Why Join the Masons?

[psquared]

Originally Posted by busa

So cutting to the chase lads (and one lass), anyone might want to join the Masons to raise funds for charities, to study, to get some mates and because they like dressing up? Is that it ?

Not for the cheap ale though !

In my jurisdiction alcohol is strictly forbidden at ANY function.

[ksigmason]

Wow, I gave a lengthy, relevant response and this is what I get in return?

Originally Posted by icxc

I just have made a mistake.

Nobody is perfect.

Originally Posted by icxc

You (if you are a mason) have given the oath to speak about Masonic secrets only with a brother mason and only in a lodge.

And nothing I have ever discussed has violated that. Not everything that occurs within our walls is secret. There is a great deal I can talk about. I'm very confident about what I can and cannot talk about.

Just by reading Pike and other Masonic literature and I get a headache of such nonsense.

Pike is an interesting read, but I prefer more modern authors such as Hodapp, Porter, Hogan, Dafoe, Morris, and De Hoyos.

If you want I can open a topic for each point in question just to focus and go trough.

Or you could just post it in here.

I would be very scary to enjoy a society which says it is moralistic and philanthropic.

Really? You're against being good and charitable?

Originally Posted by busa

So cutting to the chase lads (and one lass), anyone might want to join the Masons to raise funds for charities, to study, to get some mates and because they like dressing up? Is that it ?

Not for the cheap ale though !

[inversedivinity]

Masons of a high intellect would realise that morality is a construct. Charity is about image. By it's very nature in the bullshit realm known as western civilization it is not altruistic.

[ksigmason]

Originally Posted by inversedivinity

Masons of a high intellect would realise that morality is a construct. Charity is about image. By it's very nature in the bullshit realm known as western civilization it is not altruistic.

Charity is not about image. Charity is not so selfish.

"Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil"

[seers among us]

Originally Posted by psquared

In my jurisdiction alcohol is strictly forbidden at ANY function.

Does Freemasonry look down upon the use of marijuana, dmt, or other psychoactive substances if they are used to stimulate further enlightenment/illumination?

[dr steam]

Originally Posted by seers among us

Does Freemasonry look down upon the use of marijuana, dmt, or other psychoactive substances if they are used to stimulate further enlightenment/illumination?

It should. Most of us are aware that this is the only path to true illumination...

[mrunhappy]

I'd happily join and offer my services if there was any possibility my membership could result in a real job where I could work hard and be moderately rewarded. I could do with a network...

Every little helps.

[psquared]

Originally Posted by seers among us

Does Freemasonry look down upon the use of marijuana, dmt, or other psychoactive substances if they are used to stimulate further enlightenment/illumination?

In my jursidiction Masons are bound by obligation to observe the laws of the government. So, I would assume that illegal drug use would be a violation of that obligation.

[psquared]

Originally Posted by mrunhappy

I'd happily join and offer my services if there was any possibility my membership could result in a real job where I could work hard and be moderately rewarded. I could do with a network...

Every little helps.

That would be the #1 wrong reason to join Freemasonry IMHO.

[eastbeast]

Originally Posted by mrunhappy

I'd happily join and offer my services if there was any possibility my membership could result in a real job where I could work hard and be moderately rewarded. I could do with a network...

Every little helps.

Just a measure of how much help it would be;

You stand more chance at the Jobcentre.

These are bad times to be without work, you seem to have the right attitude so I wish you luck in your search.

[icxc]

@ksigmason – I believe you are a honest man, and thank you for long responses…

What to say about the American masonry more than it is the biggest networking society in the USA. A few million people are masons: removing women, black and poor, so you will see that masonry takes over control USA in the form of rich (not poor), white men. (yes yes, there is a mixed masonry too etc..). But that is the statistic.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

Wow, I gave a lengthy, relevant response and this is what I get in return?

Your longest response was about – you. Your masonic level. You could make it copy-paste or whatever from somewhere without typing it.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

And nothing I have ever discussed has violated that. Not everything that occurs within our walls is secret. There is a great deal I can talk about. I'm very confident about what I can and cannot talk about.

Well, I say “masonic secrets” and you reply “not everything is secret”. A complete-logic answer is needed here.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

// I would be very scary to enjoy a society which says it is moralistic and philanthropic.//
Really? You're against being good and charitable?

