Let's enter unity consciousness

[hierophant]

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

How come the people in India are following Advaita while people in the West are following Jesus Christ? A possible explanation is that BOTH Advaita AND Christianity are mind control schemes for the masses. "There is no individual doer" and "Follow Jesus Christ" may seem very different on the surface but are basically the same mass mind control wolf in different sheep clothing.

And the brainwashing on a deep level also explains that people have so stubborn beliefs that contradict each other! In Christianity to say "I am God" is a blasphemy while in Advaita there is no individual "I" to blame! And also, the inability of both Advaita and Christianity to show actual evidence for their claims is also a sign compatible with mind control 'mass cult' schemes.

i can understand your doubts. organized religion was always serving the purposes of the few. couldn't agree more.

if you go a little deeper and look at the motivation of the founders you will find that they asked the big questions like "who are we?" "why are we here?" "why are people suffering?" this is the beginning point of all spirituality and there's nothing wrong about it! it's the most natural urge for someone who's feeling pain and anger. i have the deepest respect for guys like jesus and buddha.

[hierophant]

...and advaita is addressing these questions, too!

the main points of all eastern nondual traditions are: we are suffering because of our ignorance, our desiring and wanting, the fantasies of our minds, our clinging to all that is impermanent (personal identity included). when you haven't suffered a good deal, you won't end up in these teachings. if everything is all right at the outset, why bother?

[Anders Lindman]

Originally Posted by hierophant

...and advaita is addressing these questions, too!

the main points of all eastern nondual traditions are: we are suffering because of our ignorance, our desiring and wanting, the fantasies of our minds, our clinging to all that is impermanent (personal identity included). when you haven't suffered a good deal, you won't end up in these teachings. if everything is all right at the outset, why bother?

I have a growing suspicious that the human suffering is to a large extent caused by a ruling elite pushing down the masses for thousands of years. David Icke has talked a lot about this. And David has also said that religions are very much a part of that oppression.

So, then, what we should drop is not our personal identities but our social conditioning! It's not about dropping the ego. It's about transforming the ego.

[hierophant]

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

I have a growing suspicious that the It's not about dropping the ego. It's about transforming the ego.

do you sometimes ask yourself questions like „how cool would i be if i were enlightened and attained supernatural powers and could save the world?“

[hierophant]

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

human suffering is to a large extent caused by a ruling elite pushing down the masses for thousands of years. David Icke has talked a lot about this. And David has also said that religions are very much a part of that oppression.

from the absolute standpoint, even this is accepted in the open space that is you, too!

[hierophant]

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

So, then, what we should drop is not our personal identities but our social conditioning!

yep, this would be the best thing to start with.

[hierophant]

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

In Christianity to say "I am God" is a blasphemy while in Advaita there is no individual "I" to blame!

i don't want to convert to you any school in particular but look up the mystical traditions of the world. they are all talking about the same stuff in different terminologies. for me, this is enough proof that there's a universal religion applying to every one of us. it can be summed up in one sentence: find out who you are and you will find god!

[Anders Lindman]

The conflict-ridden social conditioning can be felt inside the body. Having awareness in the body and in the mind at the same time is a powerful healing technique.

Eckhart Tolle may knowingly or unknowingly be teaching a false technique since he says that when the awareness is directed into the body, the mind cannot think. The correct approach I believe is to have awareness in BOTH the body AND in the thinking mind at the same time.

So I will change my practice from the kind of body awareness technique that Eckhart Tolle teaches to a modified version where I have awareness in the body and in the mind and in the sense perceptions at the same time. This can be called inner body awareness practice 2.0.

