crossbow vs longbow

[broadsword]

to take out something bout size of a deer at 150yds
could you fire a longbow kneeling or laid down ?

[knightofthegrail]

A longbow has better range, but takes far more skill to shoot (you dont "fire" a bow, that is what you do with guns, cannons and staff ). The crossbow is much easier to learn to use, but is noisier, more cumbersome with a shorter range.

I've used both and much prefer my bow (recurved mongolian bow).

[stickwhistler]

A deer at 150 yards needs a rifle.

A longbow cannot be shot kneeling down, unless it is a very low draw weight e.g. 25lb , and then it would be at an angle, so inaccurate.

A crossbow is easier to learn e.g. 30 minutes instead of several weeks for a bow.

The longest distance an arrow was ever shot was from a crossbow by the late Henry Drake in 1988 at 2,047 yards. (1 mile 287 yards).


If you are hunting there is a trade off re distance and effective kill and noise.

The exomax crossbow is the fastest current recurve crossbow,
shooting at 350 feet per second (225 lb draw weight).

The speed of sound at sea level is 1,126 feet per second.

A deer will hear a bowstring (called jumping the string) and move.
Therefore if you want to shoot anything, you have to get
the range right or the target will not be there when the arrow arrives.

At 150 yards the deer will have heard the bow shoot, and move, well before the arrow could possibly arrive (at 350 fps).

On the other hand if your range was 40 yards, the arrow would arrive in
0.11 second. A deers reaction time is 0.15 second.

A longbow arrow travels at ..... depends of the draw weight of the bow and travel of string i.e. 28 inch draw .... 30 inch draw etc.
If we generously say 200 fps, then your range to kill a deer would be
approx 20 yards without the deer hearing the bow shoot.

You need to do a bit of research before thinking about shooting deer,
especially at 150 yards, even with a large bore rifle!

I have shot recurve at national level (60 points behind Nat. Champ = 4th overall).
Club champion (8 years ago) of a one of the largest clubs in the UK.
I shoot a Mongolian recurve (Grozier bow) at 70 lbs,
and have several crossbows, of which the latest is an Excalibur Exomax.
I also make all my own arrows and strings.
Before they were stolen for a pittance by HMG, I used to shoot small bore
and hand gun at a club - but that was early 1980's. Now S410 Classic Air Arms .22.

[knightofthegrail]

Originally Posted by stickwhistler

A deer at 150 yards needs a rifle.

Lol, ooops, yes I missed the mention of range although in my defence it was half past six this morning. Shooting a deer with a bow at 150 yards is fasttrack to a lot of hunger.

Tangent: I too shoot a grozer recurve but only 50lbs.

[jonas parker]

Broadsword, your avatar is extremely offensive to those of us whose fathers fought (and sometimes died) to keep our countries free.

[rydeon]

Originally Posted by broadsword

to take out something bout size of a deer at 150yds
could you fire a longbow kneeling or laid down ?

Yes, if you could actually hit it and it doesn't move.
Deer tend to notice arrows from long distance though from what the hunters in the US have told me.
So realistically it's very unlikely.
Kneeling yes, lying down would be impossible.
Crossbows are easy to learn for beginners but lack power unless you use a compound crossbow (not suitable for survival situations)

[stickwhistler]

Originally Posted by rydeon

Crossbows are easy to learn for beginners but lack power unless you use a compound crossbow (not suitable for survival situations)

Compound crossbows have no more power than recurve crossbows.

They are easier to draw and cock, but the trade off is that they are more susceptible to going wrong, and need servicing with e.g. a bow press.
Drop a compound and it's probably going to need 'adjusting'.
Dry-fire a compound and it disintegrates!

Pop along to http://www.excaliburcrossbow.com/php...wforum.php?f=1 and look at the crossbows there,
and the forum is available to put your compound arguments.

