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Old 19-03-2012, 07:17 PM   #421
heartbeatsalute
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lonestar View Post
back from a great spring break and this is really strong from Osho!



Bruce Lee talks a lot like this and its AWESOME!
Great you had a nice family spring brake lonestar, gald for all of you.
Welcome back friend!

Yes, that is in the TAO, book, I love it, it is quite interesting.
Haven't read what Bruce Lee wrote on it, but must be similar , talking about ying and yang I suppose.
Yeah, wise and poetical.
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 19-03-2012, 07:40 PM   #422
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"Be like water making its way through cracks. Do not be assertive, but adjust to the object, and you shall find a way around or through it. If nothing within you stays rigid, outward things will disclose themselves.

Empty your mind, be formless. Shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.”
― Bruce Lee

one of my favorites.
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Old 19-03-2012, 10:13 PM   #423
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Originally Posted by lonestar View Post
"Be like water making its way through cracks. Do not be assertive, but adjust to the object, and you shall find a way around or through it. If nothing within you stays rigid, outward things will disclose themselves.

Empty your mind, be formless. Shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.”
― Bruce Lee

one of my favorites.
Neat!
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Old 19-03-2012, 10:21 PM   #424
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that Buddha quote a few pages back is pretty powerful. wish i had read it a long time ago.

"Truth is bitter in the beginning, sweet in the end, and lies are sweet in the beginning, bitter in the end"
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Old 19-03-2012, 10:22 PM   #425
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Yoga: the Growth of Consciousness

The evolution of life is to become more and more conscious, but the consciousness is always other
oriented: you are conscious of some thing, some object. Yoga means to be evolving in the dimension
where there is no object and only consciousness remains. Yoga is the method of evolving toward
pure consciousness; not being conscious of something, but being consciousness itself.

When you are conscious of something, you are not conscious of being conscious. Your
consciousness has become focused on something; your attention is not at the source of
consciousness itself. In yoga the effort is to become conscious of both the object and the source.
The consciousness becomes double arrowed. You must be aware of the object, and you must be
simultaneously aware of the subject. Consciousness must become a double arrowed bridge. The
subject must not be lost, it must not become forgotten when you are focused on the object.

This is the first step in yoga. The second step is to drop both the subject and the object and just be
conscious. This pure consciousness is the aim of yoga.
Even without yoga man grows toward becoming more and more conscious, but yoga adds
something, contributes something, to this evolution of consciousness. It changes many things and
transforms many things. The first transformation is a double-arrowed awareness, remembering
yourself at the very moment that there is something else to be conscious of.
The dilemma is this: either you are conscious of some object or you are unconscious. If there are
no outside objects, you fall into a sleep; objects are needed in order for you to be conscious. When
you are totally unoccupied you feel sleepy – you need some object to be conscious of – but when
you have too many objects to be conscious of, you may feel a certain sleeplessness. That is why
a person who is too obsessed with thoughts cannot go into sleep. Objects continue to be there
thoughts continue to be there. He cannot become unconscious; thoughts go on demanding his
attention. And this is how we exist.

With new objects you become more conscious. That is why there is a lust for the new, a longing for
the new. The old becomes boring. The moment you have lived with some object for a while, you
become unconscious of it. You have accepted it, now your attention is not needed; you become
bored. For example, you may not have been conscious of your wife for years because you have
taken her for granted. You no longer see her face, you can’t remember the color of her eyes; for
years you have not really been attentive. Only when she dies will you again become aware that
she was there. That is why wives and husbands become bored. Any object that is not calling your
attention continuously creates boredom.

In the same way, a mantra, a repeated sound vibration, causes deep sleep. When a particular
mantra is being repeated continuously, you are bored. There is nothing mysterious about it.

Constantly repeating a particular word bores you, you cannot live with it anymore. Now you will
begin to feel sleepy, you will go into a sort of sleep; you will become unconscious. The whole
method of hypnosis, in fact, depends upon boredom. If your mind can be bored with something then
you go into a sleep, sleep can be induced.
Our whole consciousness depends on new objects. That is why there is so much longing for the new
– for new sensations, a new dress, a new house – for anything that is new, even if it is not better.

With something different, you feel a sudden upsurge of consciousness.
Because life is an evolution of consciousness – this is good. As far as life is concerned, it is good. If
a society is longing for new sensations, life progresses, but if it settles down with the old, not asking
for the new, it becomes dead; consciousness cannot evolve.

For example, in the East we try to be content with things as they are. This creates a boredom
because nothing is ever new. Then for centuries everything goes on continuously as it is. You are
just bored. Of course, you can sleep better – the West cannot sleep; insomnia is bound to exist
when you are constantly asking for the new – but there is no evolution. And these are the two things
that seem to happen: either the whole society becomes sleepy and dead, as has happened in the
East, or else the society becomes sleepless, as has happened in the West.
Neither is good. You need a mind that can be aware even when there are no new objects. Really,
you need a consciousness that is not bound with the new, not bound with the object. If it is bound
with the object, it is going to be bound with the new. You need a consciousness that is not bound
with the object at all, which is beyond object. Then you have freedom: you can go to sleep when
you like, and you can be awake when you like; no object is needed to help you. You become free,
really free, from the objective world.
The moment you are beyond object you go beyond subject also, because they both exist co-jointly.

Really, subjectivity and objectivity are two poles of one thing. When there is an object you are a
subject, but if you can be aware without the object, there is no subject, no self.

This is to be understood very deeply: when the object is lost and you can be conscious without
objects – just conscious – then the subject is also lost. It cannot remain there. It cannot! Both are
lost, and there is simply consciousness, unbounded consciousness. Now there are no boundaries.

Neither the object is the boundary nor the subject.
Buddha used to say that when you are in meditation there is no self, no atman, because the very
awareness of one’s self isolates you from everything else. If you are still there, objects are still there.

”I am,” but ”I” cannot exist in total loneliness; ”I” exists in relationship with the outside world. ”I” is a
relata. Then the self, the ”I am,” is just something inside you that exists in relationship to something
outside. But if the outside is not there this inside dissolves; then there is simple, spontaneous
consciousness.

This is what yoga is for, this is what yoga means. Yoga is the science of freeing yourself from subject
and object boundaries, and unless you are free from these boundaries, you will fall into either the
unbalance of the East or the unbalance of the West.
If you want contentment, peace of mind, silence, sleep, then it is good to remain with the same
objects continuously. For centuries and centuries there should be no visible change. Then you are
at ease, you can sleep better, but this is nothing spiritual; you lose much. The very urge to grow is
lost, the very urge for adventure is lost, the very urge to inquire and to find is lost. Really, you begin
to vegetate, you become stagnant.
If you change this, then you become dynamic but also diseased: you become dynamic but tense,
dynamic but mad. You begin to find the new, to inquire for the new, but you are in a whirlwind. The
new begins to happen, but you are lost.

If you lose your objectivity, you become too subjective and dreamy, but if you become too obsessed
with objects, you lose the subjective. Both situations are unbalanced. The East has tried one; the
West has tried the other.

And now the East is turning Western and the West is turning Eastern. In the East the attraction is
for Western technology, Western science, Western rationalism. Einstein, Aristotle, and Russell have
taken hold of the Eastern mind, while in the West quite the opposite is happening: Buddha, zen
and yoga have become more significant. This is a miracle. The East is turning communist, Marxist,
materialist, and the West is beginning to think in terms of expanding consciousness – meditation,
spirituality, ecstasy. The wheel can turn and we can change our burdens. It will be illuminating for a
moment, but then the whole nonsense will begin again.

The East has failed in one way and the West has failed in another way, because they both tried
denying one part of the mind. You have to transcend both parts and not be concerned with one
while denying the other. Mind is a totality; you can either transcend it totally or you cannot transcend
it. If you go on denying one part, the denied part will take its revenge. And, really, the denied part in
the East is taking its revenge in the East, and the denied part in the West is taking its revenge in the
West.

You can never go beyond the denied; it is there, and it goes on gathering more and more strength.
The very moment when the part you have accepted succeeds is the moment of failure. Nothing fails
like success. With any partial success – with the success of one part of you – you are bound to go
into deeper failure. That which you have gained becomes unconscious and that which you have lost
comes into awareness.


Absence is felt more. If you becomes aware of the absence and goes to
the absent tooth. It has never gone there before – never – but now you can’t stop it; it continually
moves to the vacant place to feel the tooth that is not there.
In the same way, when one part of the mind succeeds, you become aware of the failure of the
other part – the part that could have been and is not. Now the East has become conscious of the
foolishness of not being scientific: it is the reason why we are poor, it is the reason why we are
”no one.” This absence is being felt now and the East has begun to turn Western, while the West is
feeling its own foolishness, its lack of integration.

Yoga means a total science of man. It is not simply religion. It is the total science of man, the total
transcendence of all the parts. And when you transcend parts, you become whole. The whole is
not just an accumulation of the parts; it is not a mechanical thing in which all the parts are put in
alignment and then there is a whole. No, it is more than a mechanical thing; it is like something
artistic.

You can divide a poem into words but then the words mean nothing, and when the whole is there, it
is more than words; it has its own identity. It has gaps as well as words, and sometimes gaps are
more meaningful than words. A poem becomes poetry only when it says something that has not
really been said, when something about it transcends all the parts. If you divide and analyze it, then
you have only the parts, and the transcendental flower that was really the thing is lost.

So consciousness is a wholeness. By denying a part you lose something – something that was
really significant. And you gain nothing; you gain only extremes. Every extreme becomes a disease,
every extreme becomes an illness inside, then you go on and on in turmoil; there is an inner anarchy.

Yoga is the science of transcending anarchy, the science of making your consciousness whole –
and you become whole only when you transcend parts. So yoga is neither religion nor science. It is
both. Or, it transcends both. You can say it is a scientific religion or a religious science. That is why
yoga can be used by anyone belonging to any religion; it can be used by anyone with any type of
mind.

In India, all the religions that have developed have very different – in fact, antagonistic – philosophies,
concepts, perceptions. They have nothing in common. Between Hinduism and Jainism there is
nothing in common; between Hinduism and Buddhism there is nothing in common. There is only
one common thing that none of these religions can deny: yoga.
Buddha says, ”There is no body, there is no soul,” but he cannot say, ”There is no yoga.” Mahavira
says, ”There is no body, but there is a soul,” but he cannot say, ”There is no yoga.” Hinduism says,
”There is body, there is soul – and there is yoga.” Yoga remains constant. Even Christianity cannot
deny it; even Mohammedanism cannot deny it.
In fact, even someone who is totally atheistically oriented cannot deny yoga because yoga doesn’t
make it a precondition to believe in God. Yoga has no preconditions; yoga is absolutely experiential.

