Truthers confront Masons about Albert Pike - vid

[dondaz]

This is good. Shows just how little the average mason know about their own brotherhood. This is worth watching:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIZGYlT1PEU&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djr88iv1FmQ&feature=related

[thelonious]

This is good. Shows just how little the average mason know about their own brotherhood.

They don't know anything about Pike because they're Canadian, and Albert Pike had nothing to do with Canadian Masonry whatsoever. Pike's book, "Morals and Dogma" (which they keep waving around) only concerns the Scottish Rite of Masonry for the Southern Jurisdiction of the United States (where Pike was presiding officer of the Southern Jurisdiction Supreme Council). Pike never had any Masonic authority, or even membership, anywhere else.

[waterbwoy]

:DDondaz, that was class.

Who was that guy - Chevy Chase? Because that was pure comedy.

Who did he think he was kidding.

My must watch vid of the week.

Thanks

[waterbwoy]

They don't know anything about Pike because they're Canadian, and Albert Pike had nothing to do with Canadian Masonry whatsoever. Pike's book, "Morals and Dogma" (which they keep waving around) only concerns the Scottish Rite of Masonry for the Southern Jurisdiction of the United States (where Pike was presiding officer of the Southern Jurisdiction Supreme Council). Pike never had any Masonic authority, or even membership, anywhere else.

Are you sure? He was plainly telling porkies about reading it

[thelonious]

Are you sure?

Yes.

He was plainly telling porkies about reading it

Huh?

[waterbwoy]

Yes.



Huh?

Quite plainly he says he nor any masons have anything to do with the pike book then later he says he read some of the book.

I don't trust anyone who believes they have the authority to speak on behalf of others unknowingly to make a point - People who apply this technique are on eggshells as regards credibility.

I mean - if I say "all people in this group, whether I know each one directly or not feel this way about a certain thing so therefore my point is made"

It's sketchy I know - but can you see my point.:confused:

[masonfree party]

Yes.



Huh?


oh dear not another brainwashed masonic prat on here...

[zero1]

Just goes to show, low-level Masons don't know any more about the esoteric agenda of the org than a local RC priest does about his Church.

But as I've said before, although I understand that top-level Masons, Zionists and Jesuits control much of the Conspiracy to a degree from the fifth (bottom) tier of the power pyramid, to the third tier, there are two whole tiers above them - the second a cabal hidden in plain sight that no-one (including CT researchers) has unearthed yet, and above them...things that are not necessarily human, though may and do appear so.

Five tiers, people, with an unnamed Capstone that rules all five including the top two. Masons, Zionists, and Jesuits, though used and active in the agenda, mostly form somewhat of a smokescreen to obscure the real Hidden Powers at the top.

In the OP vids, the Truthers are (nobly) wasting time. But that is all...

[thelonious]

Quite plainly he says he nor any masons have anything to do with the pike book then later he says he read some of the book.

I don't trust anyone who believes they have the authority to speak on behalf of others unknowingly to make a point - People who apply this technique are on eggshells as regards credibility.

I mean - if I say "all people in this group, whether I know each one directly or not feel this way about a certain thing so therefore my point is made"

It's sketchy I know - but can you see my point.:confused:

Yes, I understand.

The 32 chapters in Pike's book "Morals and Dogma" actually are the collection of lectures for the 32 degrees in the Scottish Rite of Masonry as practiced in the Southern Jurisdiction of the USA. Pike was commisioned by the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite, Southern Jurisdiction USA, to revise the initiation ceremonies of the 32 degrees. Instead of just revising them, he practically re-wrote them. The new Pike rituals were adopted as the official ritual of the Southern Jurisdiction USA, and they printed Pike's book of lectures, which for many years was given as a gift to all new members of the Scottish Rite in the Southern Jurisdiction.