[hierophant]

french hardcore advaita from the 1940s:

"Consciousness is a being whose existence posits its essence, and inversely it is consciousness of a being, whose essence implies its existence; that is, in which appearance lays claim to being. Being is everywhere...We must understand that this being is no other than the transphenomenal being of phenomena and not a noumenal being which is hidden behind them...It requires simply that the being of that which appears does not exist only in so far as it appears. The transphenomenal being of what exists for consciousness is itself in itself.... Consciousness is the revealed-revelation of existents, and existents appear before consciousness on the foundation of their being...Consciousness can always pass beyond the existent, not toward its being, but toward the meaning of this being. A fundamental characteristic of its transcendence is to transcend the ontic toward the ontological. The meaning of the being of the existent in so far as it reveals itself to consciousness is the phenomenon of being...This elucidation of the meaning of being is valid only for the being of the phenomenon....For being is the being of becoming and due to this fact it is beyond becoming. It is what it is. This means that by itself it can not even be what it is not...It is full positivity. It knows no otherness; it never posits itself as other-than-another-being. It can support no connection with the other. It is itself indefinitely and it exhausts itself in being...Consciousness absolutely can not derive from anything, either from another being, or from a possibility, or from a necessary law. Uncreated, without reason for being, without any connection with another being, being-in-itself is de trop for eternity." (Jean-Paul Sartre)

[hierophant]

sorry, but i have too much leisure time to spend in front of my macbook tonight here's a lovely little story often told by ramana:

"A lady had a precious necklace around her neck. Once in her excitement she forgot it and thought that the necklace was lost. She became anxious and looked for it in her home but could not find it. She asked her friends and neighbours if they knew anything about the necklace. They did not. At last a kind friend told her to feel the necklace round her neck. She found that it had all along been round her neck and she was happy. When others asked her later if she had found the necklace which was lost, she said, ‘Yes, I have found it.’ She still felt that she had recovered a lost jewel.

Now did she lose it at all? It was all along round her neck. But judge her feelings. She was as happy as if she had recovered a lost jewel. Similarly with us, we imagine that we will realise that Self some time, whereas we are never anything but the Self."

[serpentine]

Clarity.....


"If the mind, which is the instrument of knowledge and is the basis of all activity, subsides, the perception of the world as an objective reality ceases. Unless the illusory perception of the serpent in the rope ceases, the rope on which the illusion is formed is not perceived as such. Similarly, unless the illusory nature of the perception of the world as a objective reality ceases, the Vision of the true nature of the Self, on which the illusion is formed, is not obtained.

The mind is a unique power (sakti) in the Atman, whereby thoughts occur to one. On scrutiny as to what remains after eliminating all thoughts, it will be found that there is no such thing as mind apart from thought. So then, thoughts themselves constitute the mind. Nor is there any such thing as the physical world apart from and independent of thought. In deep sleep there are no thoughts: nor is there the world. In the wakeful and dream state thoughts are present, and there is also the world. Just as the spider draws out the thread of the cobweb from within itself and withdraws it again into itself, in the same way the mind projects the world out of itself and absorbs it back into itself.

The world is perceived as an apparent objective reality when the mind is externalized, thereby forsaking its identity with the Self. When the world is thus perceived, the true nature of the Self is not revealed: conversely, when the Self is realized the world ceases to appear as an objective reality."



http://bhagavan-ramana.org/nanyaressay.html

[Anders Lindman]

One way of detecting the bogusness of the nonduality teachers is to notice the lack of inner peace in them. I haven't seen any spiritual teacher who seems to have inner peace. It's easy to sense such things with one's heart.

The entire nonduality circus is a big con scheme!

[Anders Lindman]

Originally Posted by serpentine

Clarity.....


"... unless the illusory nature of the perception of the world as a objective reality ceases, the Vision of the true nature of the Self, on which the illusion is formed, is not obtained."

http://bhagavan-ramana.org/nanyaressay.html

That's not clarity. That's mind control propaganda. Objective reality is a fact. Do you think your bank account is an illusion?

[Anders Lindman]

Originally Posted by hierophant

french hardcore advaita from the 1940s:

"...Consciousness absolutely can not derive from anything, either from another being, or from a possibility, or from a necessary law." (Jean-Paul Sartre)

Oh yes it can! Consciousness is absent in deep dreamless sleep. So there is some more fundamental principle that is responsible for creating consciousness.