Beng human and moralistic is the real state of the nature and the human being. What would you say if you meet a new person, you ask “who are you”, and reply is “I am a moral and human person”. Or a political party first saying “we are moral and human”. Or a new store in your city saying “we are the best store”. What would be your reaction?
Is it moralistic to say “we are a moral society, but we are doing many of our things secretly”?
My dear, something is very very wrong. That’s why I don’t want to enjoy masonry. Putting the etiquette "moral" and "human" can do anyone on this planet. Don’t forget that the “righteous” was Hitler, “righteous” was Stalin, Bush – people just believed in that. Many people died in the history even in the name of Jesus Christos. But that was the etiquette too.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

Actually none of these names are ever mentioned in Lodge, so your point is mute.

On this forum are very common logical mistakes.
My question was: “can you say officially in the Lodge: in the name of Jesus Christos”?
Your answer can be just: No, Yes, or “I don’t know”.
But if you are 32° - you should answer just Yes or No.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

the biggest reason for our secrecy is the bigotry and persecution of governments (monarchies) and the followers of intolerant faith pushed us into it.

I don’t know how many logical mistakes I can count here.
The Masonry is a priori made to be secret. So what was a priori and what was a posteriori? Was Masonry for ages non-secret society and than some stupid monarch attacked you and you become secret? What was a priori?

Originally Posted by ksigmason

we're a non-profit, private organization. in the US at least, the Constitution guarantees our right to exist without interference, particularly interference from the government.
The members have a right to privacy and unless for sufficient reason the Lodges and Grand Lodges cannot reveal the members identity without permission. IMO, too many people think they are entitled to know everything about everyone's business (nosy parkers and busy bodies all of them).
Again, it is none of your business.

I am opposing you by telling that Masonry is a secret organization claiming to be moralistic. Your answer is “our right to exist without interference” and ”it is none of your business”.
Once again I am pointing that you are answering wrongly. Apple and Microsoft have their own business that can be controlled by state if needed, but they have also their own business secrets – which are not always “moralistic”, and their secrets are so because it is competitive. I am opposing your opinion and you are answering me personally “it is none of your business”. That is not the correct answer.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

Check my signature block then come back to me. I'll help you decipher:

You can write everything behind your keyboard. You can be anyone, but ...I believe you.
However, all this listing you provided is not impressive to me. I am not touched at all.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

If such a Brother has committed any kind of heinous crimes they would not be a worthy Brother as they have violated the charges given to them in the 1st Degree where it states to be a good citizen who obeys the laws of the land.

Do you obey only the laws of the land? Only these? I need the complete answer. I must believe that it is not the complete answer. What do you have to obey more? If the answer is The Masonic Secret, thank you, you haven't said that.
You haven’t actually answered on the question, again.
Question: If a brother mason gives to you the Grand hailing sign of distress – will you help him, despite the state law? The answer must be complete, yes or no. Or, if you don’t want honestly to answer, say you cannot answer. You can answer "depends", but you have to clarify what dependences are in question, so that no misunderstanding can occur.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

You have to pay money to join and be a member in good standing, so if you cannot pay you cannot stay.

But if I (mason) ask a brother mason to help me to find a better job to be able to pay it, will you help me? Will you help me as well as if I am a non-mason? How many people you could help than? Do you help anyone equally?
It confirms the theory about the networking.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

Why allow someone who doesn't have the mind to memorize our work or capable of understanding it.

So from “anyone can join” to “just a few”. And couldn’t a retarded person (medically) be a moral man, do charity job or help others? That’s why the Masonry has nothing with Christianity in a deepest meaning. It is completely contrary.

Originally Posted by ksigmason

//You say that masonry is NOT anti-christian.//
I do say such things.

