Summons for riding my bike.

[zeroman52]

I was stopped by a policeman for riding my bike on the pavement, he told me I had commited an offence i asked what offence he stated an act, i asked is that statute and he did not know, he did not know the difference between legal and lawfull and anytime i mentioned anything to do with legel terms he would say i do not which to descuss the meaning of the words.

He was like a preprogrammed robot spurting memes at me, I could tell this mans mind was completly currpted it was quite sad really. he wanted my details to which I said do you want my legal name he said just your name, I told him my first name but he also wanted my surname, I said I did not have one, he seemed to think I was being funny and threaterned me with arrest if I did not give my details, he said he has the right to have them as I have commited an offence.

I stood my ground at all times articulating self and remaining calm, I stated I wish no conflict and I am not questioning your integrity, I just want to be clear on the words your using to impower yourself, he stated several times he did not want to discuss the legal terms and that he just wants to deal with the offence. I stated I have commited no crime to which he says I have, again he did not want to discuss the legal terms.

I gave him the details which I now regret, he then served me a fine I said I do not which to take it from him, the result now is i will get a summons from the court. Maybe I should of took it and served my own notice?

I asked if he has discresion with regards to the fine, he said he does I then asked if he has this discresion then why give me the fine? is it personal against me? is it worth the time and effort of bringing me through a court for a none crime of riding a bike, he said it is my job. I stated back are you happy your job is implementing a police state which our children will have to live under, he said back "we all do" :(

So if this summons arrives what shall I do? serve a notice of intent? I have read quite abit about the legalesse but I have had no experiance. I am willing to die and I MEAN this I will fight to my last breath, im not going to be treated like a serf, I have no contract with anyone and this offence does not apply to me.

Thanks for your help, and peace to you all. I wish I never went to get them eggs now lol

[merlincove]

first of all mate, i'd make a serious complaint to the police in question, direct it to the super intendant, make a complaint against this officer of fraud.

Your complaint should go along the lines of 'failure to distinguish between a statute and a law is gross negligence, and recognised as fraud under common law.'

If a summons arrives, question its validity through proof of claim. If you feel brave enough you could front up to court.

You will need to gen up on the anti terrorist vids.

Also learn how abouit proof of claim etc.

And get a notice of to the police station, you have a legit complaint against the officer, he was negkligent in hisn duty to inform you correctly.

This just goes to show that they have no power until you concent to thier juristiction.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkVe2-3eZ34&feature=channel_page

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBK_gQgB1p8&feature=channel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQuylgA_aqM&feature=channel

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=74742

[zeroman52]

Thanks, I have seen them vids about but never watched them I sure will now. I have seen everything from tpuc.org and robert manard, very informative;

I couldnt believe he did not know if it was statute, I did say are you not an peace officer of the law or are you just a policy enforcer.:rolleyes:

[yozhik]

Seems to me, you made two errors;

1. You contracted by giving your details. It isn't the law - he was talking bollocks. refer Rice vs Connolly.

2. If he offered you a 'ticket' [fine notice], you should have insisted you get the ORIGINAL, not the copy or none at all.

[merlincove]

And you failed to record the conversation on your mobile phone. AKA the antiterrorist, invaluable info i think.

:D

[zeroman52]

I know i know I knew I was doing a bad thing by giving him joiner to me, i would of been willing to go to the cells and just ignore them but I was on the spot and cracked abit.

This is a learning experiance for me the way I see it.

Thanks I shall remember that 2nd point.

I found it weird he read me rights at the end of the encounter, the same ones u get read when arrested? he didnt ask if i understand though, if he did I would of said I do not have rights served to me I serve my own.

When I asked why are you taking this action is it personal against me his head went down abit and his eyes overted, he was defo being vindictive. I was very clear that im peacefull and do not wish conflict. This while 4 other people ride past us lol

[danster82]

Im interested to see what happens when someone doesnt give their name.
I mean what they going to do take you too the station and keep asking you for your details the whole time your telling them you have only come to the station under protest and duress and that your being unlawfully detained.

It would only be a matter of time until they start to sweat and have to let you go....?

I guess now youve given them details you just follow the standard procedure of sending your notice all the templates are on tpuc.

[zeroman52]

Im interested too, I have thought about non complient resistance, just completly ignoring everything they say and not even look at them, laying on the floor and closing your eyes lol they must have no choice but to let you on your way.