I've been shooting bows of all sorts for over 40 years, and got the trophies etc .
In a survival situation, the compound wouldn't last as long as a recurve.
The cams (wheels at the ends) are not ever-lasting.
The compounds cannot be re-strung in the field i.e.
a string breaks and you have to have a bow press in your car or go home early.
A recurve can be unstrung, or have the string replaced in seconds,
even my 225 lb draw Exomax can be restrung in less than 30 seconds without even a cocking aid - try that with a compound!
A Flemish braid string can be made in about 10 minutes without anything
except the string - lets see that done for a compound bow!

Compounds look tacti-cool, but the only advantage is that they are narrower in prod width, so easier to move through e.g. trees.
They might be quieter too, but if the prey doesn't hear the bow,
because it is in range ( see above post ), it won't matter, and string noise dampers are easy to fit anyway.
Also .....
You can make your own recurve crossbow fairly easily.
http://thearbalistguild.forumotion.com/
Making a compound isn't so straight forward.

Pays yer money - takes yer choice. I made mine, and it's a recurve.

[rydeon]

Originally Posted by stickwhistler

Compound crossbows have no more power than recurve crossbows.

They are easier to draw and cock, but the trade off is that they are more susceptible to going wrong, and need servicing with e.g. a bow press.
Drop a compound and it's probably going to need 'adjusting'.
Dry-fire a compound and it disintegrates!

Pop along to http://www.excaliburcrossbow.com/php...wforum.php?f=1 and look at the crossbows there,
and the forum is available to put your compound arguments.

I've been shooting bows of all sorts for over 40 years, and got the trophies etc .
In a survival situation, the compound wouldn't last as long as a recurve.
The cams (wheels at the ends) are not ever-lasting.
The compounds cannot be re-strung in the field i.e.
a string breaks and you have to have a bow press in your car or go home early.
A recurve can be unstrung, or have the string replaced in seconds,
even my 225 lb draw Exomax can be restrung in less than 30 seconds without even a cocking aid - try that with a compound!
A Flemish braid string can be made in about 10 minutes without anything
except the string - lets see that done for a compound bow!

Compounds look tacti-cool, but the only advantage is that they are narrower in prod width, so easier to move through e.g. trees.
They might be quieter too, but if the prey doesn't hear the bow,
because it is in range ( see above post ), it won't matter, and string noise dampers are easy to fit anyway.
Also .....
You can make your own recurve crossbow fairly easily.
http://thearbalistguild.forumotion.com/
Making a compound isn't so straight forward.

Pays yer money - takes yer choice. I made mine, and it's a recurve.

That's what I meant, most recurve crossbows that can match a longbow are impossible to cock, hence they need aids via the compound design etc.

The only other way is if someone makes a replica windlass crossbow which has a scary (300 lb) draw-weight behind it. These are the steel prod ones. So far I don't think they are for sale.
They'd be the ones normally used to garrison forts, city walls etc.

[apollo_gnomon]

Originally Posted by jonas parker

Broadsword, your avatar is extremely offensive to those of us whose fathers fought (and sometimes died) to keep our countries free.

+1

[rydeon]

Originally Posted by jonas parker

Broadsword, your avatar is extremely offensive to those of us whose fathers fought (and sometimes died) to keep our countries free.

At the end of the day it's still an ancient symbol that predates Christianity.
Are we to mind-control people against what our ancients displayed and worshipped now?
I've seen examples of the swastika found all over Asia and Europe. Even in Israel ironically enough!

So is six years of warfare enough to demonise tens of thousands of years I wonder?

[jonas parker]

Originally Posted by rydeon

At the end of the day it's still an ancient symbol that predates Christianity.
Are we to mind-control people against what our ancients displayed and worshipped now?
I've seen examples of the swastika found all over Asia and Europe. Even in Israel ironically enough!

So is six years of warfare enough to demonise tens of thousands of years I wonder?