You say.
But in the Christianity, in other words The Holy Orthodox Catholic Church, you have only One God, and it is The Holy Trinity.
As you accept in to the Masonry not only Christians but also other believers, how can Masonry be Christian? No, it can’t be.
The Christianity is a set and can only be a set. But you have put it as a subset in the masonic set. It is the fault. This is the highest theoretical, practical, logic fault. You cannot put a set in another set without it making a subset. Idaho is the state but it is a subset of US-set. You can share the same thoughts between different beliefs but The Holy Orthodox Catholic Church accept only one truth, that Truth is complete, unified and hermetic, and it cannot be included in something else trough compromising or excluding some parts of the Truth. Remember why the Roman Catholics separated from the Main Church - because of a very little difference. That "little" difference ended in many other anomalies of the Pope Chatholic Church.
Everything in life what is not confronting with the Christian faith you can make in the name of the Lord Jesus Christos. You cannot do it in Masonry, you cannot make in the name of the Lord Jesus Christos. Can you? Yes or No?
But I don’t abandon that the crimes were made in the name of the Lord Jesus Christos. It is of course completely contrary to it.

However I can see you are not so deep involved in Christianity. So I will tell you another difference.
The deepest understanding of the Lord Jesus Christos comes from a total removal of the passions and total removal of the ego. It is very very very hard. The last war a Christian wages is against the vice of pride. The pride of own holiness.
Oppositely, the Masonry is the way you do so: one has to achieve some high levels but he feeds the ego, you have to achieve a mysterious knowledge, you have to “build” you toward the God – to be as perfect. You believe you do achieve the light, but Christianity teaches that you have to remove that "belief". No, it is not agnosticism either, because the knowledge happens deepest in your heart.
Everything you mentioned about your degrees is just nothing in this world... Leave the worldly cares; do not be proud of your medals and others good words about you. Refuse any profit and honor you can make from Masonry, for nothing is important in this world than sincere love for the Lord. Give to poor but never say that you are moral, because the enemy of pride will resect you (not only you, anyone, me, you, other...).

You recommend some books.
I can recommend you reading the Philokalia. There are four books available by Faber, you can order from Amazon http://goo.gl/RbfrG . Read it slowly. If you need a support I can give you what I can.

I want to help you.
ICXC NIKA

[my hero]

Why are masons feared?

Well, first they always present on the left side of the body. Now, if you know a little about psychology, you will know that the brain is divided into two halves, with various crossover interconnections. For example, the left brain controls the right side of the body and so on.
I won't go into it here. Check it out yourself. Jungian psychology possibly, although it's not just psychology; this is the way the physical organism is wired up in the nervous system.

By establishing a sense of their constant presence in the person they target,
a feeling of bodily fear is induced in the victim, located in the upper left side of the chest, next to the heart. A complete unbalancing of nervous energy in the body.

In old nomenclature, this area was known as 'the cavity of the heart.'

Once the target is induced, with the mason now a constant presence in the mind,24/7, even in their physical absence, ideas can be easily introduced into the mind of the target.

Since at this stage, the target has difficulty distinguishing between theirself and implanted ideas from the mason, an unholy mindmeld, this kind of material is readily accepted, under the influence of imparted bodily fear, which by this stage, is a constant presence, leading to internal mental confusion and a DECREASE IN ORGANISED BRAIN ACTIVITY - DIOBA.

Perfect control is established.


These are very arrogant,manipulative and insanely persistent people. The porch masons know nothing about this. They think it's an exclusive, self help club. Bad start.The ones who rise to the top of this degenerate organisation are those who are the most cold and calculating. 33rd. degree indeed! What a con. An ancient trick, handed down from time immemorial, to be utilised by those who have no regard for anyone, other than themselves and their personal interests.

Power and control is the name of the game.

One of the early methods used is, that when a mason is talking to a target, he will always throw his hands forward, gesticulating towards the face.

On a subconscious level, this is interpreted as an attack, raising blood pressure in the victim and the 'fight or flight response' in the body. The target tries to suppress this, as imagination, when in fact, it's a perfectly genuine response to the situation and the effects will remain with the victim, unless they have some recourse, some fightback.

The counteraction? Do it right back at them. They back off sharply when they realise they're wasting their time. Cold and calculating as they are, they move on.

There may also be repetitive movement on the left side of the target, for example, in a meeting around a table, where the mason will exhibit constant fidgeting, jiggling around, tapping, movement.

The reason? The most sensitive parts of the eyes are the outside corners, when, in ancient times, we had to be on watch for attack from wild animals, or opposing forces. This is from our evolution.

A signal from these areas was a wake up call to the nervous system to be on alert. It is overloaded if constantly activated, raising stress levels. So, if you find yourself feeling unusually stressed in one of these situations, for no reason, spot check whoever is sitting on your left, then sit with a hand covering the outside corner of your eye, if you think they are behaving unusually.


