Help needed - taking action against employer

[pleasuredome]

what lawful action can i take against an ex-employer?

i was employed by verbal contract to work 48 hours a week. 1 week later the employer told me i had to sign a contract in which i 'had' to opt out of the 'working time directive' which says that an employee cannot be forced to work over 48 hours a week unless he signs an AGREEMENT to opt out in the employment contract.

i told him that i wasnt prepared to sign the opt out, to which he said i should find other work. i said that i have a verbal contract of employment at 48 hours. well, push came to shove and he sacked me. this is a breach of the 'working time directive' and constitutes unfair dismissal.

i asked for a written notice of dismissal, and was never given one. i was given my weeks wage, plus 1 weeks pay in lieu of notice. i sent a letter of appeal against the dismissal, which is my statutory right, and it was ignored.

so there's two issues: 1; breach of contract. 2; unfair dismissal.

what would be the best course of action to take?

i am in england

[bobfunkhouse]

Although this hasn't got a lot to do with the Freeman concept , i'd answer this by saying that if all you have said is accurate , your employer has probably fucked up bigstyle..! :D you may well be quids in!!

[pleasuredome]

Although this hasn't got a lot to do with the Freeman concept , i'd answer this by saying that if all you have said is accurate , your employer has probably fucked up bigstyle..! :D you may well be quids in!!

yeah, i know i can definately get something from this. but what would be the best course of action? so far, i've been told that i can use a employment tribunal in regards to unfair dismissal or go to the county court for breach of contract.

i was wondering if using 'claim of right' or such lawful notices might be of better use, even before going to court?

[oddblock]

Sign up to the "Urban75" boards... LOADS of people there would be able to sort you out!!

Good luck! :cool:

[bobfunkhouse]

You could start by writing a letter to your ex boss, working out a figure that you feel is appropriate recompense for your unlawful dismissal backed up with a few legal arguments as to why you're in the right and see what they come back with. I sued my bank for a few grand over unlawful penalty charges in 2006 and they beat around the bush a lot before couging up the full amount out of court. :D

[pleasuredome]

You could start by writing a letter to your ex boss, working out a figure that you feel is appropriate recompense for your unlawful dismissal backed up with a few legal arguments as to why you're in the right and see what they come back with. I sued my bank for a few grand over unlawful penalty charges in 2006 and they beat around the bush a lot before couging up the full amount out of court. :D

trouble is i've got no idea how to frame the letter. do you know any examples on the net that you can link to for me? if i make a mistake, could it mess up the whole thing?

[pleasuredome]

Sign up to the "Urban75" boards... LOADS of people there would be able to sort you out!!

Good luck! :cool:

cheers for that, i'll take a look right now. :)

[mushroombot]

Hey man - good luck with your claim. 48 hours a week is too long imo. I remember a few years back, hours were being pushed down. It seems like its now in reverse.

[tien an]

what lawful action can i take against an ex-employer?

i was employed by verbal contract to work 48 hours a week. 1 week later the employer told me i had to sign a contract in which i 'had' to opt out of the 'working time directive' which says that an employee cannot be forced to work over 48 hours a week unless he signs an AGREEMENT to opt out in the employment contract.

i told him that i wasnt prepared to sign the opt out, to which he said i should find other work. i said that i have a verbal contract of employment at 48 hours. well, push came to shove and he sacked me. this is a breach of the 'working time directive' and constitutes unfair dismissal.

i asked for a written notice of dismissal, and was never given one. i was given my weeks wage, plus 1 weeks pay in lieu of notice. i sent a letter of appeal against the dismissal, which is my statutory right, and it was ignored.

so there's two issues: 1; breach of contract. 2; unfair dismissal.

what would be the best course of action to take?

i am in england

I fear that since it was 'only' a verbal contract, it's his word against yours that a contract of that kind took place.
In England, you have to work for one calendar month before you automatically have a contract with your employer; a contract that is recognized under law.

Your best move, IMO, is to find the Employment Tribunal in the town where you live.
Hand them a written account of what happened.
Do not be afraid: Unless you are completely taking the piss, no 'costs' or other charges will be brought against you if you happen to be wrong.
(It's not a court, it's a tribunal).
Your former employer will be contacted and a demand will be issued that he present his side of the story.
After that, prepare to be bombarded with offers of help from solicitors' offices the length and breadth of the country, since any such disputes are published (I'm not sure where exactly) and they simply pick your case out as a 'likely winner'.
The tribunal will send you a copy of your former employer's answer (he also has a copy of your accusations).
Thereafter (a month-ish) you will both be invited to attend the tribunal.
A hearing takes place.
Note that a tribunal can only award a maximum of three months' pay as compensation (time taken to find a new job) and this is usually limited to the time taken for you to actually find a new job. (ie. if you found a new job ten days later, you are unlikely to receive more than ten days' pay).
You will also be asked if you would like the tribunal to order the employer to reinstate you (might not be a good idea)

Don't take this as gospel: This is my personal experience and other cases may differ.