I mention all of that because, in regard to these videos, it is important to understand that the Scottish Rite in Canada has never used Pike's rituals. Neither has the Northern Jurisdiction of the United States, nor England, nor anywhere else. Since "Morals and Dogma" contains the lectures for the degrees ofthe Southern Jurisdiction only, the book was never printed and made available to anyone else. So when the Canadian Masons say they are notfamiliar with the book, it's not because they are ignorant of Freemasonry per se, but just don't have a lot of knowledge of Scottish Rite Freemasonry as practiced in the southern jurisdiction of the USA. They may be complete scholars and experts concerning Canadian Masonry.

[damagedbrainn]

Quite plainly he says he nor any masons have anything to do with the pike book then later he says he read some of the book.

I don't trust anyone who believes they have the authority to speak on behalf of others unknowingly to make a point - People who apply this technique are on eggshells as regards credibility.

I mean - if I say "all people in this group, whether I know each one directly or not feel this way about a certain thing so therefore my point is made"

It's sketchy I know - but can you see my point.:confused:

Anyone can read the book. You can even find it on the internet.

[thelonious]

Anyone can read the book. You can even find it on the internet.

True. It can be read in full here:

http://www.sacred-texts.com/mas/md/index.htm

And while the book is no longer printed by the Supreme Council, there are always used copies available on Ebay.

[zero1]

And while the book is no longer printed by the Supreme Council, there are always used copies available on Ebay.

Ohh. "Supreme Council", hmm? Like the sound of that, important like. Tell us about that. :)

[mike martin]

Just goes to show, low-level Masons don't know any more about the esoteric agenda of the org than a local RC priest does about his Church.
It actually showed that the members of the AASR outside of Pike's own jurisdiction don't know or care who the hell he was.

It also showed that the "Truthers" were not willing to believe it when a randomly "doorstepped" Canadian Mason tells them exactly the same thing that we've been telling you about Pike.

I've never really understood why CTs obsess about Pike! There are thousands of books written by Freemasons about Freemasonry that are all exactly as authoritive as Pike's book, as in not at all.

In the OP vids, the Truthers are (nobly) wasting time. But that is all...
I have to agree! In the words of Jack Nicholson "You can't handle the truth":D

The guy who says "I can't believe what I'm hearing" is a perfect example!

Mike

[kweli]

It actually showed that the members of the AASR outside of Pike's own jurisdiction don't know or care who the hell he was.

It also showed that the "Truthers" were not willing to believe it when a randomly "doorstepped" Canadian Mason tells them exactly the same thing that we've been telling you about Pike.

I've never really understood why CTs obsess about Pike! There are thousands of books written by Freemasons about Freemasonry that are all exactly as authoritive as Pike's book, as in not at all.


I have to agree! In the words of Jack Nicholson "You can't handle the truth":D

The guy who says "I can't believe what I'm hearing" is a perfect example!

Mike

Hello Mr Mike Martin Mason, have you read any of Stephen Knight's books on Freemasonary - - Jack the Ripper: The Final Solution, The Brotherhood: the secret world of the Freemasons? If so, what's your take on them?

[jim fear]

I haven’t got round to the freemason research yet, I have so much to read at the moment.

From the little that I do know about masonry they have the blue degrees and the rest. The lower levels of masonry is basically like the club scouts for adults and I’m sure everyone knows someone who is a mason and I don’t the think they are all bad people at all.

I think its great that these guys where cool during the interview. This kind of behaviour is so important in order to make progress in individual/group research.
You should always treat people with respect.

[hiram_abiff]

From this video it is clear that the people asking the questions have very little understanding of Lucifer. I will post a thread on here of a study on Lucifer and then contrast it to what Albert Pike is saying. I will do this asap but am very busy at the minute. Albert Pike was a very clever man. Well versed Religion and esoteric knowledge.
To assume that all Masons are mislead is silly.There are Masons who are top researchers in symbology and ancient religions and understand far more about the origins and rituals than people who have gone through all the side degrees in Freemasonry.
Also it is not a fair to stand outside a masonic research centre / masonic hall or whatever it was in the video and ask questions of people who do not have the means to answer them.

