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View Poll Results: Did the Holocaust Happen?
Yes 247 47.14%
No 277 52.86%
Voters: 524. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-03-2013, 06:04 PM   #4401
resistance
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Originally Posted by falconeyes View Post
'resistance', First, he could face maximum 10 years in prison, not 20 as you falsely claim, Second, David Irving says that he changed his views in 1991, which means he did NOT change his views on the day of his trial in early 2006
You must be talking about a different David Irving. I'm not aware of the other one. The one I'm talking about still gives speeches. In fact he toured parts of America only in 2012. And is still banned from a number of countries for so called holocaust denial. On his tour of the United States his Minneapolis speaking event on nov 16th was disrupted and vandalised, by dozens of so called anti-fascists. His books and videos were destroyed at the event. That doesn't sound like somebody who's changed his views to me. It sounds like somebody they're trying to silence. Truth doesn't fear scrutiny, neither does it need laws or voilence to be upheld. Why would parts of history have to be sustained by passing laws to suppress free speech? These thugs that turn up and use violence at speeches to try and silence people have a strange idea of freedom of speech.
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:28 PM   #4402
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Originally Posted by resistance View Post
You must be talking about a different David Irving.
'resistance', do you remember what i asked you in this http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showt...=237140&page=9 thread? You said >>Well, I wasn't saying that you called me a nazi. I meant people in general<<, and then i said to you >>So people in general call you Nazi, huh... Excuse me, but i can't help asking you, are you suffering of paranoid schizophrenia? Do you "hear voices" and do you feel being "Watched"?<<. But now i also have to ask you, are you also suffering of hallucination disease? Do you "see people" who are not supposed to be there?
Quote:
The one I'm talking about still gives speeches. In fact he toured parts of America only in 2012.
In early 2006, David Irving was convicted 3 years in jail, so he should be out from jail long time ago, that's why you noticed he toured parts of America these years.
Quote:
And is still banned from a number of countries for so called holocaust denial.
I don't feel sorry for him. In my opinion he should not be allowed to hold speeches in any country, he should be banned for good.
Quote:
On his tour of the United States his Minneapolis speaking event on nov 16th was disrupted and vandalised, by dozens of so called anti-fascists.
Yeah, it's about time Irving's speaking event finally got disrupted and vandalised, huh. It's no wonder his event got disrupted and vandalised, wouldn't you agree, huh?
Quote:
His books and videos were destroyed at the event.
Good. Let's pour some petrol on his vandalised books and videos and set it on fire

And let me repeat this, http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/4733820.stm
Quote:
He admitted that in 1989 he had denied that Nazi Germany had killed millions of Jews. He said this is what he believed, until he later saw the personal files of Adolf Eichmann, the chief organiser of the Holocaust.

>>I said that then based on my knowledge at the time, but by 1991 when I came across the Eichmann papers, I wasn't saying that anymore and I wouldn't say that now,<< Irving told the court.

>>The Nazis did murder millions of Jews.<<

On Monday, before the trial began, he told reporters: >>I'm NOT a Holocaust denier. Obviously, I've changed my views.<<
And as you can see and hear from the above "Holocaust on trial 2000" David Irving insist that he is NOT a denier of the Holocaust, and he said that back in the year of 2000. So you see, David Irving is convinced that the Nazis murdered millions of Jews...

'resistance', come on, you better kneel down and say these words >>Yes, i 'resistance' finally agree with David Irving that the Nazis did in fact murdered millions of Jews<<

Last edited by falconeyes; 08-03-2013 at 07:07 PM.
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Old 08-03-2013, 06:11 AM   #4403
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Holocaust deniers cant debate falconeye's.

Great post falconeye's,

As the member garyicke said.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showp...6&postcount=81

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Old 08-03-2013, 08:59 AM   #4404
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I find it quite bizarre that, as far as I can ascertain, voting 'no' in this poll is a criminal offence in a number of countries:

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Old 08-03-2013, 09:54 AM   #4405
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Originally Posted by ponzi nemesis View Post
I find it quite bizarre that, as far as I can ascertain, voting 'no' in this poll is a criminal offence in a number of countries:

Laws against Holocaust denial

(English Subs) Sylvia Stolz, a German Lawyer who was jailed for presenting evidence in the defense of her client in the criminal court trial in Germany of so-called holocaust denier Ernst Zundel, tells her story at the AZK (Anti-Censorship-Coalition) Conference in Switzerland, in November 2012. In 2008, she was banned from speaking during the trial, barred from presenting evidence, and criminally charged with contempt of court, and with inciting contempt, and charged under the same section of the German Criminal Code as her client, and subsequently imprisoned for 3 years. She is also barred from practicing law.. After giving this presentation in Switzerland, she is now again facing criminal charges, as is the host and organizer of the AZK, Mr. Ivo Sasek.
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Old 08-03-2013, 10:11 AM   #4406
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Originally Posted by sniper13x View Post
The only thing it accomplishes is temp bans of people who actually contribute to this forum, which is his entire purpose for being here.
Did you just said these socalled Holocaust deniers posting all that bullsh!t that is destroying for debates on this forum actually contribute to this forum??? You say they contribute to this forum??? Really? Let me guess, you're just spreading your pathetic outright lies.

Last edited by falconeyes; 08-03-2013 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 08-03-2013, 10:23 AM   #4407
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Holocaust deniers cant debate falconeye's.

Great post falconeye's,

As the member garyicke said.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showp...6&postcount=81

Thanks 'boots', i'm honored. Also nice to see the words from 'garyicke'
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Old 08-03-2013, 11:21 AM   #4408
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OK I think I've found the video mentioned in the story above:


Taken at face value it would appear that Dr. Franciszek Piper is breaking German law:

Quote:
§ 130 Public Incitement (1985, Revised 1992, 2002, 2005)
(...)
(3) Whoever publicly or in a meeting approves of, denies or belittles an act committed under the rule of National Socialism of the type indicated in Section 6 subsection (1) of the Code of Crimes against International Law, in a manner capable of disturbing the public peace shall be punished with imprisonment for not more than five years or a fine.

§ 6 Genocide

(1) Whoever with the intent of destroying as such, in whole or in part, a national, racial, religious or ethnic group:

kills a member of the group,
causes serious bodily or mental harm to a member of the group, especially of the kind referred to in section 226 of the Criminal Code,
inflicts on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about their physical destruction in whole or in part,
imposes measures intended to prevent births within the group,
forcibly transfers a child of the group to another group, shall be punished with imprisonment for life. (...)[26]
Do you think Dr. Franciszek Piper should be prosecuted, falconeyes?
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Old 08-03-2013, 05:13 PM   #4409
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Originally Posted by ellis_deatrip View Post
[IMG]
(English Subs) Sylvia Stolz, a German Lawyer who was jailed for presenting evidence in the defense of her client in the criminal court trial in Germany of so-called holocaust denier Ernst Zundel, tells her story at the AZK (Anti-Censorship-Coalition) Conference in Switzerland, in November 2012. In 2008, she was banned from speaking during the trial, barred from presenting evidence, and criminally charged with contempt of court, and with inciting contempt, and charged under the same section of the German Criminal Code as her client, and subsequently imprisoned for 3 years. She is also barred from practicing law.. After giving this presentation in Switzerland, she is now again facing criminal charges, as is the host and organizer of the AZK, Mr. Ivo Sasek.
AZK - Sylvia Stolz - Lawyer Who Was Jailed for Presenting Evidence in the Zundel Trial (full) - YouTube
If hearing what Sylvia Stolz has to say in this interview isn't prove enough to somebody that something is very wrong here, then nothing ever will be. The fact she's now facing more charges just for saying it, makes it become even more self evident.

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Last edited by resistance; 08-03-2013 at 05:39 PM.
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Old 08-03-2013, 07:09 PM   #4410
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I agree with the action to ignore - I usually scroll past ( but not always)and get on with reading the content that has the truth , these days any genuine seeker in this realm doesn't have far to go - who , what , how and why this massive indoctrination of hollowco$t propaganda has taken place and rooted in the psyche of the general public, is now very obvious - not so several years back - but now the basics' of the BIG LIE which all humanity is suffering under the result of ,is very evident to anyone willing to see though it.
People are waking up to WHO and WHY. This scares them more than anything else - even if it's only to look at their own tribe with open eyes - not a parrot.

Last edited by shanticat; 08-03-2013 at 11:48 PM. Reason: del quote and part of reply
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Old 08-03-2013, 08:01 PM   #4411
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ellis_deatrip View Post
Spread by LIES!? Over 60 million lice were killed in the making of your movie. Congratulations.

