Marxism - Whats wrong with it?

[the apprentice]

Originally Posted by andyh

At least theres 2 voices of sanity.

.

I'm not trying to rub anyones faces into anything but they will readily try to avoid reality, I don't suppose you find it strange that most want to believe in that which either comforts them or frightens them to death, here is the most worrying scenario if any, where has the middle of the road gone to, some call it intuition.

How else then do humans invent the traps which betray them into mediority, how else does one define what is basically a form and want for a better word, cowardice.

Some actions have an end but no beginning, some begin but do not end, it all depends upon where the observers are standing, how they have been taught to think, as to how those who know how to talk in the fashion and sign of the times, know hey are going to cling to those false hopes and procrasternations.

This free training for our society could be better understood if we taught the virgin mind to distrust instead of trust, teach questioning and individualism, and not the acceptance of stock answers, then they might have a real chance in life when they are released into a energetic paradigms called society, where it is not the same thing to be a good person and a good citizen.

It is no secret that we all have secrets and desires, however very few of them are veiled as we intend them to be.

The new so called discoveries being put forward by Wilcox and Co. Are Dangerous, But so is life if a man is unwilling to take risks, he is doomed never to learn, never grow and never to live unless he is free to think for Himself.

These bastards are well trained and chosen speakers and well versed and know this and why I could never trust them, period.

[positive_forward]

Powerful people in the UK were in cahoots with Chinese Communists, redistribution of industries and money flowed into China. Causing mass unemployment and poverty in the UK.

If it wasn't a Communist country then on moral grounds the opposite would've happened, all trade deals would probably be canceled, and possible sanctions would replace it, due to China's one child abortion policy and oppression of the the citizens under a political regime.

[positive_forward]

After the war - Russian and European Communists came to the UK/US and Israel, many committed mass murders in the countries they left, some continued to murder in Israel, none have been prosecuted for war crimes! Probably due to 5th Column Communists in Governments and positions of power in the UK/US etc and on the Israeli Knesset.

More recently there were the Russian oligarchs who fled to the UK etc, with ill gotten gains (money) such as Abramovitch and co, who bought up footballl teams, land and UK businesses. The Chinese are now buying up the UK and Africa.

Full circle
Before the war. A bunch of New York Jews were given millions in cash by the capitalist Jew banking cabals to ferment the Communist revolutions in Europe. To gain control and to steal the wealth and hand it over to their fellow banking cabals.

I've just shown you again that a GROUP of Jews controlled the capitalist banks and created and controlled Communism. You want more proof, it's all out there and on this forum.
Any wonder why the most pro Communists on the forum are Jewish...

[atomtom]

Originally Posted by arcyclus

Communism is forced sharing. Communism does not work, that is why it has to be forced on others. Truth needs no force to back it up.

all political ideologies have to be forced on some people - nothing suits everybody when control is sought. Does any -ism suit you?

[the apprentice]

Originally Posted by positive_forward

After the war - Russian and European Communists came to the UK/US and Israel, many committed mass murders in the countries they left, some continued to murder in Israel, none have been prosecuted for war crimes! Probably due to 5th Column Communists in Governments and positions of power in the UK/US etc and on the Israeli Knesset.

More recently there were the Russian oligarchs who fled to the UK etc, with ill gotten gains (money) such as Abramovitch and co, who bought up footballl teams, land and UK businesses. The Chinese are now buying up the UK and Africa.

Full circle
Before the war. A bunch of New York Jews were given millions in cash by the capitalist Jew banking cabals to ferment the Communist revolutions in Europe. To gain control and to steal the wealth and hand it over to their fellow banking cabals.

I've just shown you again that a GROUP of Jews controlled the capitalist banks and created and controlled Communism. You want more proof, it's all out there and on this forum.
Any wonder why the most pro Communists on the forum are Jewish...

We could focus further ahead and remember the past.

Look back into the past to see when the seeds of the Chinese syndrome today started, "Hong Kong Lease".

Forget Jews forget factions they are mearly labels, what matters to our so called masters is the bones and sinews of the "Cheapest Labour", willing or not, here is where we fail to see the wood for the trees, Yet cut them down without a second thought, when we let this and the skills from the fruits of our childrens labour go without thinking of the long term droughts and damages that follow such models we are destined to fail, this is expected you know.

And here is how the whole can stop the continual theft of their own, part not with your labours in order to survive or you will also become the slave.

