorry but kubrick co wrote 2010 with arthur c. clarke, the sequel to 2001, which was not that good, hence no studio picked it up.
buy the book you lazy bastard.
the shining was by stephen king by the way, watch maximum overdrive

mata · 21-04-2012, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1977

An "escaped convict" undergoes initiation in "Dolly's Dell"--runaway slaves challenged the King of the Wood in the Grove of Aricia.

Humbert approaches the Mansion, through a foggy 'grove'.

Lolita by Stanley Kubrick - ping pong scene - YouTube

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1977

The next sphere reached by the aspirant is named Beauty, numbered 6, and referred to the heart, to the Sun, and to Gold. Here he is called an "Adept". The secret Truth in this place is that God is Man, symbolized by the Hexagram, (in which two triangles are interlaced). In the last sphere he learnt that his Body was the Temple of the Rosy Cross, that is, that it was given him as a place wherein to perform the Magical Work of uniting the oppositions in his Nature. Here he is taught that his Heart is the Centre of Light. It is not dark, mysterious, hollow, obscure even to himself, but his soul is to dwell there, radiating Light on the six spheres which surround it; these represent the various powers of his mind. This Book now appears to him as Gold; it is the perfect metal, the symbol of the Sun itself. He sees God everywhere therein. To this sphere hath the aspirant come by the Path called Temperance, shot as an arrow from a Rainbow. He hath beheld the Light, but only in division. Nor had he won to this sphere except by Temperance, under which name we mask the art of pouring freely forth the whole of our Life, to the last spilth of our blood, yet losing never the least drop thereof. (Crowley)

The Path called Temperance:

feet scenes - Lolita (1962) - YouTube

Lolita's Shoe.jpg

The 'confrontation' between Humbert and Quilty takes place in the Foyer of the Mansion. Foyer: 'a repose area for spectators and place of venues, especially used before performance and during 'intermissions''.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1977

frame within the frame

'but also as a place of celebrations or festivities after performance'.

A massive Party has taken place the night before. A 'Cast Party'. James Baxter in 'making of The Shining": "We're invited to think that in a way it is a Party that is always going on, that it always has gone on". A Party could be considered an 'intermission' from daily life, in a way. Could it be that with Humbert's entry to the Mansion, we ourselves, as the audience, are entering a frame within a frame? A kind of disembodied 'intermission' - between the beginning of the story of Lolita and the End of it? Perhaps we are also entering 'a frame within a frame' in the context of Partys from Kubrick's larger body of work? The Party at the Overlook (Midnight and the Stars and You). The Ziegler's Christmas Party, the highly 'stylized' Party at Somerton and of course The Summer Dance? What if there never was any footage cut from the Somerton Party? What if Kubrick released to the public the idea that he was frustrated about a Scene having been 'cut' - only in order to allude to the fact that there is something about the Party that we are 'not seeing'? Perhaps his last professional Act was to draw his Audience's attention to what we are 'not seeing' in all of his cinematic Party's? Anyway, for now I'll just get back to the happenings in the Foyer of Quilty's Mansion.

The Room is itself is a Hexagram.

Hexagram.png

Hexagram2.jpg

Hexagon.png

"A magic hexagram is a hexagram partitioned into triangles such that the sums of numbers in the six directions illustrated above sum to the same number".

http://mathworld.wolfram.com/MagicHexagram.html

The six spheres, the first five of which are here in the shot - in the 'persons' of five statues.

five statues.jpg

1977 · 21-04-2012, 02:56 AM

"Old Europe debauching young America"

(3 pillars, 3 degrees)

"There he stands without our portals, on the threshold of his new Masonic life, in darkness, helplessness and ignorance. Having been wandering amid the errors and covered over with the pollutions of the outer and profane world, he comes inquiringly to our door, seeking the new birth, and asking a withdrawal of the veil which conceals divine truth from his uninitiated sight." --Albert G. Mackey, Masonic Ritualist, p22-23