Red Cross Death Count
http://forum.codoh.info/viewtopic.php?t=6811

Deaths In German Concentration Camps
by Arthur R. Butz
http://codoh.com/library/document/1028
The Holocaust Reviewed: Part One
How Many Jews Were Killed?
http://www.cephas-library.com/israel...r%20Vastly.htm
Shrinking Stats:
Deaths in German Prison Camps From 1933 To 1945
http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/Othe...CampDeaths.htm
On The Roads Of Truth: Searching For Warwick Hester
by Klaus Schwensen
http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/a...ick_hester.php
Six Million Swindle
http://ccfiile.com/Six_Million_Swindle.html

The International Red Cross January 16, 1984 Audit Records A Total 282,077 Deaths Of All Internees In All German Camps From All Causes
Esau/Edom, And The Trail Of The Serpent - XII
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/bb981128.htm
Shrinking Stats:
Deaths in German Prison Camps From 1933 To 1945
http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/Othe...CampDeaths.htm
Red Cross Death Count
http://forum.codoh.info/viewtopic.php?t=6811
"As soon as we abandon our own reason,
and are content to rely upon authority,
there is no end to our troubles."
Bertrand Russell


Official International Red Cross Records: Total Camp Deaths: 271,301

http://www.vivamalta.org/index.php?topic=10542.0
International Red Cross Official Records Proves “Holocaust” Was A Fraud
http://www.bashaoorpakistan.com/feat...olocaust-fraud
Official Records From International Red Cross Recently Released Records, Sealed For Years, Show Camp Death Totals Of Only 271,301
http://abundanthope.net/pages/Politi...--Repost.shtml
Official Deaths At Concentration Camps 340,000 Total - Wochenschau 1948
http://archive.org/details/OfficialD...ochenschau1948


A Factual Appraisal Of The 'Holocaust' By The Red Cross
The Jews And The Concentration Camps: No Evidence Of Genocide
(Chapter Nine From The Book - Did Six Million Really Die?)
by Richard Verrall
http://www.polskawalczaca.com/viewto...p?f=36&t=18054

References To 6,000,000 Jews Killed Prior To The Nuremberg Announcement
The First Holocaust
Jewish Fund Raising Campaigns With Holocaust Claims
During And After World War One
by Don Heddesheimer
http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/tfh/index.html
Origin Of Holocaust Propaganda
Excerpts From Historical Revisionism
by Don Heddesheimer
http://www.whale.to/b/holocaust_prop.html
236 References To 6,000,000 Jews Prior To The Nuremberg Trial Announcement
by Winston Smith
http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.b...-prior-to.html
The “Six Million” Myth
by Zander C. Fuerza
http://zioncrimefactory.com/the-six-million-myth
How The Zionists Created The Holocaust - 10 Questions For The Zionists
by Rabbi Michael Dov Weismandl
http://www.nkusa.org/Historical_Docu...nquestions.cfm

There Was Never 6,000,000 Jews Under German Occupation
'The Dissolution Of Eastern European Jewry': An Exchange
W. D. Rubinstein, Walter N. Sanning and Arthur R. Butz
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v05/v05p367_Rubenstein.html
Debunking The Genocide Myth
Chapter Fourteen
Statistics: Six Million Or...
by Paul Rassinier
http://vho.org/aaargh/engl/RassArch/...debunk141.html
Did Six Million Really Die?
Truth At Last - Exposed:
Chapter 3 - Population And Emigration
by Richard Verrall
http://www.zundelsite.org/english/ha...idsix01.html#3
The Mythical Holocaust
by Michael Olteanu, M.S.