One has seen the preperations for the next global scale industrial brave new world lying empty in Chinese eyes and all brand new, re-skill yourselves now otherwise go live there, or suffer wishing you had better prepared for it.

This we know to be true, the evidence is standing there to be seen, it is just about to begin again, the new empire is already here, the largest industrial revolutions are always followed by the greatest wars and the greatest famines, the cyclical abandonment of mankind and all reasoning has already begun, save yourselves and yours sanity.

Robert Thurman :: How to Save the World Interview - YouTube

Robert Thurman :: How to Save the World Interview - YouTube

Skill up and help the ones left who are capable to help themselves, these will eventually be the ones who will pick up the many broken pieces afterwards.

[guevarista]

I see you constantly repeating this skill up mantra, what exactly do you mean, military training/kung fu/arms training/oratory skills?

[tinyint]

Originally Posted by guevarista

I see you constantly repeating this skill up mantra, what exactly do you mean, military training/kung fu/arms training/oratory skills?

I guess he means how to plant seeds, to cultivate the soil.
No weapons needed, however as a good communists you may want to try to force the earthworms to be equal with the bugs.

[guevarista]

For those banging on about how the Neo-Liberal main parties are all marxists such ignorance, (but I think it's less innocent personally) I only excerpted part of this one, the article is quite long so I doubt many will read it.

1997, yes 1997 this was written, what did you do in the war dad

In Defence of Marxism
International Marxist Tendency


A Socialist Alternative to the European Union
Written by Alan Woods Wednesday, 04 June 1997

This long document by Alan Woods provides a comprehensive answer to many key questions for the European labour movement. What is Maastricht? Why are they introducing all these cuts? Would it be better without Maastricht? Will it succeed? And most important of all, how do we fight it and what is our alternative.

A fundamental change is taking place on a world scale. In the midst of a boom, we are witnessing an unprecedented onslaught on living standards in every continent. In the USA, Japan and Europe, the ruling class is attempting to put the clock back, cutting state expenditure, dismantling the welfare state, and destroying all the gains of the past fifty years. This is not an accident. Marxists have explained the reasons many times. In the past period the capitalist system has gone beyond its limits. Now it is compelled to retreat, relinquishing the old Keynesian policies of state intervention and managed capitalism. The same economists who previously saw the state as the source of their salvation now regard it as the source of all their ills. They have belatedly understood what the Marxists pointed out decades ago - that, on a capitalist basis, the policy of deficit financing would eventually lead to an explosion of inflation.

The old discredited Keynesian methods everywhere led to huge deficits in public spending. The capitalists and their governments know that a continuation of such methods would lead to two things: uncontrolled inflation and an explosion of the class struggle. That is why everywhere they are obsessed with the idea of cutting state expenditure. From a capitalist point of view, they have no alternative. At the present time, the economists have the delusion that, by keeping a low rate of growth and controlling inflation they can avoid the normal capitalist economic cycle of booms and slumps....

...The decline of Europe

The Common Market was established as an attempt by the European bourgeois to overcome the narrow confines of the nation state, with its limited market. Historically the nation state played an essential role in developing capitalism, which served in the first instance to protect and develop the home market. However, with the development of communications, technique, science, multinational companies, and the world market, the productive forces came into conflict with the limitation of national state boundaries as well as private ownership of the means of production. Capitalism and the nation state from being a source of enormous progress became a colossal fetter and impediment to the harmonious development of production. This contradiction reflected itself in the world wars of 1914-18 and 1939-45 and the crisis of the inter-war period.

The development of world trade in the post war period allowed the capitalist system to overcome this contradiction, at any rate partially and for a temporary period. The separate national markets of Britain, France, Germany, and the others, were far too small for the giant monopolies. The Common Market was created in an attempt to overcome this limitation. The big monopolies looked forward to an unrestricted regional market of hundreds of millions, and beyond that to the world market. On the basis of the economic upswing, the European capitalists were largely successful in establishing this glorified customs union, where the abolition of tariffs between the countries of the Common Market and a common tariff with the rest of the world served to develop and stimulate world trade.