"You have entered a new world. Symbolically and spiritually you have been reborn. This started the moment you were prepared to become a Mason... The lodge becomes a symbol of the new world to which you have been reborn... You learn that your entrance is not a mere opening of a door. It is accomplished by forms, ceremonies, actions and words designed to impress upon you mind wise and serious truths. You know that this is not a frivolous event, but one of spiritual impressiveness." --Allen E. Roberts, The Craft and Its symbols, p3, 14-15

'A STAR IS BORN' JUDY GARLAND, 'IT'S A NEW WORLD'. A CLOSEUP. - YouTube

James Mason brings Dorothy to a New World

Lolita Deleted Scene 7 Of 8 (1997) - YouTube

(And important scene from the book that explores the "party" theme)

Down the Rabbit Hole - YouTube

Alice: "What a peculiar place to have a party."

In the opening of A Clockwork Orange we see a gang of hoodlums attempting to rape a girl on a theater stage--more fallen starlets trapped within Quilty's "play"?

Quilty and Jack are both the "writers" of the "play"; they control the "party".

Give these links a once-through:

http://youtubedoubler.com/3QFu

"An understanding between two friends . . ."

The writer (= crazy Jack Torrance) was 'put away' where he can do no more harm. Alex rejoins society (and even collaborates with its overseers), but a part of him is still "in the clouds"--he is divided between the spiritual life and the material life.

http://youtubedoubler.com/3nLx

"Man isn't a noble savage, he's an ignoble savage. He is irrational, brutal, weak, silly, unable to be objective about anything where his own interests are involved—that about sums it up. I'm interested in the brutal and violent nature of man because it's a true picture of him. And any attempt to create social institutions on a false view of the nature of man is probably doomed to failure."

mata · 21-04-2012, 03:01 AM

As Humbert makes his way across the room, the sixth statue appears - as he 'makes his descent' into the antechamber, or the 'side-room'.

Quote:

"In some cases, an antechamber provides a space for a host to prepare or conduct private business away from a larger party or congregation".

Quote:

"But thou that art with me in the spirit-vision, art not with me by right of Attainment, and thou canst not stay in this place to behold how I run and return, and who are the flies that are caught in my web. For I am the inmost guardian that is immediately before the shrine".

As the sixth statue reveals itself, we the audience discover an 'inroad', a vista 'into' the mirror, beyond the Veil of the Play Act.

sixth statue.jpg

mirror painting.jpg

As Humbert passes behind the mirror - a painting of two seated women, Lolita and her Mother is revealed. Notably, hovering between 'us' and 'them', is the 'cue' - in the form of a 'mayonnaise' sandwich, impaled on the centurion's 'Hasta' (roman lance). In line with the painting of Mother and Daughter - is a 'real' painting, mounted on the wall (as opposed to reflected in the mirror) in which appears a 'suitor', Humbert as the initiate. This painting of the 'suitor' is even in the same scale as the painting of the Mother & Daughter. In the meantime, Humbert has 'ascended' back into view of the audience again - by way of his passage past The Playwright. The whole 'reveal' - sealed by a refrain from the Harp. "And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps." Revelation 14:2. Here below, in the clip, we see the 'reveal' between aprox 0:50 and 1:00.

Lolita by Stanley Kubrick - ping pong scene - YouTube

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1977

"Throne": Quilty as the Rex Nemorensis (Roman priest of the goddess Diana--"Roman ping-pong"):

Rex Nemorensis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:

"Behold, I stand ever before the Eternal One in the sign of the Enterer13. And by virtue of my speech is he wrapped about in silence, and he is wrapped in mystery by me, who am the Unveiler of the Mysteries. And although I be truth, yet do they call me rightly the God of Lies, for speech is two-fold, and truth is one14. Yet I stand at the centre of the spider's web, whereof the golden filaments reach to infinity15".