What a nest of cold,viperous creatures they are, these 'masons',inducing fear in their fellow human beings, to get control over them. And the'masons' are not the only crew that use these methods.

Masons? What a fucking joke. Most of them couldn't build a garden wall.

They also follow you around and stick to you like shit on a blanket, until you 'persuade' them otherwise.

[eastbeast]

Originally Posted by my hero

Why are masons feared?

Well, first they always present on the left side of the body. Now, if you know a little about psychology, you will know that the brain is divided into two halves, with various crossover interconnections. For example, the left brain controls the right side of the body and so on.
I won't go into it here. Check it out yourself. Jungian psychology possibly, although it's not just psychology; this is the way the physical organism is wired up in the nervous system.

By establishing a sense of their constant presence in the person they target,
a feeling of bodily fear is induced in the victim, located in the upper left side of the chest, next to the heart. A complete unbalancing of nervous energy in the body.

In old nomenclature, this area was known as 'the cavity of the heart.'

Once the target is induced, with the mason now a constant presence in the mind,24/7, even in their physical absence, ideas can be easily introduced into the mind of the target.

Since at this stage, the target has difficulty distinguishing between theirself and implanted ideas from the mason, an unholy mindmeld, this kind of material is readily accepted, under the influence of imparted bodily fear, which by this stage, is a constant presence, leading to internal mental confusion and a DECREASE IN ORGANISED BRAIN ACTIVITY - DIOBA.

Perfect control is established.


These are very arrogant,manipulative and insanely persistent people. The porch masons know nothing about this. They think it's an exclusive, self help club. Bad start.The ones who rise to the top of this degenerate organisation are those who are the most cold and calculating. 33rd. degree indeed! What a con. An ancient trick, handed down from time immemorial, to be utilised by those who have no regard for anyone, other than themselves and their personal interests.

Power and control is the name of the game.

One of the early methods used is, that when a mason is talking to a target, he will always throw his hands forward, gesticulating towards the face.

On a subconscious level, this is interpreted as an attack, raising blood pressure in the victim and the 'fight or flight response' in the body. The target tries to suppress this, as imagination, when in fact, it's a perfectly genuine response to the situation and the effects will remain with the victim, unless they have some recourse, some fightback.

The counteraction? Do it right back at them. They back off sharply when they realise they're wasting their time. Cold and calculating as they are, they move on.

There may also be repetitive movement on the left side of the target, for example, in a meeting around a table, where the mason will exhibit constant fidgeting, jiggling around, tapping, movement.

The reason? The most sensitive parts of the eyes are the outside corners, when, in ancient times, we had to be on watch for attack from wild animals, or opposing forces. This is from our evolution.

A signal from these areas was a wake up call to the nervous system to be on alert. It is overloaded if constantly activated, raising stress levels. So, if you find yourself feeling unusually stressed in one of these situations, for no reason, spot check whoever is sitting on your left, then sit with a hand covering the outside corner of your eye, if you think they are behaving unusually.


What a nest of cold,viperous creatures they are, these 'masons',inducing fear in their fellow human beings, to get control over them. And the'masons' are not the only crew that use these methods.

Masons? What a fucking joke. Most of them couldn't build a garden wall.

They also follow you around and stick to you like shit on a blanket, until you 'persuade' them otherwise.

Amazing.

You can also wear a hat made of Aluminium foil, and at night sleep in a Faradic cage.

[eastbeast]

The crap that you anti-Masons spew just re-confirms that I have made the right choices in my life.
You call us "freakmasons", but I'd never want to keep company with those who have so much hate in their heart.

I will always be the vigilant, tireless soul to guard the realm of truth from the wolves and vipers who spew venom laced honey into the ears of the ignorant.
Your kind will never like me because I stand for freedom and liberty, while you stand for fascist conformity and intrusiveness.
You fabricate lies, perpetuate hoaxes, and use deceitful methods to slander us; to you the ends justify the means.
That is immoral and unethical. Freemasonry will endure though against your tirade of lies.