In the Communist Manifesto, written in 1847, Marx and Engels showed that capitalism, which first arises in the form of the nation state, inevitably creates a world market. The crushing domination of the world market is, in fact, the most decisive feature of the epoch in which we live. No country, no matter how big and powerful, can escape from the pull of the world market. The total failure of "socialism in one country" in Russia and China is sufficient proof of this assertion. So is the fact that both the major wars of the 20th century were fought out on a world scale and were wars for world domination....

http://www.marxist.com/britain-european-union040697.htm

Seattle '99

[flyermay]

Originally Posted by andyh

You got there in the end.

Never said communism was an easy path, and never said it was perfect... actually, never said I'm a communist (in the Marxist sense).

[griswald]

If you or your community are not the main beneficiary of your labour and skillsets, then you are passing all your wealth and energy further up the food chain of governence, to those that will profit from it, and those that will keep whatever "ism " is the political choice of the day, in order to keep doing that.

You need to get whatever knowledge or skills that help you to remove your reliance on any political system in existence at the time, and you need to help others do likewise. Or you risk staying a serf, within any system.

Reliance on any existing governing ethos, maintains its momentum. If you want to change it for the better, you need to stop feeding it, and the only way to do that is to engage your abilities and labour, thereby disengaging the engine that drives the system you despise.

And the only way to do that, is to help each other, and ourselves.

Yes, skill up, and do it now, I personally feel that it is an important thing to do.
Am I the only one that agrees with the apprentice,s train of thought on this

griswald

[flyermay]

Originally Posted by rbl_4nik8r

Who gives a fuck, I sure don't, its not up to me or anyone else to feed them, and if they joined together maybe they might find away to feed themselves.

Communism or Marxism will never work because you want what I and others got for the greater good, and I and many others could careless about the greater good, because its not good for me to give up everything I own or achieved in life.

I am GREEDY ? Your damn right I am and yes I may have more then you or be better off then you, but my wife and I worked our asses off to get more and better STUFF.

Yes I am Materialistic because I got STUFF, and most likely your lacking STUFF so you want others STUFF, but it don't work that way because we have guns and we can shoot you if you try to take our STUFF.

Communism or Marxism has never worked in any country because all it take is 1 person to want more STUFF or feel they are cheated by the system and it fails.

@ elpressiedente if everyone had a spiritial epiphany and GREED was no longer a factor and everyone gave up STUFF, you just might be able to get away with it, but I will never conform so its not going to happen in my life time.


4nE

That's a sad answer... and this is exactly the main reason I oppose capitalism; it simply turns nice people into what you just described.

[flyermay]

Originally Posted by rbl_4nik8r

Oh yes another trait that you won't see in Communism or Marxism and that's Compassion, or the ability to give to others less fortunate then you. Good points about giving but we both think freely and have common sense to me the only good Commie is a dead Commie.


4nE

Don't be cynic... there are Cuban doctors working for free all over South America; why, because they also got everything for free.

This are real doctors, not those that diagnose you the most expensive treatment thinking on a bigger boat.

[flyermay]

Originally Posted by arcyclus

Communism is forced sharing. Communism does not work, that is why it has to be forced on others. Truth needs no force to back it up.

No it's not... it's common ownership, not forced sharing.

Force sharing only applies to capitalists... communism has been a constant since the dawn of man; and the only reason the human kind made it so far.

[flyermay]

Originally Posted by knightofthegrail

If you want a vision of Socialism, look at the armed forces as that is precisely the principle which they are based upon.

That's a pretty good analogy... if it wasn't for the extreme authoritarians; which communism also seeks to get rid of, by the way.

But, let's make a comparison... would the armed forces be so efficient and effective following a capitalist system (each for its own)?

[tinyint]

Originally Posted by griswald

And the only way to do that, is to help each other, and ourselves.

Yes, skill up, and do it now, I personally feel that it is an important thing to do.
Am I the only one that agrees with the apprentice,s train of thought on this

griswald

No, you are not alone.

I would recommend especially people in US/UK to learn "gardening", what is coming to them will not be pleasant, and such skills will be needed in order to survive.
Their financial domestic terrorists have destroyed the base of life in all aspects.

[guevarista]

Originally Posted by griswald

If you or your community are not the main beneficiary of your labour and skillsets, then you are passing all your wealth and energy further up the food chain of governence, to those that will profit from it, and those that will keep whatever "ism " is the political choice of the day, in order to keep doing that.

You need to get whatever knowledge or skills that help you to remove your reliance on any political system in existence at the time, and you need to help others do likewise. Or you risk staying a serf, within any system.