When the concept of God is mentioned – and in the most ancient yoga books it was never mentioned
at all – it is mentioned only as a method. It can be used as a hypothesis – if it is helpful to someone
it can be used – but it is not an absolute condition. That is why Buddha can be a yogi without God,
without the Vedas, without any belief. Without any faith, any so-called faith, he can be a yogi.

So for theists, or even for an atheist, yoga can become a common ground. It can become a bridge
between science and religion. It is rational and irrational simultaneously. The methodology is totally
rational, but through the methodology you move deep into the mystery of the irrational. The whole
process is so rational – every step is so rational, so scientific, it is so logical – that you just have to
do it and everything else follows.

Jung mentions that in the nineteenth century no Westerner concerned with psychology could
conceive of anything beyond the conscious mind or below the conscious mind, because mind means
consciousness. So how can there be an unconscious mind? It is absurd, non-scientific. Then, in
the twentieth century, as science learned more about the unconscious, a theory of the unconscious
mind developed. Then, when they went even deeper, they had to accept the idea of a collective
unconscious, not only an individual one. It looked absurd – mind means something individual, so
how could there be a collective mind – but now they have even accepted the concept of the collective
mind.

These are the first three divisions of Buddhist psychology, of Buddhist yoga – the first three. Then
Buddha goes on dividing into one hundred and sixty more divisions. Jung says, ”Before we denied
these three, now we accept them. It may be that others also exist. We have only to proceed step
by step, we have only to go into it further.” Jung’s approach is very rational, one deeply rooted in the
West.

With yoga, you have to proceed rationally, but only in order to jump into the irrational. The end is
bound to be irrational. That which you can understand – the rational – cannot be the source because
it is finite. The source must be greater than you. The source from which you have come, from which
everything has come, the whole universe has come – and where it goes down and disappears again
– must be more than this. The manifestation must be less than the source. A rational mind can feel
and understand the manifested, but the unmanifested remains behind.

Yoga does not insist that one must be rational. It says, ”It is rational to conceive of something
irrational. It is rational, really, to conceive of the boundaries of the rational.” A true, authentic mind
always knows the limitations of reason, always knows that reason ends somewhere. Anyone who is
authentically rational has to come to a point where the irrational is felt. If you proceed with reason
toward the ultimate, the boundary will be felt.

Einstein felt it; Wittgenstein felt it. Wittgenstein’s TRACTATUS is one of the most rational books ever
written; he is one of the most rationalistic minds. He goes on talking about existence in a very logical
way, a very rational way. His expressions – words, language, everything – is rational, but then he
says, ”There are some things about which, there is a point beyond which, nothing can be said, and
I must remain silent about it.” Then he writes, ”That which cannot be said must not be said.”

The whole edifice falls: the whole edifice! Wittgenstein was trying to be rational about the entire
phenomenon of life and existence, and then suddenly a point comes and he says, ”Now, beyond
this point, nothing can be said.” This says something – something very significant. Something is
there now and nothing can be said about it. Now there is a point that cannot be defined, where all
definitions simply fall down.

Whenever there has been an authentic, logical mind, it comes to this point. Einstein died a mystic –
and more of a mystic than your so-called mystics, because if you are a mystic without ever having
tried to follow the path of reason you can never be deep in mysticism. You have not really known the
boundaries. I have seen mystics who go on talking about God as a logical concept, as an argument.

There have been Christian mystics who have been trying to ”prove” God. What nonsense! If even
God can be proved, you leave nothing unproved, and the unproved is the source.

One who has experienced something of the divine will not try to prove it because the very effort to
prove shows that one has never been in contact with the original source of life – which is unprovable,
which cannot be proved. The whole cannot be proved by the part. For example, my hand cannot
prove my existence. My hand cannot be more than me; it cannot cover me. It is foolishness to try.

But if the hand can cover itself completely, it is more than enough; the moment the hand knows
itself, it also knows that it is rooted in something more, that it is constantly one with something more.

It is there because that ”more” is also there.
If I die, my hand will also die; it only existed because of me. The whole remains unproved; only the
parts are known. We cannot prove the whole, but we can feel it; the hand cannot prove me, but the
hand can feel me. It can go deep inside itself, and when it reaches the depths, it is me.

The so-called mystics who are annoyed with reason are not real mystics. A real mystic is never
annoyed with reason; he can play with it. And he can play with reason because he knows reason
cannot destroy the mystery of life. So-called mystics and religious people who are afraid of reason,
of logic, of argument, are really afraid of themselves. Any argument against them may create inner
doubts; it may help their inner doubts to emerge. They are afraid of themselves.

The Christian mystic Tertullian says, ”I believe in God because I cannot prove him; I believe in God
because it is impossible to believe.” This is how a real mystic will feel: ”It is impossible; that is why
I believe.” If it is possible, then there is no need to believe. It becomes just a concept, an ordinary
concept.

This is what mystics have always meant by faith, by belief. It is not something intellectual, it is not a
concept; it is a jump into the impossible. But you can only jump into the mysterious from the edge
of reason, never before. How can you do it before? You can jump only when you have stretched
reason to its logical extremes. You have come to a point that reason cannot go beyond, and the
beyond remains. Now you know that reason cannot take a single step further and yet the ”further”
remains. Even if you decide to remain with reason, a boundary is created. You know that existence
is beyond the boundary of reason, so even if you do not go beyond this boundary, you become a
mystic. Even if you do not take the jump you become a mystic because you have known something,
you have encountered something that was not rational at all.
All that reason can know you have known. Now something is encountered that reason cannot know.

If you take the jump, you have to leave reason behind; you cannot take the jump with reason itself.

This is what faith is. Faith is not against reason; it is beyond it. It is not antirational; it is irrational.

Yoga is the method of bringing you to the extreme limit of reason – and not only a method to bring
you to the extreme, but also a method to take the jump.
How to take the jump? Einstein, for example, would have flowered like a Buddha if he had known
something about meditative methods. He was just on the verge, many times in his life he came to
the point from which a jump was possible. But again and again he missed: he was entangled, again,
in reason. And in the end, he was frustrated by his whole life of reason.
The same thing could have happened with Buddha. He also had a very rational mind, but there was
something possible for him, a method that could be used. Not only does reason have its methods,
irrationality also has methods. Reason has its own methods; irrationality has its own methods.

Yoga is ultimately concerned with irrational methods; only in the beginning can rational methods be
used. They are just to persuade you, to push you, to persuade your reason to move toward the limit.

And if you have come to the limit, you will take the ultimate jump.
Gurdjieff worked with a certain group on some deep, irrational methods. He was working with a
group of seekers and using a particular irrational method. He used to call it a Stop Exercise. For
example, you would be with him and suddenly he would say, ”Stop!” Then everyone had to stop
as he is – totally stop. If the hand was in a certain place, the hand must stop there. If the eyes
were open, they would have to remain open; if the mouth was open – you were just about to say
something – the mouth would have to remain as it was. No movement!
This method begins with the body. If there is no movement in the body, suddenly there is no
movement in the mind. The two are associated: you cannot move your body without some inner
movement of the mind, and you cannot stop your body totally without stopping the inner movement
of the mind. Body and mind are not two things; they are one energy. The energy is more dense in
the body than it is in the mind; the density differs, the frequency of the wavelength differs, but it is
the same wave, the same flow of energy.

Seekers were practicing this Stop Exercise continually for one month. One day Gurdjieff was in his
tent and three seekers were walking through a dry canal that was on the grounds. It was a dry canal;
no water was flowing in it. Suddenly, from his tent, Gurdjieff cried, ”Stop!” Everyone on the bank
of the canal stopped. The three who were in the canal also stopped. It was dry, so there was no
problem.

Then suddenly there was an onrush of water. Someone had opened the water supply and water
rushed into the canal. When it had come up to the necks of the three, one of them jumped out of the
canal thinking, ”Gurdjieff does not know what is happening. He is in his tent and he is unaware of
the fact that water has come into the canal.” The man thought, ”I must jump out. Now it is irrational
to be here,” and he jumped out.

The other two remained in the canal as the water became higher and higher. Finally it reached their
noses and the second man thought, ”This is the limit! I have not come here to die. I have come here
to know eternal life, not to lose this one,” and he jumped out of the canal.
The third man remained. The same problem faced him, too, but he decided to remain because
Gurdjieff had said that this was an irrational exercise and if it was done with reason, the whole thing
would be destroyed. He thought, ”Okay, I accept death, but I cannot stop this exercise,” and he
remained there.

Now water was flowing above his head. Gurdjieff jumped out of his tent and into the canal and
brought him out. He was just on the verge of death. But when he revived, he was a transformed
man. He was not the same one who was standing and doing the exercise; he was transformed
totally. He had known something; he had taken the jump.
Where is the limit? If you continue with reason, you may miss. You go on falling back. Sometimes
one has to suddenly take a step that leads you beyond. That step becomes a transformation;
the division is transcended. Whether you say that this division is between the conscious and the
unconscious, between reason and nonreason, science and religion, or East and West – division
must be transcended. That is what yoga is: a transcendence. Then you can come back to reason,
but you will be transformed. You can even reason things out, but you will be beyond reason.


MEDITATION: THE ART OF ECSTASY, OSHO
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 19-03-2012, 10:39 PM   #426
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lonestar View Post
that Buddha quote a few pages back is pretty powerful. wish i had read it a long time ago.

"Truth is bitter in the beginning, sweet in the end, and lies are sweet in the beginning, bitter in the end"
Yes, I remember that one, seen it many times, and feel it is so true.
But everything comes to us at the right moment lonestar

I was looking for an interesting story ,can't find it now.
It's about a King in a town where there was a well, and everybody
drunk from that well, and were slowly getting unconcious, and mad.

Were doing all kind of crazy things. The only one who had not drank from
that well was the king ,so he was not mad, and quite sober compared to this crowd of mad people.

They began, to destroy things, and kept drinking water from that well,
and insisted the King drink from the well, the same way they did.
The king refused.

Finally they took over the town, and put unbearable pressure on the king,
saying they would elect him as their authority, only if he drank from the well.

The king was scared, but did not want to stop being the king.
So finally, after infinite pressures, he was made to drink from the well.

And slowly, by and by, began to feel mad ,and unconciouus as the crowd,
lost his sense of being conscious, and felt good and happy with the crowd.
And the crowd applauded him and loved him from there on.

This is to show how easily society can prevent you from being yourself.

It was a sufi story, I paraphrased it, couldn't find it, but that is it anyway lonestar.

Found it! Here it is:


http://www.osho.com/online-library-r...cb2e2-530.aspx
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 20-03-2012, 01:04 AM   #427
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When meditation happens, your whole life will
become a meditation, a celebration...Meditation is an
invitation to personal transformation.--OSHO
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 20-03-2012, 01:40 AM   #428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heartbeatsalute View Post

everything comes to us at the right moment

I was looking for an interesting story ,can't find it now.
It's about a King in a town where there was a well, and everybody
drunk from that well, and were slowly getting unconcious, and mad.