Humbert: "Are you Quilty?".

Quilty: "No I'm Spartacus. You come to free the slaves or something?"

At this point I want to return to the lance of the centurion, for it is, in itself, a 'second reveal', apart from it's function as a 'cue' for the first. [wiki-link associations begin]: Hasta were carried by the early Roman Legionaries, they were not thrown but used for thrusting - and so are symbolically associated with the phallus. (The lancing of the veil?). 'Hasta': in Sanskrit is the thirteenth Nakshatra of Hindu Astrology. Nakhastra, in turn - are the Lunar Mansions. The starting point for the Nakshatras is the point on the ecliptic directly opposite to the star Spica, called Chitrā in Sanskrit.

Quote:

Lunar Mansion: Quilty - "This house is roomy and cool(?), you can see how cool it is"

Quote:

Spica (α Vir, α Virginis, Alpha Virginis) is the brightest star in the constellation Virgo […]Spica is believed to be the star that provided Hipparchus with the data which enabled him to discover precession of the equinoxes. A temple to Menat (an early Hathor) at Thebes was oriented with reference to Spica. […] The name Spica derives from Latin spīca virginis "Virgo's ear of grain". Medieval names include Azimech, from Arabic, 'the Undefended', and Alarph, Arabic for 'the Grape Gatherer'. […] In his Three Books of occult Philosophy, Cornelius Agrippa attributes its Kabbalistic symbol to Hermes Trismegistus.

(Type A Kodachrome?)

Quote:

"Both Thoth and Hermes were gods of writing and of magic in their respective cultures […] both gods were psychopomps; guiding souls to the afterlife. The origin of the description Trismegistus or "thrice great" is unclear".

Quote:

Humbert: "Cross my heart and hope to die. Cross my heart and hope to die. Cross my heart and hope to die"?

Could there be something in this? Hermes as 'Messenger'; then Hermes Trismegistus as Humbert - Quilty - [ & *someone else]. Could the third party be Kubrick himself?

Quote:

"But the reflection of the truth hath been shown in the lower Sephiroth. And its balance is in Beauty, and therefore have they who sought only beauty come nearest to the truth".

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1977

The next sphere reached by the aspirant is named Beauty, numbered 6, and referred to the heart, to the Sun, and to Gold. Here he is called an "Adept". The secret Truth in this place is that God is Man, symbolized by the Hexagram, (in which two triangles are interlaced). In the last sphere he learnt that his Body was the Temple of the Rosy Cross, that is, that it was given him as a place wherein to perform the Magical Work of uniting the oppositions in his Nature. Here he is taught that his Heart is the Centre of Light. It is not dark, mysterious, hollow, obscure even to himself, but his soul is to dwell there, radiating Light on the six spheres which surround it; these represent the various powers of his mind. This Book now appears to him as Gold; it is the perfect metal, the symbol of the Sun itself. He sees God everywhere therein. To this sphere hath the aspirant come by the Path called Temperance, shot as an arrow from a Rainbow. He hath beheld the Light, but only in division. Nor had he won to this sphere except by Temperance, under which name we mask the art of pouring freely forth the whole of our Life, to the last spilth of our blood, yet losing never the least drop thereof. (Crowley)

Quilty, at the Summer Dance "Lolita, that's right, Lolita - diminutive of Dolores, the Tears and the Roses".

Back to Humbert entering the Mansion, at the top of the Stairs to his right, a throne - or chair - covered by a white sheet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1977

This Book now appears to him as Gold; it is the perfect metal, the symbol of the Sun itself

Quilty: "You know coz not many people know that the, that the chair is painted yellow. You'd be the only guy in the know".

Quote:

"But the reflection of the truth hath been shown in the lower Sephiroth. And its balance is in Beauty, and therefore have they who sought only beauty come nearest to the truth".