[hiram_abiff]

I haven’t got round to the freemason research yet, I have so much to read at the moment.

From the little that I do know about masonry they have the blue degrees and the rest. The lower levels of masonry is basically like the club scouts for adults and I’m sure everyone knows someone who is a mason and I don’t the think they are all bad people at all.

I think its great that these guys where cool during the interview. This kind of behaviour is so important in order to make progress in individual/group research.
You should always treat people with respect.

Ok, I think you will find that most masons take masonry very seriously.It is not a club. there is a bar to socialize after lodge in a lot of masonic halls.
I keep hearing about the lower levels of freemasonry, as if people are trapped in craft masonry? ANYBODY is free to advance to the side degrees in Freemasonry if he so wishes once he has attained the 3rd.
Here is the big secret you've been waiting for boys.The reason why people do not advance further than the blue lodge is because..... their craft lodge will meet once a month and they will have the lodge of instruction (where you practice and learn the rituals) weekly.This is one night a week for three weeks and then two nights a week once a month.That is a lot of time to give up when you have a family. Ok so then you join a side degree or chapter. they meet on a different day sometimes in a different location to the local masonic hall. It can all be very time consuming and you got to keep the wife happy boys so thats why a lot of people stick to the craft lodge at their local masonic hall. See what happens when you apply a little common sense.The truth is indeed out there!!!

[astral_girl]

Ok, I think you will find that most masons take masonry very seriously.It is not a club. there is a bar to socialize after lodge in a lot of masonic halls.
I keep hearing about the lower levels of freemasonry, as if people are trapped in craft masonry? ANYBODY is free to advance to the side degrees in Freemasonry if he so wishes once he has attained the 3rd.
Here is the big secret you've been waiting for boys.The reason why people do not advance further than the blue lodge is because..... their craft lodge will meet once a month and they will have the lodge of instruction (where you practice and learn the rituals) weekly.This is one night a week for three weeks and then two nights a week once a month.That is a lot of time to give up when you have a family. Ok so then you join a side degree or chapter. they meet on a different day sometimes in a different location to the local masonic hall. It can all be very time consuming and you got to keep the wife happy boys so thats why a lot of people stick to the craft lodge at their local masonic hall. See what happens when you apply a little common sense.The truth is indeed out there!!!

ARE YOU A MASON?

[astral_girl]

From this video it is clear that the people asking the questions have very little understanding of Lucifer. I will post a thread on here of a study on Lucifer and then contrast it to what Albert Pike is saying. I will do this asap but am very busy at the minute. Albert Pike was a very clever man. Well versed Religion and esoteric knowledge.
To assume that all Masons are mislead is silly.There are Masons who are top researchers in symbology and ancient religions and understand far more about the origins and rituals than people who have gone through all the side degrees in Freemasonry.
Also it is not a fair to stand outside a masonic research centre / masonic hall or whatever it was in the video and ask questions of people who do not have the means to answer them.

yeah and they is masons who practice black magik .....come on boys lets get clean ..........tell it like it really is ....;)

[damagedbrainn]

Ok, I think you will find that most masons take masonry very seriously.It is not a club. there is a bar to socialize after lodge in a lot of masonic halls.
I keep hearing about the lower levels of freemasonry, as if people are trapped in craft masonry? ANYBODY is free to advance to the side degrees in Freemasonry if he so wishes once he has attained the 3rd.

That all depends on which appendant body you want to join. Some require additional beliefs to the relatively ambiguous "belief in a Supreme Being". Others require that you have followed a specific path of learning or training (whatever you wanna call it) while in Craft Masonry. Others are by invitation only. I'm sure you knew this already. Stop PR-ing and just be honest.