Were doing all kind of crazy things. The only one who had not drank from
that well was the king ,so he was not mad, and quite sober compared to this crowd of mad people.

They began, to destroy things, and kept drinking water from that well,
and insisted the King drink from the well, the same way they did.
The king refused.

Finally they took over the town, and put unbearable pressure on the king,
saying they would elect him as their authority, only if he drank from the well.

The king was scared, but did not want to stop being the king.
So finally, after infinite pressures, he was made to drink from the well.

And slowly, by and by, began to feel mad ,and unconciouus as the crowd,
lost his sense of being conscious, and felt good and happy with the crowd.
And the crowd applauded him and loved him from there on.

This is to show how easily society can prevent you from being yourself.

It was a sufi story, I paraphrased it, couldn't find it, but that is it anyway lonestar.

Found it! Here it is:


http://www.osho.com/online-library-r...cb2e2-530.aspx
great paraphrasing!

"this is to show how easily society can prevent you from being yourself."

Yes!

and as i start to realize this, its very humbling.

Last edited by lonestar; 20-03-2012 at 01:48 AM.
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Old 20-03-2012, 04:28 AM   #429
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PERFORMING SAMYAMA ON THE PRESENT MOMENT,
THE MOMENT GONE, AND THE MOMENT TO COME BRINGS
KNOWLEDGE BORN OF THE AWARENESS OF THE ULTIMATE REALITY.
FROM THIS COMES THE ABILITY TO DISTINGUISH
BETWEEN SIMILAR OBJECTS WHICH CANNOT BE IDENTIFIED
BY CLASS, CHARACTER, OR PLACE.
THE HIGHEST KNOWLEDGE BORN OF THE AWARENESS OF REALITY
IS TRANSCENDENT,
INCLUDES THE COGNITION OF ALL OBJECTS SIMULTANEOUSLY, PERTAINS TO ALL OBJECTS AND PROCESSES WHATSOEVER -- IN THE PAST, THE PRESENT, AND THE FUTURE AND TRANSCENDS THE WORLD PROCESS.








WHAT is time?

Now Patanjali asks the timeless question, the perennial question and he comes to it at the very end of "Vibhuti Pada" because to know time is the greatest miracle. To know what time is, is to know what life is. To know what time is, is to know what truth is. Before we enter into the sutras, many things have to be understood; they will become an introduction to the sutras.

Ordinarily what we call time is not real time. It is chronological time. So remember that time can be divided, classified, in three ways. One is "chronological," another is "psychological," and the third is "real." The chronological time is clock time. It is utilitarian; it is not real. It is just a belief agreed upon by the society. We have agreed to divide the day into twenty-four hours. It is very arbitrary that the earth moves in one complete circle on its axis in twenty-four hours; we have decided to divide it into twenty-four. Then we have decided to divide each hour into sixty minutes.

There is no intrinsic necessity to divide it that way. Some other civilization may divide it in a different way. We can divide the hour into a hundred minutes and nobody is going to prevent us. Then each minute we have divided into sixty seconds. That too is arbitrary, just utilitarian. It is clock time. It is needed; otherwise society will fall apart.

Something as a common standard is a necessity -- just like money, currency money. A hundred-rupee note,-a ten-dollar bill, or anything else -- it is just a common belief the society has agreed to use. But it has nothing to do with existence. If man disappears from the earth, the pound sterling, the dollar, rupees will all disappear immediately. The earth will be without money immediately without man. Rocks will be there, flowers will still flower, the spring will come and birds will sing, and in the fall old leaves will fall; but there will be no money. Even if there are piles of money on the roads, it will not be money at all, because to call it money a man is needed, to respect it as money a man is needed.

The government goes on promising, on each note the promise is written: The Finance Governor promises to pay you ten rupees worth of gold if you produce this note at the bank. It is just a promise. When there is nobody to promise, the currency disappears.

When man is not there on the earth, clocks may go on chiming time, but it will not be time at all. Nobody will bother, nobody will look at them. Clock time will stop immediately if man is not there; so it is man-created, a social by-product.

The higher a society moves -- and when I say "higher" I mean the more complex it becomes -- the more and more it becomes obsessed with chronological time. A primitive man has no use for a watch. If you present him a watch, he will be simply puzzled, for what? What is he going to do with it? A civilized man cannot live without a watch. It is almost impossible to live in-a civilized society without a watch because the whole society runs according to the clock, even sometimes to ridiculous states.

I will tell you one anecdote.
There came a loud knock at the door just as the doctor had settled down for sleep. He got up and asked the man at the door, "What is it!"
"I have been bitten by a dog," said the man.
"Well, don't you know that my hours of consultation are between twelve and three?"
"Yes," groaned the patient, "but the dog did not know and he bit me at twenty to four. So what am I supposed to do?"
Dogs don't believe in clocks, and things can go to ridiculous ends.

Once you think in terms of the clock, you forget that this is just utilitarian. It is not real time.

At another doctor's:
The sign behind the desk at the reception portion of the hospital said: Emergency Casualty Registrations. A man staggered in, bruised and muddy. He was plastered with blood bandages, limping on both legs, clutching his arm to stem the flow of blood. He crawled to the desk and groaned, "Doctor, doctor."
The receptionist asked, "Have you an appointment, sir?"

Thus can happen here in this ashram too; it can happen at Sheela's desk.
Once the chronological time is taken too seriously, then one forgets everything else. The whole West is obsessed with time too much. Everything has to be done on time.

One of my friends was travelling in England with one of his English friends, and he was telling me that everything has become so routine that in England you hear expressions like "teatime," "dinnertime," "lunchtime." What do they mean? How can time decide the time for lunch, unless you are feeling hungry? When you say "lunchtime," it means "hunger time" -- now be hungry! And if you are not, then something is wrong with you. Teatime means now be ready for tea. If you are not feeling, then something is wrong with you; you have to take it. By and by people have forgotten their real hunger, their real thirst.
Everything is taken on time. The clock decides. Clock has become the dominator; it dominates. This is a very unreal world, dominated by the clock.

Now there are educationists, psychologists who go on telling the mothers to give the child milk at certain times, after each three hours. The child is crying, the child is hungry;
the mother looks at the clock. It is not time yet. The child is hungry; that is not anything to be worried about. The clock has to be looked at. Because when the child is hungry, the child is not to be believed, but the doctor. Now it is none of the doctor's business to interfere. But once you become obsessed with the unreal, many unreal things enter into your life.

I have heard:
An Irishman fell from a ladder and lay apparently unconscious on the ground. A crowd gathered around him and a doctor was called, who said at once that the poor man was dead. Pat opened his eyes and promptly denied the charge.
"Shh! Pat," said one of the bystanders. "Don't be talking nonsense. Surely the doctor knows best."
Even if you are alive and the doctor says you are dead, you have to behave like a dead man -- because of course the expert knows and he knows the best.

With the chronological time, the world of the expert has come into existence, because you have lost your roots into reality. For everything you have to ask somebody. People come to me and they say, "Osho, tell us how we are feeling." How you are feeling you have to know. But I understand. The touch, the contact, the connectedness with reality is lost. Even how you are feeling you have to go to ask somebody who knows. You have to rely on somebody else. This is unfortunate, but it has happened in slow steps and humanity has not been aware.

Chronological time is not being used now. It is no longer a means; it has almost become an end. Remember, it is false time. It has nothing to do with reality.

Deep down from it, just underneath it, is another time which is not real, but more real than the chronological time; that is psychological time. There is a clock, biological clock, within you. More than men, women are alert to it. They will also not be alert very long because they are trying in every way to imitate men. Still their body functions as an inner clock. After each twenty-eight days, the menstruation comes. The body functions like an inner clock, a-biological clock.

If you watch, then you will see the hunger comes at a certain time every day. If you are well and healthy, then needs fall into a certain pattern, and that pattern is repeated. It is only broken when you are not well; otherwise the body moves on smoothly, runs in a smooth pattern. And if you are aware of that pattern, you will be more alive than the man who lives by the dock. You are closer to reality.

The chronological time is fixed, it has to be fixed, because it is a social necessity; but the psychological time is fluid, it is not so solid, because each person has his own psychology, his Own mind. Have you watched? When you are happy, time goes fast. Your clock will not go fast; the clock has nothing to do with you. It moves at its own pace -- in sixty seconds it moves one minute, in sixty minutes it moves one hour. It will continue; whether you are happy or unhappy doesn't matter. If you are unhappy your mind will be in a different time; if you are happy your mind will be in a different time. If suddenly your beloved comes, unexpectedly knocks at the door, time will almost stop. Hours will pass -- you may not be doing anything, just holding hands and sitting and looking at the moon -- hours will pass, and it will look as if only minutes have passed.

Time goes very, very fast when you are happy. When you are unhappy -- somebody has died, somebody you loved, death has happened -- then time goes very, very, very slowly.

Just the other night Meera came. Her husband died a few months before. She had come to see me after the death, and I had told her don't be worried, the wound will heal. It will take a little time, almost three months. But those three months were just an average because it will depend on the person. Now she came last night again and she said, "Now five months have passed and the pain is still there. Of course it is less, but it is still there, it has not gone; and you had said that within three months it will go." I know. Sometimes it will take one year, sometimes it will take six months, sometimes it may not even take three months, three days will do. It is not chronological; it is psychological. It depends on you, on the relationship, what type of relationship existed between you and your husband.

And I know the relationship was not good. That's why the wound will heal and it will take a long time. This will look paradoxical, but this is how it is. If you have loved a man and he dies, you will feel sad, but you will recover -- soon. There will be no wound. You loved the man; nothing is incomplete. But between Meera and her husband the relationship was not good; for years they were almost separate. She wanted to love but could not love. She wanted to be with him but could not be. Now the husband is gone, and all her hope to be with him is gone with him. She hankered, she desired, she wanted, and it couldn't happen. Now the man is gone; now there is no possibility. Now her aloneness is sealed, now there is no way to love this man. He was alive, she could not love, there were problems between them; now the man is gone, so there is no possibility. Now this wound is going to heal very slowly -- very, very slowly. And even when it is healed there will remain a certain sadness around it forever.

Anything incomplete is very difficult to drop. Complete things ripen and fall on their own accord. When a fruit is ripe it falls. Of course the tree feels for a few seconds something is missing, and then it forgets. Finished, because ripe fruits have to fall. Everybody has to die. You loved while the man was alive -- and you loved tremendously and totally. You are almost fulfilled; you cannot ask for more. As it was, it was already too much. You are grateful that God gave you that much time. He could have taken the man a little earlier, but he gave you enough time, and you loved and you loved. In love even a single moment becomes eternity. You are so happy time stops. A small life becomes very, very intimate. But that has not happened, so I can understand Meera's misery.