PS Good luck

[duckingdafta]

have you worked for them over 12 month?...as only then will tribunal we effective.

[1694]

Start your own co doing what you old job used to be and fuck your old boss out of business by doing it better.

Then you are your own boss and don't have to take shit from anyone.

[tien an]

have you worked for them over 12 month?...as only then will tribunal we effective.

Damn! The duck is right. Sorry about that.

[pleasuredome]

Damn! The duck is right. Sorry about that.

wrong mate. there was a breach of the working time regulations 1998 which constitutes unfair dismissal. there is no time limits for such unfair dismissal, in fact it starts from day 1 of your employment. one of the few statutory rights you have in your first month of employment.

[pleasuredome]

i've decided to send a NOUI & COR to the employer. this is how it reads. ... (been working on this all day, and desperatly need a toke lol)


Notice of Understanding and Intent And Claim of Right


To [address]

Whereas it is my understanding that you have failed to provide an itemised pay statement in contravention of Section 8 of the Employment Rights Act 1996

Whereas it is my understanding that you have failed to provide a statement of initial employment particulars in contravention to section 2 of the Employment Rights Act 1996

Whereas it is my understanding that it is my right under the Working Time Regulations 1998 to refuse to enter into agreement to work over 48 hours per week

Whereas it is my understanding that you unilaterally decided to change our verbal contact of employment from 48 hours per week to over 48 hours per week

Whereas it is my understanding that your unilateral decision was a breach of said contract

Whereas it is my understanding that I exercised my right to refuse to opt out of the Working Time Regulations 1998

Whereas it is my understanding that you dismissed me because I exercised my statutory right to refuse to opt out of the Working Time Regulations 1998

Whereas it is my understanding that my dismissal is a breach of Working Time Regulations 1998 and as such is classed as Unfair Dismissal

Whereas it is my understanding that a verbal agreement was made that I would be provided with a written notice of reason of dismissal

Whereas it is my understand that the said notice was never provided

Whereas it is my understanding that it is my right to appeal against the decision to be dismissed as stated by the Acas Code of Practice on Disciplinary and Grievance Procedures.

Whereas it is my understanding that you and ignored my right to appeal against dismissal

I hereby serve notice and state clearly, specifically and unequivocally my intent to claim just and fair compensation for all stated above.

I claim the right that I should be paid one year’s wage of £......, less tax and national insurance, for financial loss incurred

If you choose to dispute the claims made herein, or make counterclaims, you must respond appropriately within 3 (3) days of service of notice of this action via registered mail to:

[address]

Failure to register a dispute against the claims made herein will result in an automatic default judgement against you.


Sincerely and without ill will, vexation or frivolity
[Signature]


p.s i will correct spelling mistakes lol

[pri01]

wrong mate. there was a breach of the working time regulations 1998 which constitutes unfair dismissal. there is no time limits for such unfair dismissal, in fact it starts from day 1 of your employment. one of the few statutory rights you have in your first month of employment.

I thought that length of employment was also significant in terms of your ability to claim compensation. However, your info says otherwise but I wonder if it applies to those who are offered employment where there is a agreed trial period?

[tien an]

wrong mate. there was a breach of the working time regulations 1998 which constitutes unfair dismissal. there is no time limits for such unfair dismissal, in fact it starts from day 1 of your employment. one of the few statutory rights you have in your first month of employment.

That sounds interesting: What's your source? Where did you find that info?

[pleasuredome]

I thought that length of employment was also significant in terms of your ability to claim compensation. However, your info says otherwise but I wonder if it applies to those who are offered employment where there is a agreed trial period?

yeah, i thought about that, but there is no provision for a 'trial period' in the statutes. when you think about it, your statutory rights are limited for the first month anyway to cater for people and employers decide not to want to continue. just because an employer says its a 'trial period' doesnt mean that your statutory rights are waved. and even if the term does mean something, why was i offered to sign a written contract at the end of the first week? i can guaruntee there would have been no mention of 'trial period' in it. if i had signed it, it would have been finished the previous verbal contract.

having said that, the employer ignored my appeal against the dismissal, which renders the whole case as unfair dismissal anyway. at least that is the way a tribunal would see it :cool:

[pleasuredome]

That sounds interesting: What's your source? Where did you find that info?

check out the berr website (http://www.berr.gov.uk/), i'd try and find links for you but im unwinding right now ;)

[keystone]

You really should consult a solicitor specialising in employment law before going anywhere near a tribunal or sending a NOUI. The latter route will just take you outside the employment law you think he has broken and may well invalidate any claim you think you have against him. Certainly send NOTHING at all to the employer or communicate with him verbally until you have taken advice.