The "ancients" of ten thousand years ago, of which you speak, didn't have broadswords like the pin on the avatar. That avatar is a picture of a Hitler Youth athletic award, awarded in the late 1930's - early 1940's, hardly "ancient". Considering the deaths of 6,000,000 Jews, and the imprisonment of my wife's uncle in Buchenwald for guiding Jews from one safe house to another (my wife's grandparents hid Jews in the cellar of their farmhouse in Vriesland), I find your defense of the indefensible absurd.

The ultimate masters of mind control were Adolf Hitler and the Nazis. "Google" a few terms like "The Blitz", "The Battle of Stalingrad", and "The Battle of Britain" and you'll find that a hundred thousand years isn't nearly enough time to demonize the Nazi's for what they did to Great Britain, Russia, Poland, Holland, France, and the other countries that they ravaged in six years.

[rydeon]

Originally Posted by jonas parker

The "ancients" of ten thousand years ago, of which you speak, didn't have broadswords like the pin on the avatar. That avatar is a picture of a Hitler Youth athletic award, awarded in the late 1930's - early 1940's, hardly "ancient". Considering the deaths of 6,000,000 Jews, and the imprisonment of my wife's uncle in Buchenwald for guiding Jews from one safe house to another (my wife's grandparents hid Jews in the cellar of their farmhouse in Vriesland), I find your defense of the indefensible absurd.

The ultimate masters of mind control were Adolf Hitler and the Nazis. "Google" a few terms like "The Blitz", "The Battle of Stalingrad", and "The Battle of Britain" and you'll find that a hundred thousand years isn't nearly enough time to demonize the Nazi's for what they did to Great Britain, Russia, Poland, Holland, France, and the other countries that they ravaged in six years.

Now you listen to me Mr Parker, I'm not naive nor foolish enough to be blind on such things so don't take me for an idiot.
However your earlier statement seemed very generalist against the swastika itself, if that was not your intention and it was against that specific, exact configuration then I apologuise.

[jonas parker]

Originally Posted by rydeon

Now you listen to me Mr Parker, I'm not naive nor foolish enough to be blind on such things so don't take me for an idiot.
However your earlier statement seemed very generalist against the swastika itself, if that was not your intention and it was against that specific, exact configuration then I apologuise.

Rydeon, when you have graduated from a good university with a major in military history and a minor in military tactics, served in the military reserve for 20 years, put six children through college (three with masters degrees and one with a doctorate), owned your own successful business, and lived as long as I have, I MAY listen to you. Until you outrank me however, don't presume to give me orders.

You might also learn to spell "apologize"...

[entrangermercenary]

Originally Posted by jonas parker

rydeon, when you have graduated from a good university with a major in military history and a minor in military tactics, served in the military reserve for 20 years, put six children through college (three with masters degrees and one with a doctorate), owned your own successful business, and lived as long as i have, i may listen to you. Until you outrank me however, don't presume to give me orders.

You might also learn to spell "apologize"...

ouch :d

[broadsword]

http://crossbowwarehouse.com/compdetails.php?id=121
i been looking at this one and decided to get it

[chesire]

pit trap with spikes works 24/7 all year round with minimal maintenance , while you are wasting calories droning around for almost non existent game. I wil be doing something else productive like foraging.

PS look up persistence hunting or running game down on foot till it is exhausted make a "team sport " of it. cause frankly the bad people will hunt in packs and the good people should too )

[tom bombadil]

I dont get it. What does it mean, that avitar?

[tom bombadil]

And yours jonas parker, what does your avitar mean or represent?

[broadsword]

Originally Posted by tom bombadil

I dont get it. What does it mean, that avitar?

its a butterfly

[rydeon]

Originally Posted by tom bombadil

I dont get it. What does it mean, that avitar?

Something that rattled cages and induced 'My name is Jonas Parker' into a gimpish rant that I ignored and haven't read, apart from some rambling about an apology.

Ok, for the last time I wasn't talking about the HY Avatar but the friggin' swastika as a symbol.

No apology as I've nothing to apologuise for.
You Mr Jonas ought to apologuise for acting like that of a misguided-fanatic.

Back on topic, get training and learn longbows, it's better in the long-run...