But she has to face it and understand it. It is not only a question of the death of the husband. That is not such a big problem. Husbands die, wives die; that is not a big problem, that is natural. The problem is that love could not happen. It remained a dream, a desire, and now it is going to remain unfulfilled. You cannot find that man again, so that chapter cannot be completed. This incompletion will function as a wound. That's why it has taken a longer time. It will take a little longer still.

Psychological time is your inner time; and we live in the chronological time altogether, the Greenwich time -- it is not personal. Psychological time is personal, and each has his own. If you are happy, your sense of time slows down. If you are unhappy time lengthens. If you are deep in meditation time stops. In fact in the East we have been measuring states of mind through time. If time stops completely, then the state is of bliss. If time slows down very much, then the state of misery.

In Christianity it is said that hell is eternal. Bertrand Russell has written a book, WHY I AM NOT A CHRISTIAN, in which he gives many arguments why he is not a Christian.

One of the arguments is this, "I cannot believe that hell can be eternal because whatsoever the sins, they are limited. You cannot do unlimited sins.

So for limited sins unlimited punishment -- it is unjust." The argument is simple. Nobody can argue against Bertrand Russell; he is saying a simple fact. He himself says, "If I am punished for all the sins that I have committed in my whole life, then not more than four years' imprisonment. And even if those sins are included that I have not committed but only thought, then at the most eight years, or a little margin more, ten years. But infinite, eternal hell?" Then God seems to be too revengeful, does not look divine, does not look godly, looks like a very horrible, devilish force.

Because you loved a woman who was not your wife, now you will suffer -- eternally. This is too much. You have not committed such a great sin. It is human to fall in love, and when one falls in love it is difficult to decide whether or not to fall in love with a woman who is not anybody else's wife. Hmm ?... love is almost blind. It possesses you.

Yes, Bertrand Russell seems to be right, his argument seems to be valid; but I say the argument is not valid. He has missed the whole point. And no Christian theologian has answered him on that point yet. They cannot answer because they have also forgotten. They go on talking about theories, but they have forgotten realities. When Jesus says hell is eternal, he means psychological time, not chronological time. Yes, if he means chronological time, then it is absolutely absurd, to throw a man in eternal hell. He means psychological time, He means that one moment in hell will look like eternity. It will slow down so much because you will be in such anguish and pain that even a single moment will look like eternity. You will feel it is not going to end anytime, it is not going to end. You will feel it continues, continues, continues.

It does not say anything about time; it says something about your feeling when you are in deep pain, anguish. And of course hell is the ultimate in pain. And Jesus is perfectly right, Bertrand Russell wrong, but Bertrand Russell misunderstood it because Jesus has not said exactly "psychological" time. He says "eternity" because in those days the language was understood. There was no need to make such qualifications.

The psychological time is personal. You have yours, your wife has hers, your son his; and all are different. That is one of the causes of conflict in the world. You are honking; and the wife says from the window, "I am coming," and she goes on standing before the mirror and you go on honking that "It is time and we will miss the train," and she gets angry, and you get angry. What is happening? Every husband is annoyed when he is sitting in the driver's seat and honking the horn and the wife is still getting ready, still getting ready. She is still choosing the sari. Now trains don't bother about which sari you arc wearing. They leave on time. The husband is puzzled too much, what is going on. Two different psychological times are in conflict.

Man has moved to chronological time; the woman still lives in the psychological time. As far as I sec, women use wristwatches, but they are ornamental. I don't see that they really use them, particularly not in India. I have come across a few women who don't know how to tell time, and they have wristwatches, beautiful gold watches -- they can afford them.

The child lives in a totally different world. The child has his own psychological time, completely unhurried, almost in a dream. He cannot understand you, you cannot understand him. You are far apart; there is no way to bridge. When an old man is talking to a child, he is talking from another planet it never reaches the child. The child cannot sec why there is so much hurry, for what?
Psychological time is absolutely personal. That's why chronological time has become important; otherwise where to meet, how to function, how to be efficient? If everybody comes to the office at his own feeling, then it is impossible to run the of lice. If everybody comes to the station at his own time, then trains can never leave. Something arbitrary has to be fixed.

The chronological time is history, and the psychological time is myth. That is the difference between history and myth. In the West history is written, in the East myth. If you ask when Krishna was born, the exact date, no answer will be coming from anywhere. And it is easy for historians to prove that if you cannot prove on what date, at what time chronologically, Krishna was born, at what place -- if you cannot show the space and time when the event of Krishna's birth happened -- then it is doubtful whether Krishna was ever born or not.

The East has never bothered. The East simply laughs at the whole absurdity of it. What has chronological time to do with Krishna's birth? We don't have any record. Or we have many records, contradictory, contradicting each other.

But, see, I was born on eleventh December. If it can be proved that I was not born on eleventh December, will it be enough proof that I was never born?

In the East nobody remembers his own birthday. Just the other day Vivek was worried about her father's birthday. Maybe it is the twenty-seventh, or some other date, and she is worried that if she writes and asks, then they will feel offended. And I told her I don't know my mother's birthday, my father's birthday, and I don't even know if they know it or not. But that cannot prove that they have never existed or they are not there.

The East has written myth. Myth is totally different; it is with psychological time.

The chronological time moves linearly, in a line. That's why in the West they say there is nothing new under the sun -- but history never repeats itself. Time moves in a line, so how can history repeat in a line? Each event seems to be unique. In the East we say history is a wheel. It does not move linearly; the movement is circular. And in the East we say there is nothing new under the sun and history continuously repeats itself. It is all repetition, so why be worried about when Krishna was born?

In the East we say that in each age Krishna is born again and again and again. It is a wheel. In each period between creation and destruction, Krishna is born again and again. His form may differ, his name may differ, but he is born again and again; so why bother? Just describe who he is and don't be worried too much about nonessential details. So it may be the figure of Krishna may not belong to any Krishna in particular. It may be just a synthesis of all the Krishnas. That's how it is.

If you ask, "Is Buddha's statue true to his image?" -- it is not. Yet it is true because a Buddha has to be like that. It is not a question whether this Buddha -- Gautam Siddharth, son of Shuddhodhan, born in Kapilvastu on a particular date -- was like this statue. No, it is not a point. But all the Buddhas always are synthesized in this statue. They represent. This statue is just a statue of BuddhaHOOD, not of any Buddha in particular. All Buddhas are included in it.

Now this is difficult for the West. You cannot make any difference between Buddha and Mahavir except for a small symbol just down near their feet; otherwise you cannot make much difference. Jainas have twenty-four teerthankeras, twenty-four great Masters, but you cannot make any distinction. Go to a Jaina temple and just look; they all look alike. It is not possible the twenty-four persons were all alike. Impossible. Two persons are never
alike, but those statues don't represent the outward. They represent the inner experience. Yes, two persons cannot be alike, but two experiences can be alike.

When you fall in love and somebody else falls in love, the love is alike. When you meditate, somebody else meditates, the meditation is alike. When you become enlightened and somebody else becomes enlightened, enlightenment is alike. These twenty-four statues of Jaina Masters are not of twenty-four persons but of one state reflected in twenty-four personalities. They are all representative.

If you see Jaina teerthankeras, you will see very long ears, almost touching their shoulders. Now Jainas say that all teerthankeras have very long ears. And there are foolish people who think as if Mahavir really had such long ears.

I was invited by a Jaina, Acharya Tulsi, to one of his conferences. He has very long ears, so one of his disciples came to me and he said, "See, Acharya Tulsiji Maharaj, how long his ears are. That is symbolic of being a great Master. Soon, in one of his lives, he is going to become a teerthankera." Just by coincidence, or by synchronicity, a donkey passed by, so I told that disciple, "Look at Acharya Donkeyji Maharaj. He is already a teerthankera!" The disciple has been angry since then; he has never come to me.

Long ears are just symbolic that these people were capable of hearing, that's all. They were capable of hearing the sound, the soundless sound, the sound of one hand clapping. They were capable of hearing the truth. These statues are just symbolic, not that they are actually representative of some real person. The misinterpretation is foolish, but that's how it goes on. Myth is symbolic.

It is said Ram was born in Ayodhya. Now ayodhya is a state of inner peace; it has nothing to do with the town named Ayodhya. The town is named as a representative of the inner state of ayodhya, a very peaceful, silent, blissful state. Of course Ram has to be born out of that.

That is the meaning of Jesus' birth -- out of a virgin soul. Not that actually he was born of a virgin Mary, no; but out of virginity, out of pureness, innocence, uncorrupted purity of being he was born. That was his real womb.
These are symbolic, these are mythological. They are not chronological.

Historians go on collecting rubbish, unnecessary details. You just look in any history book. You will be surprised. Why are there so many people doing such foolish work? Dates and dates and dates and names and names and names, and they go on and on. And thousands of people waste their whole lives, and they call it research. Then there are journalists, editors, newspaper people; they are chronological. They just go on looking for unnecessary details in the world, for news.

The truth is never news, because it is always there. It does not happen; it has already happened. Untruth is news.

Somebody asked George Bernard Shaw, "What is news?" He said, "When a dog bites a man it is not news, but when a man bites a dog it is news." Because news has to be something new. A dog biting a man is not news because it is not new. It has always been so and it will always be so. But when a man bites a dog, certainly it is news.

You will not find more futile and superficial people than journalists. They have a knack for finding out useless things. Journalists are impotent politicians. Politicians make news; journalists collect news. Journalists are like shadows to politicians. That's why newspapers are full of politicians; from this end to that, from the beginning to the end, just politics, politics, politics. A journalist is one who has failed in making news; now he
collects it. His relationship to the politician is exactly the same as the relationship of a critic to the poet: one who has failed to become a poet, he becomes a critic.

I have heard about a famous actor. In a certain film he needed a horse, and a horse owner brought his horse. It was an ordinary horse, but the owner started praising the horse very highly, and he said, "This is no ordinary horse. Don't go by the form; look at his spirit. He is a very great horse, and he has worked in so many movies that you can almost call him an actor."
Exactly at that moment, the horse broke wind, long and loud.

The actor said, "I can see. He is not only an actor; he is a critic also."

The journalist, the critic, the historian, the politician, they all hang with the chronological time, with the very periphery of life, the most futile and useless effort that goes on in the world -- and has become so important. We have made it so important because we have forgotten that the clock is not life.
The psychological time is dream time. Myth, poetry, love, art, painting, dancing, music, intuition, they all belong to psychological time. You have to move towards psychological time. The chronological time is for the extrovert mind. The psychological time is for the introvert, one who has started moving towards his inner soul.

There are dangers in psychological time also. That's why those who are obsessed with the chronological are against the psychological. There are dangers. There is a danger you may get trapped in it. Then you will become almost insane because you will be out of touch with the world, with people, with the society.

Let me tell you a few anecdotes.