You won't get any usable advice here or anywhere else on the internet I'm afraid. It will only be general opinions

Each case is different and you could well end up jeopardising your own position.

I'm not preaching here or being negative. I've been there myself and it's very tricky. You need a professional in employment law to help you. Try the CAB to get the name of a recommended solicitor if you don't know one yourself.

[pleasuredome]

You really should consult a solicitor specialising in employment law before going anywhere near a tribunal or sending a NOUI. The latter route will just take you outside the employment law you think he has broken and may well invalidate any claim you think you have against him. Certainly send NOTHING at all to the employer or communicate with him verbally until you have taken advice.

You won't get any usable advice here or anywhere else on the internet I'm afraid. It will only be general opinions

Each case is different and you could well end up jeopardising your own position.

I'm not preaching here or being negative. I've been there myself and it's very tricky. You need a professional in employment law to help you. Try the CAB to get the name of a recommended solicitor if you don't know one yourself.

what i'm going to do is see a solicitor on friday and get some further advice about all the options available. after i've seen the solicitor i will post his advice. :cool:

[wise haven]

what i'm going to do is see a solicitor on friday and get some further advice about all the options available. after i've seen the solicitor i will post his advice. :cool:

Woah! Slow down with the solicitor....it will cost you.

Make an appointment with your local Citizens Advice Bureau - or call them on telephone advice day - it's free and probably better advice and less hassle than getting a paid liar...sorry solicitor.

This case looks cut and dried as being unfair dismissal - Don't go getting a solicitor just yet.

Plus, you don't need to use the Freeman stuff for this - in fact it is probably irrelevant in this case.

KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid ;) CAB is the route for thee.

p.s. Verbal contracts are just as valid as written ones - fact!

[pleasuredome]

Woah! Slow down with the solicitor....it will cost you.

Make an appointment with your local Citizens Advice Bureau - or call them on telephone advice day - it's free and probably better advice and less hassle than getting a paid liar...sorry solicitor.

This case looks cut and dried as being unfair dismissal - Don't go getting a solicitor just yet.

Plus, you don't need to use the Freeman stuff for this - in fact it is probably irrelevant in this case.

KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid ;) CAB is the route for thee.

p.s. Verbal contracts are just as valid as written ones - fact!

guess what? im getting free advice from the solicitor. god works in mysterious ways ;):D

[wise haven]

guess what? im getting free advice from the solicitor. god works in mysterious ways ;):D

Hey! - good for you, hope you get things sorted :)

[tien an]

Verbal contracts are just as valid as written ones - fact!


Really? I'm surprised. (how is it that gazumping exists then?).

Can you tell me how this is worded in law (I think you said you were studying law).

Very interesting...

[pleasuredome]

Really? I'm surprised. (how is it that gazumping exists then?).

Can you tell me how this is worded in law (I think you said you were studying law).

Very interesting...

yes, it is as valid as a written contract. the problem comes in trying to prove there was one.

[pleasuredome]

Really? (how is it that gazumping exists then?).


off topic, but here's the answer


Under English and Welsh law agreements are not legally binding until contracts are exchanged. This affords both the advantage of freedom before contract, but also the disadvantage of wasted time and expense in the event the deal is not done.

The normal practice is for the buyer to negotiate an agreed price with the seller then organise a survey and have the solicitor (or conveyancer) carry out their searches and pre-contract enquiries. The seller's solicitor or conveyancer will prepare the draft contract to be approved by the buyer's solicitor. The seller's solicitor will also collect and prepare property information to be provided to the buyer's solicitors, in line with the Law Society's National Protocol for domestic conveyancing.

It takes on average 10–12 weeks to complete a conveyancing transaction, but some transactions are quicker, many take longer. The timescale is determined by a host of factors - legal, personal, social and financial. During this period prior to exchange of contracts (exchange being the point at which the transaction becomes legally-binding) either party can pull out of the transaction at any time and for any reason, with no legal obligation to the other. This gives rise to a risk of gazumping and its converse, gazundering.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conveyancing

[godspeed]

let us know how you get on,its the brutal season it seems,lot of people getting a lot of shit because others are'nt doing their jobs right,fight them all the way,dont give them a chance to fool you out of compensation....good luck mate...

[pleasuredome]

clandestine recordings are now admissible as evidence. after submitting a false defence, my ex-employer is fucked :D