Jewish Population From 1938 To 1949

The World Almanac for 1940 gives the world's Jewish population as 15,319,359.
The World Almanac for 1949 puts the number of Jews in the world at 15,713,638.
Even the most favorable numbers for the Jews (probably made up because they don't account for all the emigration of the Jews to the Soviet Union, the United States, Palestine and elsewhere throughout the world) shows the difference between the 1938 and 1948 figures is minus 4,481,491 Jews. This is still a million and a half less than their sacred 6,000,000 death figure. This population figure coupled with the millions of "supposed survivors" shows the ludicrousness of the holocaust fable.
World Almanac Jewish Population Figures Reviewed
by William Karenin
http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/Othe...nt6Million.htm
Did Six Million Really Die?
Truth At Last - Exposed:
Chapters 3, 4 and 5
by Richard Verrall
http://theunjustmedia.com/holocaust/...03%204%205.htm
The 'Holocaust' For Dummies
http://rense.com/general86/hoccl.htm
The Jewish Holohoax
Where Are The Six Million Birth Certificates?
http://wnlibrary.org/Portabel%20Docu...rtificates.pdf
Holocaust Truth
http://abundanthope.net/pages/Politi...UTH_4058.shtml
Holocaust Fraud: Top Ten Reasons
by James Buchanan
http://www.bashaoorpakistan.com/feat...op-ten-reasons
Did Six Million Really Die?
by Dr. Robert Faurisson
http://www.zundelsite.org/english/ds...faurisson.html

German SS And Police Unit Radio Messages In British Archives
http://www.fpp.co.uk/Auschwitz/docs/PoliceDecodes.html
German SS And Police Radio Messages -
No Mass Executions Or Gassings At Camps
German Authorities Gave Orders To Report All Deaths At Camps
http://archive.org/details/GermanSsA...assingsAtCamps
Full Text Of "German SS And Police Radio Messages –
No Mass Executions Or Gassings At Camps"
http://www23.us.archive.org/stream/G...Camps_djvu.txt

Not One German Government Extermination Order Was Ever Found - Not One Letter From A German Soldier About Gas Chambers Or Mass Killings Was Ever Found
David Irving - The Biggest Lie (Start at 1:00:50)

The Missing Hitler Orders
by Colin Cross, Lilliano P. Fargion and Joachim C. Fest, et al.
http://codoh.com/library/document/885
The Plum Cake
by John Weir
http://vho.org/tr/2001/4/tr08plumcake.html
The Revisionist Claim:
Not A Single Document Has Been Found With Hitler's Signature
Ordering The Extermination Of The Jews
http://www.zundelsite.org/english/101/english1015.html
Mark Weber Quotes
http://www.whale.to/b/weber_q.html
Hitler's Extermination Orders

No Gas Chambers Were Ever Found (Except For Those To Delouse)
Not One Plan, Order, Photo, Budget Or Blueprint For Gas Chambers Was Ever Found

Not One Single Autopsied Body At Any Camp Has Been Shown To Have Been Gassed
How Did The Germans Move All Those Supposed Gassed Bodies?
The Gas Chambers: Truth Or Lie?
Questions by Antonio Pitamitz To Robert Faurisson (Storia Illustrata, August 1979)
Translated by Vivian Bird
Expanded, reviewed, and corrected by Dr. Robert Faurisson
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v02/v02p319_Faurisson.html
The Alternative Tour Of Auschwitz An Independent Investigation (Video)
by Dr. Fredrick Toben
The Alternative Tour of Auschwitz An Independent Investigation Video by The Response Crew (hisshadyness)(Caoimhin) - Myspace Video

Camp Propaganda
The Director Of The Holocau$t - Khazar Expatriate Billy Wilder (Video)
http://archive.org/details/TheDirect...ateBillyWilder
'Extermination' Camp Propaganda Myths
by Mark Weber
http://vho.org/GB/Books/dth/fndWeber.html
German Camps Time For Truth
http://www.saveyourheritage.com/nazi...tion_camps.htm
The Holocaust Hoax And Propaganda
http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.c..._holocaust.php
Holocaust Propaganda (Yet Again) Not To Be Trusted
by Kevin Boyle
http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=57469
Die Akte Sobibor - Holocaust - Propaganda und Wirklichkeit
by Juergen Graf, Carlo Mattogno and Thomas Kues
http://archive.org/details/DieAkteSo...ndWirklichkeit
The Facts About the Origin Of The Camps And Their Administration
http://www.wintersonnenwende.com/scr...s/ccfacts.html

The Holocaust Is A Jewish Big Lie:

Birdman's Not-Quite 95 Theses On The Holocaust
by John "Birdman" Bryant
http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/Jews...JewishLie.html

The Leuchter Report, The Rudolf Report And The Lüftl Report
Their Chemical Analysis Proves Gas Was Not Used In The So Called Gas Chambers, And Physically There Was No Way The Air Raid Shelters Could Have Been Used As Gas Chambers
The Rudolf Report (2011 Edition)
Expert Report On Chemical And Technical Aspects
Of The “Gas Chambers” Of Auschwitz
by Germar Rudolf and Wolfgang Lambrecht
http://codoh.com/library/document/1827
Germar Rudolf - Holocaust Revisionist In Exile