An inoffensive-looking man was busy talking to an old friend of his and completely forgot the time. Suddenly he looked at his watch and said, "Oh, dear, it is three o'clock, and I have an appointment with my psychiatrist at three and it will take at least fifteen minutes to get there."
His friend said, "Now take it easy. You will only be a few minutes late."
"You don't know him. If I am not there on time he will start without me."

There is a danger of taking the dream to be the real. There is a danger of believing in your imagination too much. You can become so obsessed with your inner fantasy, dream world, that you can live in a fog. But even with the dangers it is very important to understand it and to pass through it. But remember, it is a bridge to be passed. When you have passed it, you will come across real time.

Chronological time corresponds to the body, psychological time to the mind, real time to your being. Chronological time is the extroverted mind, psychological time is the introverted mind, and real time is no-mind.

But one has to pass through the psychological. That territory has to be passed, fully alert. You should not make your abode there. It is a bridge to be passed; you should not make your abode there. If you make your abode there you become mad. That's what has happened to many people who are in madhouses. They have forgotten chronological time, they have not reached real time, and they have started living on the bridge, the psychological time. That's why their reality has become personal and private. A madman lives in a private world, and the man you call sane lives in a public world. The public world is with people, the private world is just confined to yourself; but the real world is
neither public nor private. It is universal, it is beyond both. And one has to go beyond both.

A man had a reputation as a road hog. He was lying in a hospital bed after an accident.
The doctor asked the nurse, "How is he this morning?"
She said, "Oh, he keeps putting his right hand out."
"Ah," said the doctor, "he is turning the corner."
A road hog, an automobile addict, even in his sleep goes on driving fast. Whatsoever you do in your dream reflects your desire, your goals, what you would like to have.

The primitive societies live in the psychological time. The East has lived in the psychological time; the West lives in the chronological time. If you move farther into the primitive societies hidden behind the hills and the forests, deep, you will see they live absolutely in psychological time. There are a few primitive societies in which dream is more important than reality, and the first thing a child has to do before breakfast is to relate his dream to his elders. The first thing is psychoanalysis. The dream has to be related to the elders before breakfast, and they all gather together and they analyze the dream. And then they tell the child to do something, because the dream is symbolic and it shows that something is needed to be done.

For example, a child dreams that he has been fighting with a friend, and in the morning he tells the dream to his elders. They will interpret it, and they will send the child with gifts and sweets and toys to the other's house, to the other child, to give him presents, and to tell him his dream. Because he has committed a crime.

In the West you cannot conceive of it. What have you done? You have not done anything, you have simply dreamt, but that particular primitive society says that you dreamt it because you wanted to do something like that, otherwise why? It must be a desire, hidden, repressed. As far as mind is concerned, you have committed it. Go and tell the child so no subtle anger goes on surrounding you. Tell the whole thing and ask his forgiveness and present these gifts to him.

Real gifts for a dream fight... but a miracle has happened to that society. By and by as the child grows, he stops dreaming. Dreams disappear. A grown-up man is one, according to that primitive society, who does not dream. This seems to be beautiful. Of course that society will not be appreciated by psychoanalysts because their whole profession will be gone.

The young girl went to see her psychiatrist and he asked her what she had dreamt on the previous night. She told him that she had not had any dreams at all that night, whereupon he got very angry and said, "Look, if you don't do your homework how can I help you?"

Dreaming is homework; and a psychoanalyst lives off your dreams. He goes on analyzing them. But this is something absurd. You cannot analyze your own dreams; how can somebody else do it? Because psychological time is personal, nobody can understand more than you yourself. Your dreams, how can somebody else understand them? His interpretations are going to be falsifications. His interpretations are going to be his interpretations. When a Freud analyzes your dream, his interpretation will be different. When Jung analyzes the same dream, his interpretation is different. When Adler analyzes
the same dream, his interpretation is different. So what has to be thought about it? You have dreamt one dream and three great psychoanalysts interpret it in three different ways.

Freud reduces everything to sex. Whatsoever you dream makes no difference. He will find a way and reduce it to sex. It seems he was obsessed with sex. He was a great pioneer, he has opened a great door, but he was phobic and he was afraid of sex; and he was afraid of other things also. He was so phobic that he could not cross the road; that was one of his great fears. Now you cannot think of Buddha being afraid? of crossing a road. This man himself is ill. He was so afraid of talking with people, that's why he created psychoanalysis. In psychoanalysis the psychoanalyst sits behind a screen and the patient lies down on a couch and goes on talking and the psychoanalyst simply listens -- no communication. He was afraid to communicate. In personal encounters, person to person, he was always awkward. Now his whole mind has entered into his interpretation. That's natural, that's how it should be.

Jung brings everything to religion, everything. Whatsoever you dream he will interpret in such a way that it becomes a religious dream. The same dream becomes sexual with Freud; with Jung it becomes religious. With Adler it becomes politics. Everything is ambition, and everybody is suffering with an inferiority complex, and everybody is trying to gain more power -- "will to power." And now there are a thousand and one psychoanalysts all over the world, of different denominations. The denominations are as many as in Christianity. So many schools, and every psychoanalyst starts his own school. And nobody is bothered with the patient, that it is his dream.

The problems of the psychoanalysts enter into their analysis, interpretation. This is not a way to help. In fact it is going to make things more complicated. A better society will teach you how to analyze your own dreams, how to psychoanalyze your own dreams. Nobody can be more certain than you because nobody can be closer, only you.

The beautiful young lady went to see a psychiatrist. The doctor looked at her for a few seconds and then said, "Come over here, please." He then promptly put his arms around her and kissed her. As he finally released her, he commented casually, "That takes care of my problem. Now what is yours?"
They have their problems. They have their minds, obsessions.

In the East there has never existed anything like a psychoanalyst. Not that we were not aware of the psychological world. We were aware more deeply than any society has ever been aware, but we created a totally different type of person to help. We call that person the guru, the Master. What is the difference between a guru and a psychoanalyst? The difference is that the psychoanalyst still has his problems, unsolved, and the guru has no problems. When you don't have any problems, then your vision is clear. Then you can put yourself in the other's situation. When you don't have any problems, any obsessions, any complexes, nothing -- you are completely clean of the mind, the mind has disappeared and you have attained to no-mind -- then, then you can see. Then you will not interpret in a personal way. Your interpretation will be universal, will become existential.

And the third is real time, existential. The real time is no time at all, because the real time is eternity. Let me explain it to you.

The chronological time is arbitrary. In the West Zeno proved it long before. In the East Nagarjuna proved it so deeply that he has never been refuted. In fact Zeno and
Nagarjuna, two persons, have remained irrefutable. Nobody can refute them; their arguments are so deep and absolute. Zeno and Nagarjuna say that the whole concept of time, chronological time, is absurd. Let me tell you a few things about these two persons and their analysis of chronological time.
They achieved the highest peak of time analysis. Nobody has ever been able to surpass them or improve upon them. They say, "What is time?" You say, "It is a process. One moment moves into the past, disappears; another moment moves from the future into the present; remains there on the threshold for a time; then again moves into the past, disappears." This is the time process. You have only one moment at one time, never two moments together. Past, future, and just between the two, the threshold, the present.

Now Nagarjuna and Zeno say, "Where does the moment come from? Is the future already eXistent? If it is not existent, then how can the moment come out of the nonexistential?" Now they create trouble. They say, "Where does the present moment move to in the past? Does it still remain accumulated in the past?" If you say it still remains in the past, then it has not become past yet. If you say it was there in the future and just now it has been revealed to us, it has always been there in the future; then, Nagarjuna and Zeno say, then you cannot call it the future; it has always been present. If the future is, then the future is not; because the future means that which is not yet. If the past is, then the past is not; because the past means that which has gone out of existence.

So whatsoever alternative you choose.... If you say the future is not and suddenly out of the blue the present moment appears, they both laugh. They say, "You are talking nonsense. How out of nonexistence can existence come? And how can the existential move into nonexistence again?" They say, "If there is nonexistence on both sides, then just in the middle, how can existence be? It must also be nonexistential. You got deceived."

Then they say, "You take time as a process? You say one moment is joined with another?" Nagarjuna and Zeno ask you, "There are two moments; how are they related? Is there a third moment between the two which relates them?" Again they create a difficulty because, to relate, a link is needed. To relate two things, to relate the past with the present and the present with the future, links are needed. Then where do those links exist? What are those links? They can only be of time. So between one moment and another there is another moment to join these two. So instead of two there are three, but again they will have to be joined. Infinite regress arises.

Look at my two fingers. These two are needed to be joined; they become three fingers. Now there are two holes instead of one, two blanks. They have to be joined; they become five. Now there are more gaps to be joined, and so on, so forth.

The chronological time, Nagarjuna and Zeno say, is utilitarian. It is not substantial. The real time is not a process, because, Nagarjuna says, if time itself is a process, then it will need another time. For example, you walk. You need time. You have come to me, to this Chuang Tzu Auditorium from your home. It took fifteen minutes for you to come here. If there is no time, how will you come here, because walking needs time? Walking is a process; you need time. All processes need time. Now Nagarjuna says, "If you say time itself is a process, it will need another time, a supertime. And that too is a process. Then a super-supertime...." Again infinite regress arises. Then you cannot solve it.

No, time -- real time -- is not a process. It is a simultaneity. Future, past, present are not three separate things; so there is no need to join them. It is eternal now, it is eternity. It is
not that time is passing by, by your side. Where will it go? It will need another medium to pass through, and where will it go and from where will it come? It is there; or rather it is here. Time is. It is not a process.

Because we cannot see the total time -- our eyes are confined, limited; we are looking out of small slits -- that's why it seems you can see only one moment at a time. It is your limitation, not a division of time. Because you cannot see the whole time as it is -- because you are not whole yet -- that's why.
Now the sutras.

PERFORMING SAMYAMA ON THE PRESENT MOMENT,
THE MOMENT GONE, AND THE MOMENT TO COME BRINGS
KNOWLEDGE BORN OF THE AWARENESS OF THE ULTIMATE REALITY.

If you bring your samadhi consciousness to the process of time -- to the moment which is, to the moment that is gone, to the moment that is to come -- if you bring your samadhi, suddenly, the knowledge of ultimate reality, because the moment you look with samadhi the distinction between present, future, and past disappears. They dissolve. The distinction is false. Suddenly you become aware of eternity. Then time is a simultaneity. Nothing is passing, nothing is coming in; everything is, simply is.

This isness is known as God; this isness is the idea of God.

"Performing samyama on the present moment, the moment gone, and the moment to come brings knowledge born of the awareness of the ultimate reality." If you can see time through the eyes of satori, samadhi, time disappears.