[astral_girl]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_b3LMoQUJ0

[hiram_abiff]

That all depends on which appendant body you want to join. Some require additional beliefs to the relatively ambiguous "belief in a Supreme Being". Others require that you have followed a specific path of learning or training (whatever you wanna call it) while in Craft Masonry. Others are by invitation only. I'm sure you knew this already. Stop PR-ing and just be honest.

this is true, for some side degrees you need to profess the trinitarian faith. I do not see why people of another faith would want to join these degrees. However if they wanted to convert they are free to do so, therefor they are not excluded, there is a way in for them if they want it.
As for the invitation only degrees, once you start to get to know people within freemasonry you find that your friends will openly invite you to join these degrees. In the past freemasonry has had trouble getting new initiates to stay the course within freemasonry so you wont find many people within freemasonry discouraging somebody who wants to progress.
There you go no pretending, honesty is the best policy.

[hiram_abiff]

yeah and they is masons who practice black magik .....come on boys lets get clean ..........tell it like it really is ....;)

I personally dont know any Freemasons who practice black magic.However I am not so narrow minded as to think that it doesn't go on.
There are probably some Freemasons who practice black magic the same as there are other members in society who practice black magic. So I'm not opposed to that idea, you just got to look at things in proportion.

[mike martin]

Hello Mr Mike Martin Mason, have you read any of Stephen Knight's books on Freemasonary - - Jack the Ripper: The Final Solution, The Brotherhood: the secret world of the Freemasons? If so, what's your take on them?

I'm not quite sure why you address me so, is it being sarcastic? I'm just Mike!

I don't blame you for not trying to trawl through the TFM topic, so here is what I wrote in answer to a similar question there.

Hi again chaps sorry to come back again, I didn't intend to but this question is so interesting and people on other CT Forums (Con Cen etc) that I have used have been interested in my story so I'm going to share again.

I was about 17 when I first heard of Freemasonry, I picked up a book called "The Brotherhood" by a guy called Stephen Knight. I became an Anti-mason these twisted, sick, murdering, KGB-loving bar stewards were trying to ruin my Country because they were Masons. About a year later I saw a film on Telly called "The Man Who Would be King" by Rudyard Kipling (a Freemason) and it gave a completely different picture. Fortunately for me when I get hooked by a subject, I dig deeper. I bought more books both Anti and just Masonic.

What I found was that the masonic books full of history and details abot Masonry and clearly written by Masons made far more sense than the Anti books which kept on recycling the same old stuff. Enter the Internet and I had access to so much information from all around the World and guess what all the Anti stuff was still the same old stuff again just reproduced electronically. I had a full historical grip on the Freemason and decided I wanted to be a part fo them so set to trying to find one to ask. In 1994 I was Initiated into my Mother Lodge and have never looked back and I have made friends all over the World and our only link initially is the fact that we're Masons even thugh we're in different countries.

Yes I've read both books by Knight although the "Final Solution" wasn't actually about Freemasonry. I've also read "Inside the Brotherhood" Martin Short's sequel to "The Broherhood" where he tried to replicate Knight's successful income by introducing even more far out claims about Freemasonry. I have also read (and still have them in my personal Library) the following Anti-masonic titles:

A History of Freemasonry (1949) by Joseph McCabe,
Al-Islam, Christianity & Freemasonry (1990) by Mustfa El-Amin,
Darkness Visible (1953) by Walton Hannah,
Freemasonry – A Christian Perspective (1999) by John Lawrence,
Global Freemasonry (1993) by Haran Yaya,
The Craft and the Cross (1989) by Ian Gordon,
The Masonic Christian Conflict Explained (2005) by Keith Harris

The time I first read some of these books I believed them to be true, I now know better.

Mike

[mike martin]

Another thing that struck me about the video was he guy in the background who desperately challenged the Mason with that other well-known "uber-Mason" Manly Palmer Hall.

Manly P Hall started writing books in the 1920s, and wrote "the Lost Keys of Freemasonry" in 1923, unfortunately what most Anti-masons (who use him as a source) don't seem to know is that he didn't actually join the Masons until 1954.