[tien an]

I dunno zeroman52...the way I see it, unless you've already served notice on the Chief Constable of your County (by way of NOUI & COR), you're still the chattel of the Crown, and therefore fall under the jurisdiction of statute law.
That said...if the copper didn't know the difference between legal and lawful, I'd go for the technicality, the elephant in the room that he'd been grossly negligent.

Go on everyone...jump on me: I'm waiting and in a good mood!


tian an.

PS I'll bet his sergeant back at the station has put him right on that score by now....

[wakeupworld]

Your only chattel to the crown if you recognise yourself as a person isn`t that right? Regardless of any notices served.
Zeroman52 I admire your determination and willingness to suffer to stand up for your rights, but it`s not worth going to extremes, just try to learn from this as we are all in this together. Yoznik`s advice is good I think, good luck.

[merlincove]

Im interested to see what happens when someone doesnt give their name.
I mean what they going to do take you too the station and keep asking you for your details the whole time your telling them you have only come to the station under protest and duress and that your being unlawfully detained.

It would only be a matter of time until they start to sweat and have to let you go....?

I guess now youve given them details you just follow the standard procedure of sending your notice all the templates are on tpuc.

yeh, i think if you do not recognise yourself as a person it will be down to the station with you for hindering an officer or for breach of the peace, no matter how much of the anti terrorist info you have digested.

But so long as you get it all recorded, then that is evidence that you did all you could to u[phold yourself lawfully and uphold your rights of equality where no crime was commited.

You can deny them the privilage of giving your name. You can say i am john, and i do not have a surname and i'm not obliged to give you my commonly accepted familly name. You can deny them the privilage of taking your DNA, altho as has been proven in girlgyes thread, the bastards will take it anyway, you can deny them taking your finger prints by physically and verbally resisting.

if they have not got your dna on file and you do not give them your name or fingerprints then it will be virtually impossable for them to id you. how can they charge you unless you admit or are discoverd to be a vessel?

[zhenshanren]

That's a real bummer to get a fine for riding your bike. :rolleyes:

How much was the fine?

Considering the circumstances I'd have to rack this up as a great opportunity to go through the motions, on a small scale, of the process that one ends up traversing when dealing with these situations. It really can even be thought of as fun, from the perspective of it being actual real life hands on experience with this sort of thing. Now you will know better next time(hopefully there won't be one) and you'll also be better at telling other people what might work for them.

I would definetly try to argue the fact that he refused to discuss things with you etc. Since it's over something relativly trivial they might be inclined to dump the case in which case it would be a big win for you.

I still can't believe a fine for riding a bike...where were you riding?

[zeroman52]

The fine was £30, after I meet two guys who had been fined 2 days previous, maybe the job of the officer is to target poor people on there bike.

I was riding alongside a dual carriadge way on the pavement, the reason I dont like to be on the road is it heads towards a huge busy roundabout and fuck going around that I have no experiance and they exspect me to put my life in danger, I only ride to the local shop.

I believe the reason most people choose the pavement is they are not comfortable sharing the road because it can be dangerous unless there is a bike path.

[dantesinferno]

next time don’t stop,

this is more of a question to the more knowledgeable,

is the officer obliged by his own law or statute to explain the difference? does it matter in regards to the enforcement of the statute or law?

[zhenshanren]

next time don’t stop

That would potentialy work eh'?

[mark1963]

I knew a guy, a few years ago now, who was driving through Tooting and a policeman waved for him to stop. He did not and was arrested at home later.

It went to court and the judge asked him the reason as to why he did not stop. He said he was concentrating on driving and this required his full attention.

The case was dismissed.

[zeroman52]

I got the summons in the post this morning, what is the next step.

[bones]

unless you know what you are doing ide suggest you just pay it do some home work and never ever ever ever ,, give ya name..(you contracted)

sounds harsh but i have to be honest if you fuck it up you will just end up paying more...

but im sure many will let you take the plunge and throw much advice on fighting it, dont say i didnt warn you...

[cf24]

I got the summons in the post this morning, what is the next step.

I would have sent it back, 'Incorrectly addressed' or 'not at this address'. That's my advice after trying out the 'notice' route.... Just my opinion.