But this is the last miracle; after it there is only kaivalya, liberation. When time disappears, everything disappears because the whole world of desire, ambition, motivation is there because of the wrong conception of time. Time is created; time as process -- past, present, future -- is created by desiring. This is one of the greatest insights of the Eastern sages: that time, the process, is really a projection of desire. Because you desire something, you create future. And because you cling, you create past. Because you cannot leave that which is no longer before you, and you want to cling to it, you create memory. And because that which has not come yet, you expect it in your own way, you create future. Future and past are mental states, not part of time. Time is eternal. It is not divided. It is one, whole.

"KSHANA-TAT-KRAMAYOH SAMYAMAD VIVEKAJAM GYANAM." One who has come to know what the moment and the process of time is becomes aware of the ultimate; becoming aware of time, one becomes aware of the ultimate. Why? Because the ultimate exists as real time.

You live in the chronological; then you live in the newspaper world. Then you live in the world of the politicians, mad, ambitious people. Or if you live in the psychological time, you live in the world of the mad, the insane, or the world of fantasy, dream, poetry.

A new doctor was looking around the asylum. He came across one inmate and said to him, "Who are you?"
The man drew himself up to his full height and said, "I, sir, am Napoleon."
The doctor said, "Really? Who told you that?"
The patient said, "God told me, who else?"
A little man Lying in the next bed looked up and said, "I didn't."

Go to the madhouses; it is worth visiting. Just see people. They are living in a fantasy world. They have completely moved out of the collective world and they have not entered the universal world. They are hanging in between; they are in the limbo.

The psychiatrist was surprised to see his young woman patient standing outside his office looking very perplexed. It was not half an hour since he had been treating her. He said, "What is the matter?"
She said, "Oh, dear, I don't know whether I am coming or going.
The doctor said, "Exactly, that is why you have come to see me."
"Oh," she said, "who are you then?"
"I am your lousy psychiatrist."

A world of limbo arises. If you lose contact with the chronological world and you don't become connected with the world of the universal, the ultimate, suddenly you don't know whether you are coming in or going out. Everything becomes doubtful, everything becomes suspicious. You cannot trust yourself, you cannot trust your eyes, you cannot trust anybody. You are closed in, caved in. You become a windowless being, a monad. This is what hell is. You cannot move out of yourself; you are crippled. Remember, a meditator passes consciously through the world of the madman -- consciously
.
And it is good to pass consciously because if you don't pass consciously there is every possibility you will become an unconscious victim of it. It is better to go through it alert, aware, rather than being forced into it. If life forces you into it, then you will not be able to come out of it. It will be very, very difficult.

And the psychoanalyst can only help to bring you back to the chronological world. That's the difference between a Master and a psychoanalyst. The psychoanalyst brings the man who has got lost in the psychological back to the chronological -- through shock treatment, electric shock, insulin shock -- because if you are shocked very much, suddenly your dream is broken. You become a little alert; you move back to the chronological world.

The Master, if you are lost in the psychological, takes you further back in, takes you to the universal. You will never become part of the chronological world, but you will become part of the universal time.

FROM THIS COMES THE ABILITY TO DISTINGUISH
BETWEEN SIMILAR OBJECTS WHICH CANNOT BE IDENTIFIED
BY CLASS, CHARACTER, OR PLACE.

Once you know the ultimate, a totally different kind of knowing arises in you. Right now you know things only from the outside. Somebody comes, you look at the clothes, and you think, "Yes, she is a woman," or "a mall." You look at the tree and you recognize it -- "It is a pine tree" -- because you know the description. You see a mall and you know that he is a doctor because of his stethoscope. But these are outer indications of things. He may not be a doctor; he may be just a pretender. And the pine tree may not be a pine tree; it may just look like a pine tree. And the woman may not be a woman; she may be just

acting. She may be a man; she may be a he. You cannot be absolutely certain about it, because you know only from the outside.

When time disappears and eternity surrounds you, when time is no longer a process but a pool of energy, eternal now, then you become capable of entering into things and of knowing without any definitions from the outside.

That's what happens between a Master and a disciple. He need not ask you, really. He can see from your very being. He can stand in you -- not only in your shoes but in your being. He can fit exactly in your innermost vacuum. He can be you, and look from there.

THE HIGHEST KNOWLEDGE BORN OF THE AWARENESS OF REALITY
IS TRANSCENDENT, INCLUDES THE COGNITION OF ALL OBJECTS SIMULTANEOUSLY, PERTAINS TO ALL OBJECTS AND PROCESSES WHATSOEVER -- IN THE PAST, THE PRESENT, AND THE FUTURE -- AND TRANSCENDS THE WORLD PROCESS.

... And transcends the process world, and transcends the world of all processes.

TARAKAM SARVAVISHAYAM SARVATHAVISHAYAM
AKRAMAM CHETI VIVEKAJAM GYANAM.

Through the eye we can see only a part of reality. Because of that part, life looks like a process. Just for example, you are sitting under a tree and the road is empty, and then suddenly a man appears on the road from the left side; he goa on the right side; after walking a little distance he disappears again.

Somebody is sitting in the tree. Long before the man appeared to you, he appeared to the man who is in the tree. When the man disappears to you, he does not disappear for the man who is sitting in the tree; but after a time the man disappears for him also. But somebody is in a helicopter. Now his vision goes farther; the man continues to walk -- long before you became aware that he was on the road and long after he disappeared for you.

What is happening? Exactly this is the case with things. The higher you rise, the closer you reach the sahasrar -- you are climbing the tree of life. Sahasrar is the ultimate point to look from. There is no more height than that. From sahasrar you see things: everything goes on and on and on. Nothing stops, nothing disappears.

It is very difficult; it is as difficult as the physicists' explanation of the ultimate electron, quanta, that it is both a wave and a particle, both a dot and a line.

You are flying in an aeroplane, over the Ganges, and the Ganges is flowing. If I ask you, "Is the Ganges a process? Is the Ganges flowing, or is it that the Ganges IS?" what will you say? You will say, "Both." You will say, "The Ganges is," because you can see it from one end to the other simultaneously. You can see the Ganges in the Himalayas, you can see the Ganges on the plains, you can see the Ganges falling into the ocean, simultaneously -- past, present, future have disappeared. The whole Ganges is available to you from a certain altitude. It is, and yet you know it is flowing. It is both being and becoming; it is both wave and particle, dot and line; is and still a process.

It is paradoxical, it looks paradoxical, because we don't know how things appear from that height.

This sutra says, "The highest knowledge born of the awareness of reality is transcendent...." It transcends all dualities, polarities of is and process, of static and dynamic, of wave and particle, of life and death, of past and future -- all dualities, all polarities. It is transcendent. "TARAKAM SARVAVISHAYAM" -- it transcends all the objects of knowledge.

"... includes the cognition of all objects simultaneously...." And for this consciousness is used the word "omniscient." Everything exists for it simultaneously. Very difficult to understand, almost impossible to comprehend. It means for a man of ultimate understanding, if he looks at you, he will see you while you were in your mother's womb -- simultaneously -- and you are being born -- simultaneously -- and you are growing and you have become a child and you have become a young man and you are marrying a woman and you have fallen in love and your children are born and you have become old and you are dying and people are going in a funeral procession -- all simultaneously. The whole will appear in total.

Difficult to comprehend, because how is it possible? A child is being born. How can he die right this moment? He is either a child or young or old, either in the womb or in the coffin, either in the cradle or in the grave. But that is our division because we cannot see totally.

A certain scientist in Soviet Russia has photographed buds with such a sensitive photographic instrument, films, that nobody has tried before; and the picture has come of the flower. The bud has been photographed, but in the picture the flower has come. It is still a bud. What has happened?

Because the bud is also a flower, simultaneously. You cannot see it because you see only in parts. First you see it as a bud; then a few petals open, then a few more, then a few more; then the whole flower opens. But with a very sensitive camera, Kirlian photography has given a tremendous insight into reality. You can photograph a bud, and the photograph comes of a flower. Because when the bud is there, deep down, surrounding the bud, the energy flower has already opened. The visible petals will follow, but the energy field has already flowered. It is there. And later on, when the real flower had flowered, they were surprised to see that the photograph was absolutely exact. They could compare the real flower later on.

Some day or other it will be possible to photograph a seed, and one photograph will not come but many -- of the seed, of the sprout, of the buds, of the flowers, of the tree, and the falling of the tree, and the disappearing of the tree.

" TARAKAM... SARVATHAVISHAYAM AKRAMAM...." Ordinarily we see everything in a gradual process, in karma, in a gradual process -- a child becoming young, a young man becoming old -- slowly, as if a film is being projected very slowly on the screen. That's how we see it. But the ultimate knowledge is total and absolute. In a single moment everything is revealed.

Ordinarily we move with a small torch in a dark night. When the torch shows us one tree, other trees are hidden in darkness. When the torch moves to other trees, the first tree has moved into darkness. You can see only a little patch of the path. But that ultimate knowledge is like lightning: suddenly you see the whole forest, in a single vision.

These are all just symbolic. Hmm?... don't extend and don't stretch these symbols too much. They are just to give you subtle indications of what happens. In fact it cannot be said.
Now, chronological time is politics, history, economics, money, things, intellect, the market, Wall Street. Psychological time is dream, myth, poetry, love, art, intuition, painting, dance, drama. Real time is existence, science and religion.

Science is trying to penetrate the existence through the objective approach; and religion tries to penetrate the same reality through the subjective approach; and yoga is the synthesis of both.
The word "science" is beautiful; it means "the capacity to see." It exactly means what the Indian word darshan means. The word darshan should not be translated as "philosophy"; it can be translated more accurately as "science" -- the capacity to see.

Science is trying to penetrate the ultimate through the objective, from the outside. Religion is trying to penetrate the same ultimate through the subjective. And yoga is the highest synthesis; yoga is both, science and religion together.

Yoga is the suprascience and suprareligion. Yoga is neither Hindu nor Mohammedan nor Christian -- it is suprareligious. And of course it is a suprascience because it is the science of man -- it is the science of the scientist himself. It touches the ultimate. That's why I call it the alpha and the omega, UNIO MYSTICA, the ultimate synthesis

YOGA: THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA ,VOL. 9, OSHO
DISCOURSES ON THE YOGA SUTRAS OF PATANJALI
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 20-03-2012, 01:06 PM   #430
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The Ross Institute Internet Archives for the Study of Destructive Cults, Controversial Groups and Movements.


Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
August 29, 2007 11:12AM meditation

Date Added: 08/29/2007
Posts: 1Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)I've escaped from Humaniversity cult, Netherland a while ago. If somebody need information about them...

September 01, 2007 06:43AMRegenerate
Date Added: 07/01/2007
Posts: 9Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)Hello Mediation,

As an ex-sannyasin, who was initiated due to a strong desire to do serious therapeutic and spiritual work on myself and who lived in the organisation's communes for a number of years, I would be very interested in an up-to-date account of what's happening in that offshoot of the official organisation - The Humaniversity.