Tree of The Sephiroth.jpg

Quilty: "Lolita? yeh, yeh, i remember that name all right. Maybe she made some telephone calls? Who cares?".

Telephone calls? Connections between the nodes of the Sephiroth? Quilty saying 'who cares' belies the fact that it may be the thing he cares about most of all. Below is the image of the Foyer, before Humbert arrives. We, as the audience are led into it by way of a brief but perceptible superimposed cut of Humbert approaching the front door from the exterior. Both Humbert and ourselves, as the audience members, 'cross the threshold together'. An action accompanied by a refrain from a Harp, pairing with the one we hear/d after his 'descent' into or through the antechamber, sideroom, mirror. Could this refrain in fact be the beginning of the full 'reveal'? Here in the still, we see the painting, of a Great Beauty, it is the very same one which appears later at the Top of the Stairs.

same painting.jpg

Here, once it is at the Top of the Stairs and Humbert is dragging himself to hide behind it, a Lion's Head is at the foot of the Great Beauty, a menacing taxidermic Guardian that squarely faces us, the audience. Guardian of the revelation/ mystery?

Lion's Head.jpg

Another 'threshold' which Humbert passes through in the film (aside from his entry to the Mansion) is the Toll way-station (interstate?), which is where we see the Cott Beverage truck, which Humbert is to an extent 'following' behind. A reference to Champagne? An elixir associated with being 'bedded'? Following the 'bottles' back to the Source?…. We arrive eventually at the scene of Quilty's Party. All the guests have left. Perhaps we, as the audience, now replace the guests of the party? Perhaps we are now in the privileged position of having been invited to understand the core meaning of the Party milieu itself?

p.s. 1997, am getting so much out of your insights, am so glad you're here and sharing them with us all! It's actually bloody Genius!! You're really helping me get my head around some of the dots! Well, I might be out of step with some of it - but hopefully there's something in here that makes some sense

mata · 21-04-2012, 03:12 AM

Bride Queen:

Bride Queen.jpg

mata · 21-04-2012, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1331

Penis of Osiris:

As above so below:

Lancing the Veil?

mata · 21-04-2012, 05:15 AM

David Hockney's Secret Knowledge (part 1/8) - YouTube

David Hockney's Secret Knowledge (part 2/8) - YouTube

size_of_light, in Part 2 Hockney makes numerous mentions of a visual phenomenon he calls "The Shining". What Hockney is talking about here is the (until now) 'secret' development of the new ways to create images, using mirrors, which began in the 1400's, a radical change which involved painting directly onto Projections. It prompted an otherwise inexplicable 'blossoming' of technical competence in Painting. Later incorporating the use of the lense which adjusted 'perspective' and removed the Veiwer/Observer from being in close proximity to the 'picture-plane', suddenly the viewer was shoved further out, isolated from the activity within the picture-plane. This would've had religious & sociological ramifications, bearing in mind that most people couldn't read back then and relied on priests and their 'pictures' for their 'insights' into the apparently divine. It also co-incides with the Renaissance. The Methodologies that Hockney discovered were all guarded & kept hidden, they are not recorded in Art History at all. The Painters were the 'Mages' of the Court and the Church, the commissioned 'myth presenters' & 'directors' of previous centuries. Hockney even draws parallels with Hollywood. The historical, 'technical knowledge' Hockney is revealing here could possibly have been known about by Kubrick (but via secret channels). I just wonder if it could somehow play a part in Kubrick's reason for using the Monolith as a 'portal', 'lense'?

Quote:

"The history of creating glass can be traced back to 3500 BCE in Mesopotamia. The term glass developed in the late Roman Empire".

1977 · 21-04-2012, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mata

p.s. 1997, am getting so much out of your insights, am so glad you're here and sharing them with us all! It's actually bloody Genius!! You're really helping me get my head around some of the dots! Well, I might be out of step with some of it - but hopefully there's something in here that makes some sense

Me, too, I had a lot of unresolved issues with this movie that you guys are helping me work through . . . I was watching the world's lowest-resolution rip so most of these little details went right past me.