A Quarter Century Ago: "The Leuchter Report"
by Germar Rudolf
http://codoh.com/news/2210
The Lüftl Report:
An Austrian Engineer's Report On The 'Gas Chambers' Of Auschwitz And Mauthausen
by Walter Lüftl
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v12/v12p391_Luftl.html

The Lüftl Report:

An Austrian Engineer's Report On The 'Gas Chambers' Of Auschwitz And Mauthausen
by Walter Lüftl
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v12/v12p391_Luftl.html

No Chimneys To Vent Or Holes To Drop In The Supposed Deadly Gas
Air Photo Evidence
In 1944 Allied planes repeatedly bombed the large synthetic rubber and chemical plant 3 miles (5 kilometers) from Auschwitz, but did not bomb Auschwitz camp-buildings or surrounding rail-bridges or rail-lines because British and American military studies, compiled from spy reports and air photos, concluded inmates were not being murdered or abused in the visible camps.
by John C. Ball
http://www.air-photo.org
Ernst Zundel and John Ball re: Schindler's List Part 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_OhrRGWf4s
Ernst Zundel and John Ball re: Schindler's List Part 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBSV0vvv-O8
Ernst Zundel and John Ball re: Schindler's List Part 3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9GJAMJGY2g
John Ball On Auschwitz Aerial Photograph Forgeries
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLMvOtDEfn4

United Nations (UN) population numbers showing fewer added from 1987 to 1999:
1987 -- 87,014,000
1988 -- 86,336,000
1989 -- 84,686,000
1990 -- 82,613,000
1991 -- 80,752,000
1992 -- 79,339,000
1993 -- 78,670,000
1994 -- 78,544,000
1996 -- 75,639,000
1996 -- 74,063,000
1997 -- 72,364,000
1998 -- 70,521,000
1999 -- 68,573,000

thanks ellis - am working through this .
yesterday it was a couple of links from davebun ...( good to see a new knowing face) and thanks to all 'greats' who keep up the good fight here - posting the truth is the most honourable thing , all the in-depth work - appreciated.
I read a lot about the present control tools but understanding the past in many areas but especially this is vital to understanding now and whats' ahead.
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Old 08-03-2013, 08:03 PM   #4412
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Originally Posted by resistance View Post
If hearing what Sylvia Stolz has to say in this interview isn't prove enough to somebody that something is very wrong here, then nothing ever will be. The fact she's now facing more charges just for saying it, makes it become even more self evident.
yes indeed.
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Old 08-03-2013, 11:32 PM   #4413
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Josef Klehr
Josef Klehr (October 17, 1904, Langenau, Upper Silesia – August 23, 1988, Leiferde) was an SS-Oberscharführer, supervisor in several Nazi concentration camps and head of the SS disinfection commando at Auschwitz concentration camp.
Klehr was a member of the Nazi Party and Allgemeine SS as of 1932. He participated in military exercises with the Wehrmacht and received training to become a medic. Shortly before the beginning of the war he was drafted into the Waffen-SS.[2] In August 1939 he was transferred to Buchenwald concentration camp as a guard, then to Dachau concentration camp as a medical orderly a year later.[3] In January, 1941 he was promoted to SS-Unterscharführer and transferred to Auschwitz, working as a medical orderly in the prisoners' infirmary.[2]

While in prison, Klehr was interviewed by journalist and film-maker Ebbo Demant. When Demant brings up Holocaust denial, Klehr says:

“ Jews never gassed? No? Yes, I have already been asked about that. ...Three elderly ladies come to visit us here. That is such an official society. They always want to support us a little bit, to give us a present on our birthdays, and so on, and one of them asked me once if people were gassed in Auschwitz? I said - I will tell you openly and honestly, but if it were someone else, I would have answered that I did not know. But because it is you, I will tell you precisely, that people were gassed. And anyone who maintains that there are no gassing....Yes, I don't understand him, he must be crazy or on the wrong.... When you are three, four years in Auschwitz and experienced everything, then I cannot get myself to lie about it and say that no gassings were ever conducted.[9]
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The white race is the only race that isn't racist.Originally Posted by bendoonall the most intelligent people in history have been racist .