The name seems extremely farcical for a group that demeans and degrates people and all their relationships, while being intent on extracting as much money, as often as possible, for meditation and therapy groups.

Current information made available could help those who've got caught up with this entrapping organisation and also those who are on the verge of involvement, who may then think twice.

I hope your recovery is progressing well and that you post again.

Regenerate

September 01, 2007 06:48AMRegenerate
Date Added: 07/01/2007
Posts: 9Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)Sorry, meant to address you as Meditation.

Regenerate

September 02, 2007 04:43PMHarry Lime
Date Added: 09/02/2007
Posts: 11Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)I too am interested in current info regarding this cult and how a cult thrives even after it's leaders have been exposed as frauds. How do they carry on without a charismatic leader?

September 03, 2007 10:20AMcorboy
Date Added: 06/19/2002
Posts: 3490Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)That is a very good question. Even in a non-cultic situation, the demise or departure of a charismatic leader is a vulnerable point.

Just talk to anyone who has had long experience serving on search committees for Anglican and Protestant churchers, and for Jewish congregations--all traditions in which the community can choose its leader.

Then talk to people who have experience in business and ask them what its like when a charismatic, successful and brilliant leader retires.

It is painful and difficult to be the successor of someone who, literally has been 'a hard act to follow.' Some groups do not make it.

But there are groups that do manage to survive a charismatic leader. If that leader has had an abusive track record several things probably happen

* [b:8fe3563871]Accumulate Assets[/b:8fe3563871]

It helps if a group has accumulated subtantial assets. That means they can afford to publish revised, re-written versions of their doctrine and history

* [b:8fe3563871]Re-write History[/b:8fe3563871]

If possible, re-write group doctrine or history. It helps to have the money to publish new updates. In some cases, a group went to considerable lengths to destroy old documents, even pictures. In the case of Siddha/SYDA yoga, this is described in the New Yorker article, [i:8fe3563871]Oh Guru, Guru[/i:8fe3563871]. [www.rickross.com]

* [b:8fe3563871]Blame the Underlings, Excuse the Guru[/b:8fe3563871]

Assure people that the previous bad behavior of the group did not originate from the guru, but from a corrupt inner circle of disciples who decieved the guru. (Note any member of an abusive guru's entourage ought to know that if anything goes wrong, its the inner circle members who often get scapegoated, socially and sometimes, legally, while the guru escapes. All too often entourage members carry the shadow of the group, and the guru carrys only the positive projections of the group--even when it is the guru who is ultimately puppet-mastering the entire thing.

[b:8fe3563871]Offer a New Menu of Services according to Social Needs[/b:8fe3563871]

Re-emerge by offering services valued by society, such as meditation, yoga (especially yoga. You can sell accessories too), and especially schooling for young children, troubled children. I predict that in a few years, offering elder care will be a gigantic growth industry-and it will attract cults. It'll be perfect. Exhausted guilt ridden middle aged people looking for help with aging parents, and aging people who can be conned into disinheriting their kids. Just watch and see how soon cults line up for this one.

* [b:8fe3563871]Change names[/b:8fe3563871]

If a charismatic leader has ended in disgrace and his or her name has become infamous (eg Rajneesh and his Rolls Royces and sexual excesses) ...change the name of the leader. It is astonishing how many new converts do not bother to fact check. Other's who have changed their names have been Da Free John (now known as Adi Da Samiraj).

The old Erhard Seminars Training (EST, known in its heyday as 'no-pee-therapy' because participants were given infrequent bathroom breaks) was renamed The Forum and now, currently, goes by the name Landmark Education.

Finally, make it seem that anyone who has a sense of history and keeps track of this stuff is a negative minded, loveless cynic.

Historians and fact checkers play an essential role keeping groups and societies honest. And they are the ones who catch heat when a group decides to become oppressive, authoritarian, and lie about its past.

One distinguished historian was murdered by the Bolsheviks because he was a member of the Romanov dynasty. Lenin received a plea for clemency and refused it, saying 'The Revolution does not need historians.'

September 03, 2007 10:22AMcorboy
Date Added: 06/19/2002
Posts: 3490Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)Another way to re-write history

Eject/Purge those persons who remember how things used to be done.

September 11, 2007 03:01PMSangre
Date Added: 05/22/2005
Posts: 6Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)I would be very interested in that as I know someone who is pretty deep involved with them! She has told me some bizar things and now for a while doesn't contact me and other friends at all anymore.

October 01, 2007 08:41AMRegenerate
Date Added: 07/01/2007
Posts: 9Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)Mediation,

As you can see, a number of people would be interested in your account of life at the Humaniversity. As it's not possibe to email you or to PM you until the poster has made 10 posts, it would be good if you could share your experience online, if you feel that's possible.

It seems to me that the more information, especially current, that's available about what goes on in 'closed societies', the better. As is said, 'Information is power' and empowerment is exactly what's needed by people who have suffered as a result of involvement in these organisations.

Many thanks,

Regenerate

October 01, 2007 09:15AMstarry
Date Added: 09/25/2007
Posts: 24Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)I would be very interested in hearing about your experiences as well. I have a very close family member that was (still is) a sannyasin.

October 08, 2007 06:50AMS_Byers666
Date Added: 11/28/2006
Posts: 164Humaniversity (Osho, Bagwan)
Quote:
meditation
I've escaped from Humaniversity cult, Netherland a while ago. If somebody need information about them...

Please do tell us what goes on. They have an off-shoot at OshoLeela in England - that is equally abusive of its workshop participants.
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Old 20-03-2012, 03:01 PM   #431
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Osho News Online Magazine



Meditation and Ecology
Featured Insights — 09 March 2012

Anando’s insight: when at peace with herself she is also in harmony with everything around her






For me, ecology means being in harmony – with myself.

I realize that sounds selfish, but my experience is that when I am in harmony with myself – when I feel at peace and easy with myself – then I am automatically in harmony with everything around me, whether it is other people or nature. And when I am in that space, I have also noticed that it is impossible for me to do anything harmful – to myself, to others or to the environment.

gingko

It sounds rather simplistic, but it is my actual experience. Of course it is not as easy as it sounds, because it is not easy to be at peace with ourselves. I loved hearing Osho speak about these things, his words were such a revelation for me, but it was some time before I started to actually experience for myself, in my own life, the truth of what he was saying.

I used to live in fight – fighting myself, fighting others, fighting the world. Not always overtly, but I usually felt in some kind of struggle. I was always trying to improve myself, trying to be better than others, trying to get recognition and respect, trying to earn love. I used to judge myself and compare myself to others, usually in a negative way, until eventually I realized it not only cuts my energy but also creates walls between myself and others.

If you are trying to reach the top, you automatically treat others as your competitors. And that creates a feeling of hostility, even if it is very subtle. One day I was shocked to realize how suspicious I was of people – that I saw people first as potential threats or critics rather than as potential friends. That is a pretty miserable way to live if you think about it, but in my subsequent work with others I have seen that it is how many of us live, often without being aware of it.

Osho says that the seed of enmity in us is very developed, starting from the fear we feel when we are thrust out of the womb into bright lights and a sharp slap on the bum. And then our whole way of life, starting from the pressure we feel from our families, from the school, from our peers and the media, all of it makes us competitive and distrustful. And keeps us in a constant tension. And that is how our minds like it – they love tension, problems. It is as if our minds feed on the negative – have you ever noticed how we prefer to watch or read bad news than good news? Our minds do not like to be peaceful and happy. If there isn’t a problem, or if a problem has been solved, our minds will immediately create another one – they can make a problem out of anything, cant they?

Even if we are enjoying ourselves, our minds often make us feel guilty, or tell us that if we are happy now we will pay for it later. Now, isn’t that absurd? But that is the way our minds work. And because we let our minds run our life – because we are so identified with our minds – it is very difficult to relax and feel easy and peaceful.

In fact the only way I know how to rest easy in contentment is to take some distance from my mind, to put it on a back burner; and the only way I know how to do that is meditation. Meditation, as I learned from Osho, creates a relaxation – it helps us to move from the head to the heart, or from the left brain to the right brain if you like, and that automatically brings a feeling of calm and peace.

And from the place that meditation takes us to, it is possible to actually have the mind-blowing (literally) experience that we are all just different expressions of the energy of existence – we are all unique and we all have our own part to play in this theatre of life, so no need to try and play anyone else’s’ role. From that space also it is easy to feel the inter-connection we have with nature – to feel part of the whole if you like. When we realize how dependant we all are on each other and the environment, it brings a tremendous respect and appreciation. And a humbleness that is very relaxing, because you realize you are not alone. As Osho says, it is the mind that likes us to think we are separate, like waves on the ocean, separate and isolated from other waves. But the heart knows that underneath we are all part of the same ocean.

I discovered for myself that in the deep relaxation that came with this understanding, I stopped being competitive. I stopped fighting and started flowing. I started enjoying myself as I am, imperfect and all. And I started enjoying others. I noticed that as I accepted and respected myself more, I accepted and respected people and nature more. It was as if a feeling of harmony arose, and in that harmony everything was OK as it was – myself, other people, situations… everything was as it was, and it suddenly seemed pointless to go on fighting for things (and myself) to be different. Not that I became resigned, but I started enjoying all the eccentricities of life. I started appreciating the uniqueness of everything, and with that appreciation and wonder I found it is it is impossible to harm anything.

Of course, I am not always in that state, and when I am on automatic pilot, back in my old unconscious ways, I can feel the seeds of destructiveness ready to burst out at the slightest provocation. At least now I can be aware of it and of how it harms me even more than anyone or anything else, so I make an effort to watch it, rather than act on it. But it makes me realize how powerful the unconscious is. So for me it’s no surprise the world is in the mess it is. If people don’t have the tools to break free from their unconscious, they are trapped in vicious and destructive circles.



Article by Anando, previously published in the Italian Osho Times.
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 20-03-2012, 03:20 PM   #432
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Talking

A young policeman is escorting
a drunk driver down to the prison cells
at the police station.
"You are going to be locked up for the night,"
he explains
"What's the charge? demands the prisoner.
"There's no charge," says the cop.
"It's all part of the service."
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.
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Old 20-03-2012, 03:31 PM   #433
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lonestar View Post
great paraphrasing!

"this is to show how easily society can prevent you from being yourself."

Yes!

and as i start to realize this, its very humbling.
Thanks lonestar.
Great to see you back.