Quilty stands in the center of the hexagram; the man behind the movie camera.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mata

Humbert: "Are you Quilty?".

Quilty: "No I'm Spartacus. You come to free the slaves or something?"

Quilty is "Spartacus," a freed Roman slave (Spartacus was Adam Weishaupt's code name); now Humbert comes, as another runaway slave, to overthrow the old King of the Wood.

Julius Caesar - Trailer - YouTube

(James Mason as Brutus in another "play".)

Quilty is the Bad Artist; a drunken and depraved writer of cheap TV melodramas. Lolita is the archetype of artistic perfection (his "Carmen") that Humbert-as-Artist seeks to immortalize. (This theme is treated more explicitly in the book.) Lolita is his Philosopher's Stone, the Great Work. Lolita is a Monolith (movie screen); a visual and temporal cinematic Mystery (Monomyth) that must be comprehended.

Helen Mirren - Age Of Consent - YouTube

(James Mason as the Artist with his jailbait muse--typecasting is a bitch. Helen Mirren is the Queen.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mata

Bride Queen:

Malkuth the Daughter (Lolita) is raised to the throne of the Mother (Charlotte)--the book Lolita is a "rustic, down-to-brown-earth lass," Malkuth (this is the color associated with this sephirot)--Kubrick's blonde Lolita would seem to be Kether itself (thus her "crown"), a spiritual ideal forever just out of reach of poor Humbert. (But Kether is in Malkuth after a certain manner--there is a Shekinah below and above; it's all very confusing.)

"I never found a guy who'd sort of pull a gun on me when he lost a game."

"None shall pass by me except he slay me, and this is his curse, that, having slain me, he must take my office and become the maker of Illusions, the great deceiver, the setter of snares; he who baffleth even them that have understanding."

Humbert wins, but really loses, since this is the nature of the curse.

Lances--piercing the veil, Dave Bowman through the veil of the abyss.

(Eyes Wide Shut as covert Lolita remake? Alice as Lolita, Ziegler as Quilty?)

FULL METAL JACKET - THE VIRGIN MARY SCENE.flv - YouTube

(Dolores?)

mata · 21-04-2012, 07:47 AM

The quote you've provided below somehow oddly pairs up with the Sergeant for me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1977

"None shall pass by me except he slay me, and this is his curse, that, having slain me, he must take my office and become the maker of Illusions, the great deceiver, the setter of snares; he who baffleth even them that have understanding."

FULL METAL JACKET - THE VIRGIN MARY SCENE.flv - YouTube

mata · 21-04-2012, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by size_of_light

It's almost like Torrence is displaying an object of desire - maybe the guy with the arm is indicating he'd prefer for Torrence to keep it secret? In so doing, the guy with the arm would be 'playing politics' (which would fit with his wife's eyes being closed? and her May Queen head-dress?) They also happen to be standing 'under the spot-light' of the the white vertical band above them. He is the only one with 'glasses' on, a reference to him perhaps understanding the function of 'lenses' - as in "spin"? The 'significant other' ['X'] is treating her object/note(?) as something to be protected, sequestered away, 'a deposit'? Her right index finger is pointing to it, almost as if she's demonstrating that the object she holds is the reason she's looking so chuffed. Not sure yet how tranny-lady fits in (but now I just like her anyway!). The woman with the pearls behind Jack is almost positioned as if to be a 'descendant'? The 'line of the arm' of the woman behind ['X'] extends upwards, in line with the origin point of ['X']'s index finger (and the object) - to the Man with the Serious Face, who is linked to Torrence's 'significant other' by a Rain of Coins, in the form of the pattern on the dress of the woman behind ['X']. The Man with the Serious Face is paired with the girl with the pearls. Could he be considered a 'Financial Controller'?