[hierophant]

one of my favorite stories from the ramanashramam:

"When Bhagavan was still on the hill, a postcard came in which the sender wrote: "I am a poor elementary school teacher. My mother is old and my salary is so small that I cannot look after her properly. Kindly see that I get a raise." Bhagavan laughed and said: "Well, why not?" Another card came after some time in which he wrote: "By your grace my salary was increased. Now there is a vacancy in a higher grade. If I am given that grade, I shall earn more and make my mother very happy." Bhagavan had a good laugh and said: "Good." Again after some days, another card: "My mother is bedridden and there is nobody to nurse her. If I could get married, my wife would look after her. But I am a poor man. Who will give me his daughter in marriage? And where shall I get the money for expenses? Bhagavan may kindly arrange." Bhagavan laughed and said: "Well, let it be so." After some months another postcard came: "By your kindness I was married quite easily. My wife is already with me. My mother wants a grandchild before she dies. Please provide. "Why not?" said Bhagavan. After some months another card: "My wife gave birth to a child, but she has no milk for it. I cannot afford milk for the baby. Please get me a promotion." Then another card: "I got a promotion and an increment. The child is doing well. I owe everything to your kindness." Bhagavan remarked: "What have I done? It is his good karma that all goes well with him." After some days another card: "Mother died. She worshiped you before her death. "Well," said Bhagavan. After a month, another card: "Swami, my child has died." "Sorry," said Bhagavan. Another month had passed and a card came saying: "My wife is pregnant again." Then another card: "My wife gave birth to a child. Both died." "Ram, Ram,'' said Bhagavan. "Everything seems to be over." Then another card: "Due to family trouble my work was very irregular and I was dismissed. I am completely destitute now.'' Bhagavan said, heaving a deep sigh: "All that came has gone; only his Self remained with him. It is always like this. When all goes, only the Self remains."

what a funny description of the conditio humana!

[hierophant]

advaita ruined my life...


...because it has never been "my" life!

ROFL

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by hierophant

btw, that indian guy recommended me to look more into kashmir shaivism, another nondual tradition which he is affiliated to. does anyone know more about it?

why do you think the nondual tradition is not more popular?

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by hierophant

french hardcore advaita from the 1940s:

"Consciousness is a being whose existence posits its essence, and inversely it is consciousness of a being, whose essence implies its existence; that is, in which appearance lays claim to being. Being is everywhere...We must understand that this being is no other than the transphenomenal being of phenomena and not a noumenal being which is hidden behind them...It requires simply that the being of that which appears does not exist only in so far as it appears. The transphenomenal being of what exists for consciousness is itself in itself.... Consciousness is the revealed-revelation of existents, and existents appear before consciousness on the foundation of their being...Consciousness can always pass beyond the existent, not toward its being, but toward the meaning of this being. A fundamental characteristic of its transcendence is to transcend the ontic toward the ontological. The meaning of the being of the existent in so far as it reveals itself to consciousness is the phenomenon of being...This elucidation of the meaning of being is valid only for the being of the phenomenon....For being is the being of becoming and due to this fact it is beyond becoming. It is what it is. This means that by itself it can not even be what it is not...It is full positivity. It knows no otherness; it never posits itself as other-than-another-being. It can support no connection with the other. It is itself indefinitely and it exhausts itself in being...Consciousness absolutely can not derive from anything, either from another being, or from a possibility, or from a necessary law. Uncreated, without reason for being, without any connection with another being, being-in-itself is de trop for eternity." (Jean-Paul Sartre)

is this in english?

[hierophant]

Originally Posted by lonestar

why do you think the nondual tradition is not more popular?

which one, the advaita or the shivaite? when i hear shiva i'm thinking of tantra. could be interesting. fucking yourself into eternity! lol

[hierophant]

Originally Posted by lonestar

is this in english?

if i'm not mistaken he was a french philosopher. so i think this text might be in french. or italian? or maybe nwo-advaita subliminal messages to make you think you don't exist?