:cool:

[smoke n mirrors]

As a traveler, what authority did he have to hinder your lawful right to travel the land? If you had caused no harm, loss or damage where was the crime?

For £30 quid its really not worth losing sleep over...pay and use the time you save to get better prepared, for you next encounter. Hopefully you won't need to put it into practice.

Oh and pay the fine in 1p coins and request a receipt plus any other bullshit paper work, you can cause them to create.

Also as has been suggested make a formal complaint against the officer. It will be on his record for life whatever the out come. It may even make him think twice, before dishing crap out to other people in the future.

.

[kde_]

Your on the pavement for your own safety right! what law has been broken none. i would not pay up. next time ride off laughing :) at him running after you hehe

[jakemaverick]

i was once taught that it was 'illegal', allegedly, to ride on the pavement.....then we had a chief super indendent 'pigyob' stand up in assembly and ORDERED every pupil in the room to ride on the pavement because this was safer, even those who do not have bikes.....

I mean WTF? does it depend on whether it is a Tuesday or not?

the only way i know to get a name out of a pigyob is to kill one in self defence, in which case you will be whacked full of drugs and held in prison and tortured for the rest of your life....does anybody know what one has to do see a warrant card?

[morning]

Zeroman52, you shouldn't have given this police officer your details, and you had no reason to. The best thing to do would simply dismount your bike, walk on and ignore the bastard (or explain that you do not consent with his policy and that you are a free man).

You have no need to go to court, and you can avoid paying any fines. Firstly, this 'summons' is of course only an invitation to attend court, so if you recieve one then you have every right to ignore it.

I wouldn't worry about this police officers comment regarding a 'police state', I doubt he would've comprehended what you were referring to.

[earthwalkr]

Danster82,
I have read that in those situations where you are asked your name, by a police officer or a judge, either you keep silent, ("you have the right"), or you ask them, " IF I answer your question, am I contracting with you? " If they continue to ask for your name, repeat it or be silent. NEVER do what they say and NEVER GO with them.

[zeroman52]

what if they answer no?

[tom bombadil]

Hullo. Still here :)

In this respect I would advise the following.

1) If you are unsure then just apologize to the cop and move on. You had appologized to the peace officer and not the policy in-forcer.

If they then go along the lines of not letting you 'get away with it' and you dont know what you are doing then just pay the fine.

2) If you know what you are doing and all your words meant nothing to the automotom then you accept the fine under protest and duress (you sign it 'Under Protest and Duress, By: #### [your autograph] TM. All rights reserved' or at the very least 'By: ####[your autograph]'

You then send a notice within 3 days [look up what is best to write. Rob M is good for this] telling them that you are not accepting the fine and that you are now telling them the new laws that you want to be. Incuding a fee. After this time, if they dont contest this with a notice [not a letter as you can ignore this] then you can then take em' for all they have. Or better, for all that that copper has....bless him!


Look at no.1 though. Cos if you didnt understand what I said then you are treading on thin ice.


Nelly on the landing. :)

[girlgye]

Im interested to see what happens when someone doesnt give their name.
I mean what they going to do take you too the station and keep asking you for your details the whole time your telling them you have only come to the station under protest and duress and that your being unlawfully detained.

It would only be a matter of time until they start to sweat and have to let you go....?

I guess now youve given them details you just follow the standard procedure of sending your notice all the templates are on tpuc.

They keep you in a cell. freezing. stobe light flurorescent tubes racketering in your brain drives you mad. You sleep on virtual concrete and they keep opening the cricket wicket and go hello mary do you wanna give us your name yet. Do I have to? NO. Well, NO. This continues until 8.00 am the next morning where you are shackled put into a waiting meat van whereby for brownie points the Group 4 ties the cuffs so tight the blood stops flowing.

You are kept in a nasty under court cell with an even brighter more rapacious light and all life is finally sapped from you. You are then shackled to a guard and led up forcibly into a glass cell where you state your common law rights. They lie say they have their oaths and that they are recording it and let you go. when you go back and ask for your papers. They say you pleaded not guilty and you accepted bail.

That's what happens when you don't create a joinder to your name.

Oh. One more thing. They say you OBSTRUCTED THEM IN THE COURSE OF THEIR DUTY Section whatever under the 1996 Police Act which an indictable criminal offence and if you dont turn up in court a bench warrant will be put out for your arrest and you will be imprisoned.
so there.