mata · 21-04-2012, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by size_of_light

If the guy with the arm is a politician, it would make sense for the woman posing like a 'good-girl-starlet', left of his wife - to be representing the Hollywood 'propaganda/distraction' Machine. Which takes me back to Tranny Lady (who looks about the same age as the starlet). She doesn't have a 'polished' look, her facial make-up is odd, why would she have a pale body and darker face, when the fashion in those days was most definitely to be china white?. Her hair-do is a 'less slick' approximation of the good-girl-starlet's hair-do. It's as if she doesn't quite belong, less a 'Beautiful Person', more related to the normal life of the 'masses'. Is she "The Face" of the masses? Her torso is aligned with the good-girl-starlet, as if she is mimicking her, and very happy to be doing so, 'to be in company', so to speak. Could she represent the 'Sheeple'?

genemeadow · 21-04-2012, 09:44 AM

I've been trying to watch Kubrick's films but they are such a massive mind-fuck I often wonder if I'd be better off not even bothering. I just cannot get through 2001: it is quite literally the most boring film I've ever seen.

Lolita is a terrific film, and Eyes Wide Shut is certainly entertaining enough, but many of Kubrick's films are just not rewarding to watch as entertainment. That's the beauty of film: they are at least supposed to be entertaining; if they are informative on some level on top of that, then so much the better.

2001 just fails miserably in the most basic of litmus tests: can you stay awake while watching it? For an astonishing number of people, the answer is a resounding 'no.' Count me as one of them.

dude111 · 21-04-2012, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by size_of_light

None of them appear in the movie (as far as I know).

Then what was the point of showing that picture??

I thought one of them looked like Jack torrence (Alot younger of course) or someone else in the movie!

mata · 21-04-2012, 04:40 PM

Just having a play around with some ideas and drawings. The two "lines of sight" of Woman [1] and Woman [2] form the two sides of a pyramid. The body of Woman [2] isn't on the same angle as the Starlet, but her Eyes are if you check her line of vision. The Rain of Coins lady is looking in the same direction as Woman [2]. The Chap behind the Starlet looks rather 'smooth', could his proximity to The 'Sheeple' lady indicate he's Media or Marketing related? Then, just in front of him is The Music Industry Man, in his rightful place to the left of the Starlet.

Party1.jpg

Man with Serious Face.jpg

The Man with The Serious Face & the Rain of Coins lady.

Political Spotlight.jpg

Political Spotlight

Couples.jpg

Pearl Markers.jpg

A different pyramid arrangement. Here there's a small 'leaf' or 'heart' motif inside 3 of the yellow circles. Left bottom one has Pearls around Starlet's neck, maybe they relate somehow to the other girl's pearls?

mata · 21-04-2012, 05:21 PM

Bend The Truth.jpg

Bending The Truth? In this one I'm interested in the dynamic between the the Starlet, the Media(?)Man and the Face Lady. Two Feathers can sometimes be symbolic of Ma'at, Egyptian goddess of Truth. Only, here they have been 'split' and diverted; which matches up pretty alright with my suspicions about the Starlet & Face Lady characters.

Party2.jpg

There are so many different patterns / relationship configurations that can be explored. Here's just a few ideas. There are singles, couples and trios in this one. Turned out to be a single woman and single man at each end of the pyramid base. The alignment of it seems to be working with regards to some of the details.

Two Nations?.jpg

I find this older woman (highlighted here), quite interesting for some reason. I can't quite place her. She might look a fair bit like The Queen Mum? Wondered if she might be symbolic of a Country? The man next to her also perhaps? Bah, there are so many different ways you can look at this stuff.

Girl With Pearls.jpg

20-04-2012, 07:57 PM	#563
sugarray Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 358	This is my interpretation of the final picture in the shining and how it corresponds to 2001. Probably a load of shit but since i've enjoyed this thread so much i didn't want to keep quiet any more __________________ I've just finished reading the dictionary, turns out the zebra did it.