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Old 08-03-2013, 11:36 PM   #4414
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Hans Münch

Hans Wilhelm Münch (14 May 1911 – 2001) was a German citizen and Nazi Party member who, during World War II, worked as a SS physician at the Auschwitz concentration camp in Nazi occupied Poland from 1943 to 1945. He was the only person acquitted of war crimes at the 1947 Auschwitz trials in Kraków. Later on, he returned to Germany and worked as a practising physician in Roßhaupten in Bavaria.
In June 1943, he was recruited as a scientist by the Waffen-SS and was sent to the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen-SS in Raisko, about four km from the main camp at Auschwitz. Münch worked alongside the infamous Josef Mengele, who was the same age and also came from Bavaria. Münch continued the bacteriological research he was known for before the war, as well as making occasional inspections of the camps and the prisoners. In summer 1944, he was promoted to SS-Untersturmführer (second lieutenant).

Along with other doctors, Münch was expected to participate in the "selections" at the ramp of Auschwitz-Birkenau, to decide which of the incoming Jewish men, women and children could work, which would be experimented on, and which would be put to death in the gas chambers.[3] He found this abhorrent and refused to take part; this was confirmed by witnesses' testimony at his trial. The book on SS physicians of Auschwitz by Robert Jay Lifton (1986) mentions Münch as the only physician whose commitment to the Hippocratic oath proved stronger than that to the SS.

While Münch did conduct human experiments, these were often elaborate farces intended to protect inmates, as experiment subjects who were no longer useful were usually killed. Allegedly, Münch's last act before the camp was abandoned was to provide inmate Dr Louis Micheels with a revolver to assist his escape.[4]

After the evacuation of Auschwitz in 1945, Münch spent three months at the Dachau concentration camp near Munich.

Münch has also commented on Holocaust denial. In an interview made by German filmmaker Bernhard Frankfurter, Frankfurter asks about the negationist claim that Auschwitz was a hoax, to which Münch wearily responds:

"When someone says that Auschwitz is a lie, that it is a hoax, I feel hesitation to say much to him. I say, the facts are so firmly determined, that one cannot have any doubt at all, and I stop talking to that person because there is no use. One knows that anyone who clings to such things, which are published somewhere, is a malevolent person who has some personal interest to want to bury in silence things that cannot be buried in silence."
—Exchange between Münch and Frankfurter.[7]



Holocaust deniers can not debunk the testimony of these eye witness.

They were there and they were not tortured, they wrote about it many years after as well.

At the time they were committed to the Nazi regime.
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It isn't Zionism it IS Rothschilds Zionism.

Originally Posted by bendoon
The white race is the only race that isn't racist.Originally Posted by bendoonall the most intelligent people in history have been racist .

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Old 09-03-2013, 01:19 AM   #4415
ellis_deatrip
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Originally Posted by lizzy View Post
thanks ellis - am working through this .
yesterday it was a couple of links from davebun ...( good to see a new knowing face) and thanks to all 'greats' who keep up the good fight here - posting the truth is the most honourable thing , all the in-depth work - appreciated.
I read a lot about the present control tools but understanding the past in many areas but especially this is vital to understanding now and whats' ahead.
You're welcome, Lizzy. Glad to hear.
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“Man muß das Wahre immer wiederholen, weil auch der Irrtum um uns her immer wieder gepredigt wird und zwar nicht von einzelnen, sondern von der Masse, in Zeitungen und Enzyklopädien, auf Schulen und Universitäten. Überall ist der Irrtum obenauf, und es ist ihm wohl und behaglich im Gefühl der Majorität, die auf seiner Seite ist”.

-Goethe zu Eckermann
"it is necessary that truth be repeated again and again, because the error is advocated and propagated again and again, not only by one or another, but by very many people, in newspapers and encyclopedias, in schools and universities, everywhere the infallible is on top, and he is well and comfortable in the feeling of the majority, which is on its side."
-Goethe to Eckermann
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Old 09-03-2013, 02:05 AM   #4416
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I find it insulting that people on here keep calling us hollowco$t deniers. How can you deny something that never happened, that is a double negative.
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Old 09-03-2013, 03:17 AM   #4417
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I find it insulting that people on here keep calling us hollowco$t deniers. How can you deny something that never happened, that is a double negative.
good point sniper , I suppose it's a sort of double speak - but the lie has been told and believed - gradually ramped up by media and in our schools (- it was never taught or alluded to in my history class and my exam was in "modern european history' - but it is today.)