[ksigmason]

Originally Posted by icxc

@ksigmason – I believe you are a honest man, and thank you for long responses…

I try to put a lot of thought and information in my posts because I want civil, honest discussions, but if a poster is unkind I will not just take it on the chin.

What to say about the American masonry more than it is the biggest networking society in the USA.

That's not what it is used for.

A few million people are masons: removing women, black and poor, so you will see that masonry takes over control USA in the form of rich (not poor), white men.

Actually black men may join Freemasonry.

Your longest response was about – you. Your masonic level. You could make it copy-paste or whatever from somewhere without typing it.

I don't have my Masonic resume typed out to copy-n-paste at a moments notice, but my posts were in response to you in which you questioned my level in Freemasonry, and it was only about a 3rd of that post. I posted a lengthy post that didn't include my Masonic resume on it.

Well, I say “masonic secrets” and you reply “not everything is secret”. A complete-logic answer is needed here.

Not everything is secret in Freemasonry. My post was quite obvious: "Not everything that occurs within our walls is secret."

What would you say if you meet a new person, you ask “who are you”, and reply is “I am a moral and human person”.

I'd probably laugh, but I'd let their actions speak for themselves.

Is it moralistic to say “we are a moral society, but we are doing many of our things secretly”?

We actually do things privately. People know when we meet, where we meet, and we have many public displays of our membership. We're not that secret. Some of our charities are very well known and some are not. Plus, we're not a political party, a store, or individual. That is comparing apples and oranges.

Plus where have I said that I am moral simply because I'm a Mason?

My question was: “can you say officially in the Lodge: in the name of Jesus Christos”?
Your answer can be just: No, Yes, or “I don’t know”.
But if you are 32° - you should answer just Yes or No.

Actually you said the following (with both a statement and a question):

You can mention in the Lodge the names of Osiris, Shiva, Tor and other "gods", but can you mention Jesus Christos. Can you finish your speech in the Lodge by saying "in the name of Jesus Christ"? You can't, but you CAN say in the name of Mohammad, Osiris or such. Try do this. You will be punished.

I corrected you. None of these names listed are ever mentioned in Lodge. No one religion is held above another as we have a membership of many different faiths and denominations. Christianity is not singled out so your faux rage is without merit.

I don’t know how many logical mistakes I can count here.

It's not illogical to think that someone acted in secret when they were persecuted in the past. Or we to believe that Freemasonry and other forms of free thinking wasn't persecuted by despotic governments and religious organizations in the past? Laughable. You really need to look at the documented history of Freemasonry.

I also note that you didn't quote me correctly.

I am opposing you by telling that Masonry is a secret organization claiming to be moralistic.

I am opposing your opinion and you are answering me personally “it is none of your business”.

I answered your with plenty particular to each point. "None of your business" was just one point I gave, not the entire premise.

I'll expand on thing I did miss. The Grand Lodge cannot give out the names of its members without their permission without facing legal issues.

You can write everything behind your keyboard. You can be anyone, but ...I believe you.

Okay.

It's actually not quite that hard to verify who I am, but I'm not going to reveal anything private on this forum...rules and all. On another forum I actually had a anti-Mason out me on a thread. He thought I'd get mad, but the post got removed and he was banned for violating the rules.

Here's a funny story, some years ago I was driving home from work and my phone went off with a number I didn't recognize, but I answered anyways. The woman on the line turned out to be the ex-wife of my Senior Warden of the Lodge I was presiding over. Somehow she had scoured the internet and somehow figured out I knew her ex-husband and needed to pass a message on to him. I had never met this gal before as they had divorced long before he moved out to Idaho and before I had met him.

However, all this listing you provided is not impressive to me. I am not touched at all.

Well, you said I wasn't high enough, but I guess you don't know the degrees and orders of Freemasonry very well. Plus, I'm not here to impress you.

Do you obey only the laws of the land? Only these? I need the complete answer. I must believe that it is not the complete answer. What do you have to obey more? If the answer is The Masonic Secret, thank you, you haven't said that.

If you had read and quoted my entire post, you'd have the complete answer. A good worthy Brother doesn't break the laws of the land. All Brothers are charged to obey the laws of the land.

Question: If a brother mason gives to you the Grand hailing sign of distress – will you help him, despite the state law? The answer must be complete, yes or no. Or, if you don’t want honestly to answer, say you cannot answer. You can answer "depends", but you have to clarify what dependences are in question, so that no misunderstanding can occur.