He wrote about Freemasonry not as a Mason but as a Theosophist and he thought they were the same thing until he actually joined. After he joined he added this to the preface of later editions of his books:

"At the time I wrote this slender volume, I had just passed my twenty-first birthday, and my only contact with Freemasonry was through a few books commonly available to the public."

Mike

[mike martin]

yeah and they is masons who practice black magik .....come on boys lets get clean ..........tell it like it really is ....;)

The only honest answer that can be given to this question is that there could be but I've never come across any.

Although in reality it's like saying there are Priests who practise black magic, it is possible but unlikely as the organisation they are involved in does not promote such a thing.

Mike

[hiram_abiff]

Lucifer


Lucifer is a Latin word meaning Light bearer from the root lux meaning Light. Now in Roman astrology this was a term for Venus. This Planet was known as the morning star because it could be seen on the horizon in the east before the sun rose. It was termed Lucifer, “bearer of light” because its appearance signalled the rising of the sun.

The Hebrew for this is Helel ben shahar meaning son of dawn.

Also it is important to understand that in mythology Lucifers attributes are pride and self exaltation.

Ok, so in the light of the above now we will look at the reference to Lucifer in morals and dogma which everyone bangs on about.


“The Apocalypse is, to those who receive the nineteenth Degree,
the Apothesis of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone,
and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer. LUCIFER, the
Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit
of Darknesss! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who
bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble,
sensual or selfish Souls ? Doubt it not! for traditions are full of
Divine Revelations and Inspirations: and Inspiration is not of
one Age nor of one Creed. Plato and Philo, also, were inspired”


What is is saying is that those who receive the 19 degree are taught to put away the faith that aspires to God alone. The single mindedness that causes wars.
It then goes on to say that it is Lucifer who blinds these peoples souls because they fail to see that traditions are full of divine revelations and inspirations and that inspiration is not just of one age nor creed.

Ok , now you are going say freemasons worship Lucifer. No, what you need to understand is that in Freemasonry, Light is knowledge. So being blinded by Lucifer = Light bearer= means a lack of knowledge. In this case it is being blind to the fact that inspiration comes from more than one creed.

Come on boys you know I make sense, its all allegory. Chill man chill. Let me know what you think.

[kweli]

I'm not quite sure why you address me so, is it being sarcastic? I'm just Mike!

I don't blame you for not trying to trawl through the TFM topic, so here is what I wrote in answer to a similar question there.



Yes I've read both books by Knight although the "Final Solution" wasn't actually about Freemasonry. I've also read "Inside the Brotherhood" Martin Short's sequel to "The Broherhood" where he tried to replicate Knight's successful income by introducing even more far out claims about Freemasonry. I have also read (and still have them in my personal Library) the following Anti-masonic titles:

A History of Freemasonry (1949) by Joseph McCabe,
Al-Islam, Christianity & Freemasonry (1990) by Mustfa El-Amin,
Darkness Visible (1953) by Walton Hannah,
Freemasonry – A Christian Perspective (1999) by John Lawrence,
Global Freemasonry (1993) by Haran Yaya,
The Craft and the Cross (1989) by Ian Gordon,
The Masonic Christian Conflict Explained (2005) by Keith Harris

The time I first read some of these books I believed them to be true, I now know better.

Mike

Sorry Mike, I wasn't trying to be sarcastic, just my attempts at humour. :o Thanks for answering my question. So do you dispute everything in his books? What of his claims of masonic corruption in the Police Force? (Birmingham in particular) wasn't there evidence to back this up? Please don't think I'm having a go, I'm genuinely interested in finding out more and I'm certainly not of the opinion that all masons are 'evil' I just think they're misguided, that's all. ;)

[mike martin]

Sorry Mike, I wasn't trying to be sarcastic, just my attempts at humour. :o Thanks for answering my question. So do you dispute everything in his books? What of his claims of masonic corruption in the Police Force? (Birmingham in particular) wasn't there evidence to back this up? Please don't think I'm having a go, I'm genuinely interested in finding out more and I'm certainly not of the opinion that all masons are 'evil' I just think they're misguided, that's all. ;)

OK cool about the name thing I was just checking.