...but just like ellis and other good peeps here have said( even if they do get a but fed up repeating it )- when a new set of eyes view it ,learns the truth , they will never forget get it again and hopefully pass it on.
De-dunking this lie and examining why it's becoming a 'crime' to do so is really one the best places to prove how insidiously peeps have been lied to and you are at the top of that list of brave and knowledgeable posters.

We just don't always need to debate the deluded dis-info's - just keep posting truth.

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Old 09-03-2013, 03:40 AM   #4418
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I find it insulting that people on here keep calling us hollowco$t deniers. How can you deny something that never happened, that is a double negative.
Don't feed them numbnuts. Give them neither your time or energy, they are not worthy.
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Old 09-03-2013, 06:15 PM   #4419
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Used to be about 125 votes apiece, now the noes are ahead by 15. Someone tell tel aviv....
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Old 09-03-2013, 07:25 PM   #4420
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David Irving speaks on the 'David Irving recants Holocaust':-

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Adolf Eichmann, of course, is now the man with whom the public most associates what they call the "Holocaust."

I hate that word. It's a word I don't like using. People say to me, "Mr. Irving, do you believe in the Holocaust? Do you deny the Holocaust?" I say that I mistrust words with a capital letter. They look like a trademark, don't they? Like Tylenol or something. We don't trust them; no matter how much advertising they put into Tylenol. And so it is with that word "Holocaust." You get the impression that it is a neatly packaged, highly promoted operation, and you don't trust it.


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'David Irving Recants'

Entirely by chance on Friday, January 10, a journalist with The Observer (one of the other serious British Sunday papers, and a great rival of the Sunday Times) telephoned me to ask me for a quotation about an event coming up the following week in London. On January 20 there was going to be a big Jewish Holocaust seminar at the Wiener Library in London. The Wiener Library had issued a press release dealing with certain casualty figures, and a statement had been issued by Yehuda Bauer of Israel's Yad Vashem institute, who was going to take part in the meeting. Had I any comments? It was just a routine journalist's call. I make this point because I'm not a publicity seeker, and I don't go out of my way to seek publicity. Publicity's a nuisance, and believe me, I long ago ceased to believe that journalists are going to do me any favors at all. They're not.

When this journalist telephoned me, I said, "I can't tell you my own impression about these figures, but what I will tell you is that Adolf Eichmann himself said that [Auschwitz commandant] Rudolf Höss' figures were grossly inflated, and that Eichmann thought that Höss was an outrageous liar."

"How do you know this?" he responded.

"Well," I said, "nobody else knows this, but as of two months ago I've gotten ahold of all of Adolf Eichmann's private papers. They were donated to me by a mutual friend in Argentina who didn't know what to do with them, and he thought they were safest in my hands. I've donated the originals to the German archives, and I'm busy researching through them now." By that time I'd read three quarters of them, I think.

Well, the journalist flipped. "You mean to say that you've had Adolf Eichmann's diaries?" he asked.

"No," I replied, "not his diaries, just his memoirs and everything he dictated and his conversations, and it's all pure gold."

Then he asked, "Have you reached any new conclusions?"

I responded: "There's one sentence that has given me cause for thought." (I'll speak about this later on.) And the journalist then wrote an article that appeared the following day in The Observer, and which was picked up that same day by the Sunday Telegraph under the headline, "Historian Recants." [See the IHR Newsletter, Feb. 1992, pp. 3-4.]

Okay, that's the kind of harmless thing newspapers do, and the following morning they're wrapping fish and chips. But in this case, the following morning it was wrapping fish and chips all the way around the world. As the globe spun, as the sun rose in the east and sank in the west, so my fax machine churned out press clippings from all my agents and sources and friends, in New Zealand, in Australia, in South Africa, in Europe, then on the east coast of the United States, then across Canada, then finally to the west coast, then down in Hawaii, in China, in Hong Kong -- right around the world. That one Observer article had instantaneously been spread: "David Irving Recants."

It was interesting to see that my original statement, whatever I was supposed to have recanted, had not gone around the world with the speed of light, had not been splashed [on newspaper front pages], and yet my "recanting" was sufficiently newsworthy to have gone around the world, and been given this tremendous publicity splash.