Depends. Has he broken the law? No, but note that not everyone who seeks aid is running from the law.

But if I (mason) ask a brother mason to help me to find a better job to be able to pay it, will you help me? Will you help me as well as if I am a non-mason? How many people you could help than? Do you help anyone equally?

Yes. Yes. Depends. Yes.

I've helped a few Brothers with their dues, but I've also let non-Masons stay on my couch when they were down on their luck.

It confirms the theory about the networking.

So you're making opinions before I answered? Huh.

So from “anyone can join” to “just a few”.

I never said that. Quit putting words in my mouth. Do not presume to speak for me.

And couldn’t a retarded person (medically) be a moral man, do charity job or help others?

No one is saying this.

You say.

I do.

But in the Christianity, in other words The Holy Orthodox Catholic Church, you have only One God, and it is The Holy Trinity.

lol... oh you're serious?! BWAHAHAHAHAHA

The Catholic Church does not represent all of Christianity. LOL As a Christian I could care less about what the Catholic Church has to say. I am not so inept and stupid that I need a bunch of ecclesiastical bureaucrats to tell me my relationship with God. I find the irony in some is that they say God is omnipresent, but only a few chosen can speak with God. LOL

As you accept in to the Masonry not only Christians but also other believers, how can Masonry be Christian? No, it can’t be.

I never said Freemasonry was Christian. Many of its legends and rituals are based on Judeo-Christian stories, but we allow men of all faiths in. In America we've never said we were solely a Christian organization. Where do you come up with such nonsense?

In some places Freemasonry is for Christians only.

You cannot put a set in another set without it making a subset.

DUH! I'm very familiar with sets and subsets.

You can share the same thoughts between different beliefs but The Holy Orthodox Catholic Church accept only one truth, that Truth is complete, unified and hermetic, and it cannot be included in something else trough compromising or excluding some parts of the Truth.

LOL! The "truth" is what the Church wants it to be. You argue against the morality of Freemasonry, but then stand with one of the most corrupt organizations in the history of the world? LMAO! Definitely some selectivity and double standards right there.

Everything in life what is not confronting with the Christian faith you can make in the name of the Lord Jesus Christos. You cannot do it in Masonry, you cannot make in the name of the Lord Jesus Christos. Can you? Yes or No?

Yes, I sure can. Every time I pray I pray to Christ. In the York Rite, it is very Christian in nature, particularly in the Knights Templar.

However I can see you are not so deep involved in Christianity.

You're right, I'm not active in any church, but I do go in some rare occasions. I've never been one for church though for reasons I mentioned earlier and I hate people trying to control my life when they have no business doing so. It's usually zealots that drove me away. One such instance is that I skipped church to go see my family up in the mountains and the next time I saw the minister he told me I should have put my church attendance before my own family. Yeah, I told him where to go, he told me I should leave, and I haven't been back since.

Oppositely, the Masonry is the way you do so: one has to achieve some high levels but he feeds the ego, you have to achieve a mysterious knowledge, you have to “build” you toward the God – to be as perfect.

You really don't have a good understanding of Freemasonry.

You believe you do achieve the light, but Christianity teaches that you have to remove that "belief".

Where does it say that?

Everything you mentioned about your degrees is just nothing in this world...

In your opinion.

You recommend some books.

Some very good books written by some great authors. Of course with a closed mind you probably wouldn't enjoy them.

I can recommend you reading the Philokalia.

If I have time.

Read it slowly. If you need a support I can give you what I can.

I think I'm capable enough on my own.

I want to help you.

With what?

Originally Posted by my hero

Well, first they always present on the left side of the body.

What? LOL

Now, if you know a little about psychology, you will know that the brain is divided into two halves, with various crossover interconnections.

LOL Actually anyone with a basic grasp of human anatomy, not psychology, would know that the brain is divided into two halves.

Once the target is induced, with the mason now a constant presence in the mind,24/7, even in their physical absence, ideas can be easily introduced into the mind of the target.

LOL! Are you serious?

The porch masons know nothing about this.

And yet you somehow made this discovery as a non-Mason. Do you really think that us Masons don't know anything about our own organization?