Reliance on any existing governing ethos, maintains its momentum. If you want to change it for the better, you need to stop feeding it, and the only way to do that is to engage your abilities and labour, thereby disengaging the engine that drives the system you despise.

And the only way to do that, is to help each other, and ourselves.

Yes, skill up, and do it now, I personally feel that it is an important thing to do.
Am I the only one that agrees with the apprentice,s train of thought on this

griswald

Hang on, so Arbeit Macht Frei afterall>>?

[the apprentice]

Originally Posted by guevarista

I see you constantly repeating this skill up mantra, what exactly do you mean, military training/kung fu/arms training/oratory skills?

Hahaha, then here my mantra and my minuites dear freind.

Sorry for the laughter, but a military was originally designed to protect a populous not to destroy it, kung who, hell no, have you seen the effect of martial arts expert after and against a crowd of angry women all with a handbag full of rocks, lol.

What skills, why any skills mate, needed to bring you better security in times of any kind of drought, you know the Asian type we are forced to by into so we can all stop working and live off of the cheap labour our jobs have been given too.

Skills, Like servicing your own cars/brakes/cam belt/head gasket, making and repairing your childrens footware because they simply don't last like they used to, growing as much food as possible to beat inflation, seasoned first aid skills to save your loved ones lives instead of standing panicing and watching them die in front of you because the system is much slower than usual.
Heavens I could go on forever, knowing how to wire and plumb your own house, repair a myriad of different things with your hands not someone else thousands of miles away, these kinds.

It is blatently obvious I would have thought GV, of the many young and forever young leaving the established mind schools with letters after their names and no where to ply their thoughts and useless bit of paper flying out the windows called non coopertunity from their governments and going out of date before they actually use them, this is the forever young part where they have only learning how to get deeper in learned debt because the supermarket beconns, my own family have fallen foul of this scenario the last time these things happened, I decided to skill up instead of being forever young and am I glad I did rigjt now.

There are signs and symptoms of a slow creeping disease within society, we can all feel it because it makes us all feel uneasy, the cause of which is not exactly hidden any more.

But nobody want to face it's reality, we are all told that it's mearly globalisation and the noble institutions are going to care for us until our old age, heh, and to become green by collecting what, Kelp.

To live austerly and die childless, to energise well-being and put on a happy face, lol, laugh at missfortune and be content in our place because things can only get better, due to 37,000 seasonal workers having just been hired as a sign of a recovery.
Like the medieval peasant bowing down at the sight of a professional with lots of letters after their name, then how do they expect us to do that when they are strugling and having to work your gain in order of surviving to.

That ring any bells to see we are on our own mate and need the real life skills in order of making ends meet.

Not a mantra mate, real advice for those who would like to know how to help themselves out there on their own.

Like Icke says, it's not a bloody joke.

On a more jovial angle, did you know they have just renamed a region in China and called it jeapordy, like the Japanese once did a prefecture Sheffield, there are plenty of jobs and work but they also say no experience or skills are needed.

If I am totally wrong with my conjecture, history and intuition that nobody wants to hear, then I will eat my tweed tribly.

[the apprentice]

Originally Posted by tinyint

I guess he means how to plant seeds, to cultivate the soil.
No weapons needed, however as a good communists you may want to try to force the earthworms to be equal with the bugs.

You could have gone on to say TT, that the worms are natures unpaid servants but you don't hear them complaining

[the apprentice]

Originally Posted by flyermay

Don't be cynic... there are Cuban doctors working for free all over South America; why, because they also got everything for free.

This are real doctors, not those that diagnose you the most expensive treatment thinking on a bigger boat.

Good point and the very PR or paradigm in question here and now.

And what I mentioned earlier about skills, these doctors are some of the very best in the world today, they have a skill which once honed can be plied anywhere or at home, especially in the home, where our hearts and minds should be, this includes all homes.

When the drough has well and truly come home to roost at a place near those who ignore the paramount importance of a skill and a valuble alternative which several will bring them.

Only then they will know what all the fuss is about.

[tinyint]

Originally Posted by the apprentice

You could have gone on to say TT, that the worms are natures unpaid servants but you don't hear them complaining

Hörst du die Regenwürmer husten 2012 - das Original (Sebastian Bach) - YouTube

Hörst du die Regenwürmer husten 2012 - das Original (Sebastian Bach) - YouTube

What a pity you don't understand the funny lyrics.

It goes like:

"Do you hear the earthworms coughing?"