Too late, the Jewish community realized that they had scored an immense "own goal" (what Americans call a "fumble"), because the phone then began ringing with calls from television and radio stations around the world, wanting live interviews and telephone interviews. Would I go to the studios to do a satellite interview with Sydney? And of course, every time I did I said, "Well, Eichmann says he witnessed mass shootings in Russia, but Eichmann's papers are quite plain: there's no mention at all of gas chambers." So I was able to get the message across.

At this, our traditional enemies went berserk. In a very impressive example of damage control, they then called out the fire brigades to spread the following message: "What David Irving has published is not new. David Irving has found nothing that the accepted, academic, reliable, decent, serious professional historians haven't always known all along. The Eichmann papers are not new. We have always known about these papers. There is nothing in David Irving's find that merits serious consideration."

To which I said, "How do you know? The papers that I have donated to the federal archives in Germany are subject to an embargo by me which prevents anybody else from seeing them, and nobody has seen them, except me and the archives [officials] in Germany. So how do you know that what I have is what you lot have known all along?" An interesting point!

"Oh, well, it's quite obvious, isn't it?" they said, and then went into a kind of damage control on the damage control. But it was too late, because the point was very obvious: I had the papers, and they hadn't.


The line of defense of the Jewish community was that what I had was not all that serious; and, please, no further publicity. This made me begin to wonder. What was it they didn't want published? Why was it, I asked myself, that when the Eichmann memoirs came out in 1985, first of all, nobody was willing to publish them except Druffel Verlag in Germany, and Planeta in Argentina, but no mainstream publisher in Europe or the United States? Here, after all, are the memoirs of "the biggest mass-murderer of all time," apparently, and yet for some reason they're being swept under the carpet.

And why was it that our traditional enemies had gone into this frantic damage control exercise when, of all people, David Irving had got control of the original transcripts and had put them in the archives?



Quote:
Eichmann comments, "Where does Höss believe that he got these two and a half million Jews? Not from me. Because to have liquidated two and a half million decrepit, elderly, unworkable Jews, I must have had to feed to him three, four, five, six or seven million Jews in that space of time, and from the transport point of view alone this would have been totally impossible."
Quote:
Eichmann said, "If you're going to ship five or six million Jews across Europe to Auschwitz at that time, let me tell you how many trains that would have taken," and he worked out how many trains it would have taken, because he knew.

"You're not only going to have trains going that way full of Jews, you're going to have empty trains coming back. And you're going to have to have a circulation time, a time where they're unloading at one end, a time where they're loading at the other end... You're going to need so many thousands of wagons" of rolling stock. He worked out exactly how much rolling stock would have been needed, in these memoirs, and he said, "This alone proves that Rudolf Hoss was talking through his hat. These figures are totally fantastic, and what the hell is Hoss up to?"

That is a brief, lurid summary of what Eichmann writes as he's sitting in what he believes to be safety in the underground in Argentina, reading these memoirs of Höss, published in 1958.

Two years later, of course, Eichmann is kidnapped, so it's during those two years that Eichmann is writing this. He mentions also in these memoirs how he received an indirect approach from Nahum Goldmann. Nahum Goldmann was one of the great Zionist leaders of the postwar era. Born in Lithuania and living for many years in Germany, he was the person who negotiated with Konrad Adenauer the billions of German marks which subsequently went to Israel. Eichmann mentions in these memoirs what purported to be an indirect approach from Goldmann, pleading with him to back up the six million figure. Anything he could do to support the six million figure, because the Zionists needed it. You are beginning to suspect, now, why these Eichmann memoirs should not be published.


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Eichmann describes many things, but what he does not once mention during this vivid description of his visit to Auschwitz is "gas chambers." He doesn't mention gas chambers,

any historian can now confirm that nowhere in all the archives of the world has yet been found one wartime document referring to a Führer's order to destroy the Jews, or for that matter, one wartime document referring to gas chambers or gassings. All the documents that refer to Führer orders and gas chambers are postwar documents; statements by people in the dock at Nuremberg, memoirs written by the commandant at Krakow in Poland, and the like. You can't overlook this basic watershed between wartime and postwar documents.
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If there's no wartime document that says there was a Führer order, if no wartime document talks of gas chambers, then there has to be some explanation for that.

http://www.whale.to/b/irving1.html
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