21-04-2012, 03:12 AM	#570
mata Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 942	Bride Queen: Bride Queen.jpg __________________ il buon tempo verra

21-04-2012, 04:40 PM	#579
mata Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 942	Just having a play around with some ideas and drawings. The two "lines of sight" of Woman [1] and Woman [2] form the two sides of a pyramid. The body of Woman [2] isn't on the same angle as the Starlet, but her Eyes are if you check her line of vision. The Rain of Coins lady is looking in the same direction as Woman [2]. The Chap behind the Starlet looks rather 'smooth', could his proximity to The 'Sheeple' lady indicate he's Media or Marketing related? Then, just in front of him is The Music Industry Man, in his rightful place to the left of the Starlet. Party1.jpg Man with Serious Face.jpg The Man with The Serious Face & the Rain of Coins lady. Political Spotlight.jpg Political Spotlight Couples.jpg Pearl Markers.jpg A different pyramid arrangement. Here there's a small 'leaf' or 'heart' motif inside 3 of the yellow circles. Left bottom one has Pearls around Starlet's neck, maybe they relate somehow to the other girl's pearls? __________________ il buon tempo verra Last edited by mata; 21-04-2012 at 05:29 PM.

21-04-2012, 05:21 PM	#580
mata Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 942	Bend The Truth.jpg Bending The Truth? In this one I'm interested in the dynamic between the the Starlet, the Media(?)Man and the Face Lady. Two Feathers can sometimes be symbolic of Ma'at, Egyptian goddess of Truth. Only, here they have been 'split' and diverted; which matches up pretty alright with my suspicions about the Starlet & Face Lady characters. Party2.jpg There are so many different patterns / relationship configurations that can be explored. Here's just a few ideas. There are singles, couples and trios in this one. Turned out to be a single woman and single man at each end of the pyramid base. The alignment of it seems to be working with regards to some of the details. Two Nations?.jpg I find this older woman (highlighted here), quite interesting for some reason. I can't quite place her. She might look a fair bit like The Queen Mum? Wondered if she might be symbolic of a Country? The man next to her also perhaps? Bah, there are so many different ways you can look at this stuff. Girl With Pearls.jpg __________________ il buon tempo verra Last edited by mata; 21-04-2012 at 05:36 PM.

20-04-2012, 08:18 PM	#564
size_of_light Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 16,319	I like the way you've arranged that so Jack's white shirt forms a blade above the monolith. The blade Wendy and Danny share during the movie. The blade Wendy is never without while Jack is running amok. The blade the starchild slithers down to nestle in Jack's stomach at the end of the overlaid film:

20-04-2012, 11:17 PM	#565
s7r31f Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 54	Make sure you listen to all the Jay Weidner podcast interviews...I think red ice radio and jungle apocalypse interviewed him from memory. They are absolutely awesome, he is the director of "Kubrick's Odyssey" btw

21-04-2012, 12:58 AM	#566
mr_i_disagree Banned Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 447	sorry but kubrick co wrote 2010 with arthur c. clarke, the sequel to 2001, which was not that good, hence no studio picked it up. buy the book you lazy bastard. the shining was by stephen king by the way, watch maximum overdrive

21-04-2012, 09:44 AM	#577
genemeadow Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 270	I've been trying to watch Kubrick's films but they are such a massive mind-fuck I often wonder if I'd be better off not even bothering. I just cannot get through 2001: it is quite literally the most boring film I've ever seen. Lolita is a terrific film, and Eyes Wide Shut is certainly entertaining enough, but many of Kubrick's films are just not rewarding to watch as entertainment. That's the beauty of film: they are at least supposed to be entertaining; if they are informative on some level on top of that, then so much the better. 2001 just fails miserably in the most basic of litmus tests: can you stay awake while watching it? For an astonishing number of people, the answer is a resounding 'no.' Count me as one of them.