The ones who rise to the top of this degenerate organisation are those who are the most cold and calculating. 33rd. degree indeed!

The 33rd degree is only the highest degree in the Scottish Rite, it is not the catch all authority of all Freemasonry. Far too many see the numbering system and fall prey to a huge misconception. The tree of Freemasonry is much more than just the Scottish Rite.

How are we a degenerate organization? I'd like specifics.

You come up with some stupid, crazy, and unproven theories.

What a nest of cold,viperous creatures they are, these 'masons',inducing fear in their fellow human beings, to get control over them.

Uh huh. Maybe you should come out of your parents basement and see the light of day once in a while...or maybe go back on your meds.

Masons? What a fucking joke.

No, your post is the joke.

They also follow you around and stick to you like shit on a blanket, until you 'persuade' them otherwise.

Do you have actual proof of anything you've spewed?

[dr steam]

Originally Posted by my hero

They also follow you around and stick to you like shit on a blanket, until you 'persuade' them otherwise.

I wonder if you confuse the Jehovah's Witnesses and Scientology along with the Masons here...

[mrmason]

Originally Posted by psquared

We cannot levitate, we do not live forever...far too many dead Masons for that to be true.

Man that would be so cool if I could levitate !

but on topic when I was speaking to one of the old guys about the history of masonry in my country he brought up that after WW1, WW2 there was a surge in membership, alot of War veterans joined to continue a sense of fraternity and brotherhood that they gained and as a good way to stay in regular contact after the war.

My lodge has alot of Military members, at lodge we are all equal i.e The wing commander and Brigadier are on the same level as the Privates in our lodge.

[eastbeast]

I really do apologize for the following, but just couldn't resist.........

Originally Posted by mrmason

Man that would be so cool if I could levitate !

You will only learn to do this when you get high enough, when will you learn, how many times must you be told, us low downs don't know such things until we get higher degrees. Please, no more of this, we will be severely punished if this huge secret gets out.

Originally Posted by mrmason

The wing commander and Brigadier are on the same level as the Privates in our lodge.

Cue for a joke there.........

[colours]

Lets relax and play lets pretend for a a minute.

Lets write a story about evil entities that are totally Anathema to the human spirit, intellect, and freedom.

Now how about lets say these entities are very cunning. First rule of warfare when outnumbered is divide and conquer. So lets take every society that express's itself different from each other even though they at heart fight for the same things.

Now in our story of societies at war due to confusion and possibly even subterfuge these societies spent so much time watching each other the real threat laughs and moves on because all other players have been made irrelevant due to prejudice.

Just a thought or maybe not.

I am not a mason, I am not asleep, I believe that all Humans are inherently good. Even the bad ones dont believe their are evil for evils sake.

Now if the Freemasons are what they say and not what someone else says about them. Then to the non masons I ask "When and if this fight comes. Who do you think would be the first to stand by your side?"

Its easy to become blind to a prejudice told over and over. Now to the Masons I ask "If what the opposition says is true and you ultimately found out that what they said was true. That perhaps certain chapters or groups within groups have a control agenda and you find out. "Would you as a group or individual out these people?"

[eppyone]

Originally Posted by colours

Lets relax and play lets pretend for a a minute.

Lets write a story about evil entities that are totally Anathema to the human spirit, intellect, and freedom.

Now how about lets say these entities are very cunning. First rule of warfare when outnumbered is divide and conquer. So lets take every society that express's itself different from each other even though they at heart fight for the same things.

Now in our story of societies at war due to confusion and possibly even subterfuge these societies spent so much time watching each other the real threat laughs and moves on because all other players have been made irrelevant due to prejudice.

Just a thought or maybe not.

I am not a mason, I am not asleep, I believe that all Humans are inherently good. Even the bad ones dont believe their are evil for evils sake.

Now if the Freemasons are what they say and not what someone else says about them. Then to the non masons I ask "When and if this fight comes. Who do you think would be the first to stand by your side?"

Its easy to become blind to a prejudice told over and over. Now to the Masons I ask "If what the opposition says is true and you ultimately found out that what they said was true. That perhaps certain chapters or groups within groups have a control agenda and you find out. "Would you as a group or individual out these people?"

I, for one, most certainly would. But keep in mind, it would be the group within a group that had the control agenda, not Freemasonry.