"Once you are enchanted by the unknown, then
there is no end to this pilgrimage--it is an
eternal journey, never ending, always ongoing;
it is inexaustible."
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.
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Old 20-03-2012, 04:30 PM   #434
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i hate to harp on the word humbleness but the last post used the word again and its "mind-blowing (literally)"

like you said its so easy for society to fall into this trap of not being our true selves but "we are all just different expressions of the energy of existence"

and when you really start to look at everyone including yourself in that way
a humbleness comes that is very relaxing because you realize you are not alone.
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Old 20-03-2012, 05:41 PM   #435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lonestar View Post
i hate to harp on the word humbleness but the last post used the word again and its "mind-blowing (literally)"

like you said its so easy for society to fall into this trap of not being our true selves but "we are all just different expressions of the energy of existence"

and when you really start to look at everyone including yourself in that way
a humbleness comes that is very relaxing because you realize you are not alone.
Here is a link ,where Osho shows that the "spiritual ego" humbleness, hides as a facade,

http://www.osho.com/online-library-o...05aad-855.aspx

I understand you mean real humbleness; not the facade, interesting to read anyway lonestar.
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 20-03-2012, 09:46 PM   #436
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Osho,
We′re playing those mind-games together
Pushing the barrier,
Planting seeds.
Playing the mind-guerilla,
Chanting the mantra ′Peace on Earth′.
We′ve all been playing those mind-games forever.
...
Love is the answer,
And you know that′s for sure.
Love is the flower,
you got to let it grow.
...
Yes is the answer,
and you know that′s for sure.
...
Yes is surrender,
And you got to let it grow.

This song was written by John Lennon. Now he is dead. Lennon was very much in love with you, even though he declared that he was not ready to become a disciple.
I can feel this connection myself. I really would like you to say something about his death.

Swatantra Sarjano,
Words have their own magic, and the poets, the singers, live in the magical world of words, not of realities. They are skillful, very skillful and efficient, as far as the delicate, subtle waves of words, imagination, dreams is concerned, but all that they go on doing is utterly unconscious.

John Lennon on the one hand sings:
Love is the answer,
And you know that′s for sure.

He himself does not know it.

He says:
Love is the flower,
you got to let it grow.

But to know it you have to be absolutely awakened, because love is the ultimate peak of consciousness. The poet can imagine about it, the singer can sing about it, the painter can paint about it, but they have seen only reflections of the moon in the lake; they have not seen the moon itself. And, of course, the moon reflected in the lake is just made of the same stuff as dreams are made of. The poets, the singers, are dreamers, they are not seers.

So he says:
Yes is surrender,
And you got to let it grow.

His words sound true, but they are only reflections of the moon in the lake. If you dive in the lake you will not find the moon there. In fact, the moment you jump into the water, the reflection will disappear, will be broken into thousands of pieces. It will spread all over the lake; you will not be able to catch hold of it. The reflection IS beautiful, but one has not to forget that it is only a reflection and it cannot transform your being.

So he sings:
Love is the answer...
Love is the flower...
Yes is the answer...
Yes is surrender...
and you know that′s for sure.

But he himself is absolutely unaware of it; he has not experienced it. A beautiful man, but still lost in dreams and imagination.

The poet lives unconsciously, the seer lives consciously. Sometimes their words are exactly the same - don′t be deceived by the words. If you really want to know whether those words represent reality or just empty wishes you have to look into the life of the man.

Kahlil Gibran has written tremendously beautiful words. They come so close to Christ, to Zarathustra, to Lao Tzu, to Gautam the Buddha, and there is every possibility many people will think that Kahlil Gibran is enlightened. He may even surpass Lao Tzu and Buddha and Christ as far as expression is concerned; his expression may be far more beautiful because he is a skilled poet, a very skilled painter. He has the sensitiveness to appreciate beauty, but, howsoever he is appreciating, it is unconscious.

Buddha may not say things so beautifully because he is not a poet in the ordinary sense, but whatsoever he says is the truth. His words may fall short of it, in fact words always fall short of the truth; they are never adequate enough. So don′t decide by words.

Sarjano, you are deciding by words.

That′s why you say:
I can feel this connection myself.

Sarjano himself has the quality of a poet, has the sensibility of a creative person. That′s why I have given him the name Sarjano; Sarjano means creativity.

But Kahlil Gibran or John Lennon have to be watched to know whether their truths are really truths or only fabrications of dream, fantasy, imagination; whether they have really experienced those things or they are only empty wishes. You have to watch the Buddha.

Buddha is reported to have said: "Don′t be too bothered about what I say, rather look at me, rather watch me, rather feel me. Let the words disappear. Don′t let the words stand between me and you. Experience my silence, feel the energy that surrounds me, resonate with me - only then will you be able to understand what I am saying."

If you want to understand a Buddha, his words, you have to watch his life.
Buddha has also said, very poignantly: "Don′t follow my words, rather, follow what I am doing, follow what I am being."

Sarjano, I can see these words are beautiful:
We′re playing those mind-games together
Pushing the barrier,
Planting seeds.

But there is no need to go on playing them forever. There have been people who stopped all those mind-games, but the only way to stop those mind-games is meditation; there has never been any other way. Meditation means entering into a state of no-mind.

If he was really in love with me, then there was nothing to prevent him from coming here. To be in love with me means to be in love with meditation, but he must have been afraid of meditation. If he said that he was not ready to become a disciple he must have been afraid of meditation, of surrender, of saying yes, of falling in love. Why? Because the poets, the singers, the painters, the sculptors, the musicians, are the most egoistic people in the world. They talk about egolessness, saying yes and surrendering and love, but that is mere talk.

They are very egoistic people, in fact they far surpass even the politicians and the priests, for the simple reason that they are talented people. The politicians are not talented people - they are third-rate, they belong to the world of the mediocres. But poets, singers, musicians, painters, they are talented people. They really have something which they can brag about - they have got something. Their ego has a solid support. The politician is making his house on shifting sands, but the poet - any kind of creative person - is making his ego on solid ground, on rocklike ground. His foundation is concrete; it is not made of just shifting sands. Hence he has every reason to feel egoistic, but then the danger is even far greater: he will be the last person to surrender, and his whole life he will talk about surrender and about egolessness and about love.

Kahlil Gibran talked about love, surrender, saying yes, but his whole life was quarrelsome. The people he loved, he always fought with them. He was talking about compassion, but he was a very angry man. He would go into childish tantrums for small reasons - any excuse would do. He would throw things, he would break things - he would go mad! The people who lived with him were always afraid of him, the women who loved him were continuously in misery.

And this is the man who wrote the great book, The Prophet. It stands as one of the ten great books of the whole world and it will remain one of the greatest ever; there is no possibility for somebody to surpass it. And this is coming from a man who was very angry, very violent, very jealous, very egoistic.

Wilhelm Reich has written about how to get rid of jealousy - because jealousy is THE poison for love, it destroys the roots of love. And Wilhelm Reich is one of the greatest creative psychoanalysts after Sigmund Freud. But his wife writes something else - she writes about him: "I have never seen such a jealous person in my life. He was taking all kinds of freedom, he was moving with many women!" - because he was talking about freedom and that relationship should not be any kind of bondage, but about his wife he was very jealous. Almost twenty-four hours a day he was detecting, spying on where she was, with whom she was, what she was doing, was she looking happy with the man. When he went out of the town he would tell his friends to keep watch.

Finally his wife had to divorce him - it was too much of a torture. He was taking every kind of freedom - he was moving with many women - and his wife was not even allowed to have friends, not to mention lovers.

You have to look into the life of the person, because only that is decisive.
Now, Lennon was continuously fighting with his own woman - many times they separated and many times they got together again - and he is talking about mind-games, and he was playing those mind-games himself!

Sarjano, the words are beautiful:
Love is the answer

I also say love is the answer, but I MEAN it! He does not mean it, he is simply saying beautiful words. Beautiful words have their own hypnotic quality. They catch the mind of the singers and the poets and the musicians; they fall in love with beautiful words. He must be in love with the word ′love′ - and remember, the word ′love′ is not love, the word ′God′ is not God, the word ′yes′ is not yes.

Yes is a totally different existential experience. To say yes means to drop your ego entirely. Surrender means disappearing into the whole. He was a nice man, but as unconscious, Sarjano, as you are.

That′s why you say:
I can feel this connection myself.

You must be feeling it!
Now the poor man is dead. Somebody played the game - the mind-game - killed him. Many questions have come to me asking that I should say something about his death. To me, birth and death have no significance at all. There are many ways to die, and the best way is to be killed - at least you are not responsible! The worst is to die in your bed and ninety-nine percent of people choose to die in their beds. Beware of the bed, because that is the MOST dangerous place in the world! All the accidents happen there: birth happens there, love happens there, death happens there. If you can simply renounce the bed you are enlightened!

He died a good death - somebody killed him. One has to die anyway; when one HAS to die one should choose a good way. I don′t think he chose it and I don′t think the person who killed him chose it either. People are living - all people are living - in utter unconsciousness.

A patient lying on the operating table started screaming, "I don′t want to be cut open! You′ll kill me! I don′t want to die!"
The surgeon tried to calm the patient, "Just take it easy, sir, look at my long white beard. I′ve done thousands of operations and nothing has ever gone wrong."
"Oh, doctor, you′re right! I know I can trust you!" replied the patient.
When the patient awoke after the operation, he looked around and saw the same white beard and said, "Oh, thank you, doctor! You are a saint!"
"It′s okay, son, you don′t have to thank me. I am not your doctor - my name is St. Peter".

So what can I say about his death? It is perfectly okay! Everything is okay. Just... if he had really come here he would have died a totally different kind of death. He would have died celebrating, he would have died rejoicing. He would have died without any regrets, without any complaints. He would have died in love, in surrender, in yes. That he has missed this time - I hope next time he does not miss it.

(Osho - Philosophia Ultima #10)
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 20-03-2012, 10:05 PM   #437
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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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Old 20-03-2012, 10:51 PM   #438
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Old 21-03-2012, 03:59 AM   #439
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Quote:
“You exist in time, but you belong to eternity. You are a penetration of eternity into the world of time. You are deathless, living in a body of death. Your consciousness knows no death, no birth. It is only your body that is born and dies. But you are not aware of your consciousness; you are not conscious of your consciousness. And that is the whole art of meditation: becoming conscious of consciousness itself.”



- OSHO
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Old 21-03-2012, 05:13 AM   #440
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This card shows a small wildflower that has met the
challenge of the rocks and stones in its path to emerge into
the light of day. Surrounded by an aura of bright golden light,
it exposes the majesty of its tiny self. Unashamed, it is equal to
the brightest sun.

When we are faced with a very difficult situation we have a choice:
we can either be resentful, and try to find somebody or something to
blame for the hardships, or we can face the challenge and grow.
The flower shows us the way,as its passion for life leads it out of
the darkness and into the light. There is no point fighting against challenges
of life, or trying to avoid or deny them. They are there, and if the seed
is to become the flower we must go through them. Be courageous
enough to grow into the flower you are meant to be.

OSHO Zen Tarot.




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The belief that society exists has sabotaged every effort to change mankind. It is the reason why revolutions have failed. It is about a totally different revolution: the revolution in the heart of the individual.

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