Oh God yes I do, especially the claims about the West Midlands Serious Crime Squad and now of course so do the British Government.

You're obviously not aware of the Home Affairs Select Committee's investigation into " Freemasonry in the Police and Judiciary", it was big news then. In 1994 mainly led by Chris Mullins MP and Martin Short, the full weight of Parliament was brought to bear on English Freemasonry, based in the main on exactly the same claims that are repeated ad nauseum on this Forum.

Martin Short himself was the first "expert" witness rolled in for questioning by the Committee. He made all the claims made by himself and Stephen Knight to the Committee and off they went to investigate.

Our then Grand Secretary was summoned to give evidence, which he did, however the Committee asked him to supply a complete list of all the members of the UGLE, he quite rightly said that surely this would be an infringement of our Rights and all hell broke loose. In the death what happend was investigators were sent to Grand Lodge to compare the names of the WMSCS policemen to the registers of members.

I attach the findings of that Committee:

The West Midlands Serious Crimes Squad

14. The West Midlands Serious Crime Squad was arguably the most complained about unit in what was the most complained about police force in the country. Before and after it was disbanded in August 1989 the convictions of more than thirty people were quashed by the Court of Appeal after allegations of police malpractice, and most have been awarded large sums in compensation. Systematic fabrication of confessions was the main allegation. Among the more shocking cases was that of Derek Treadaway. Mr Treadaway was one of several men who alleged that he had been persuaded to confess by having a plastic bag held over his head until he lost consciousness. He was eventually awarded £50,000 damages against the West Midlands police. The judge said he was satisfied "to a high degree of probability" that Mr Treadway had been telling the truth and that the police officers had been lying.

15. During the course of its first inquiry, the Committee submitted to Grand Lodge a list of 96[26] names of officers who had served in the Serious Crime Squad between 1974 and its disbandment in 1989. We received various replies. The first indicated that eight were probably masons, six possibly, 58 were not and in another 24 cases it was not possible at that stage to tell.[27] Grand Lodge later indicated that only 10 of the 14 probable or possibles were in fact masons at the time they were in the squad and one other had been a candidate for membership; another had become a mason after he left the Squad and one other was no longer a mason when he joined.[28] Still later, in oral evidence, the Secretary of Grand Lodge (Commander Higham) reported that further checks had reduced the figure of 10 masons to five, plus one possible and one who had become a mason after leaving the Squad.[29]

16. The information handed to the Chairman, following the Committee's Order of 19 February 1998, revealed the names of seven officers who were masons during the relevant period. At this point the Chairman drew the attention of Grand Lodge to an eighth officer who had said on television that he was a mason and in due course Grand Lodge confirmed that this was so.[30] Among the names listed are two who featured prominently in allegations of corruption, although so far as we are aware neither has ever been charged or disciplined in connection with these allegations.

17. We regret that it has taken Grand Lodge five attempts to arrive at a definitive—if it is definitive—list of masons in the Serious Crimes Squad. We accept, however, that this may be explained by the difficulty in cross checking local and national records and we do not attach particular significance to this.

18. On the basis of the information supplied, we conclude that freemasonry was not a primary cause of the difficulties within the Serious Crimes Squad although we cannot entirely exclude the possibility that it may have been a contributory factor

It is possible to find all of the findings of the Committee on the Net (as I'm not at home at the moment I don't have the links to hand) including the bit where they say that there is no evidence to back any of the claims made, unfortunately Chris Mullins forced through changes to the recommedations so as to reuire Judges and Police to register their membership as "Interests" this showed that far less coppers and Judges are actually Masons than anyone believed.

Mike

[mike martin]

Please don't think I'm having a go, I'm genuinely interested in finding out more and I'm certainly not of the opinion that all masons are 'evil' I just think they're misguided, that's all. ;)

I'm sorry but the truth is only a small number of Masons are "misguided", they actually think they are joining what the Antis believe, they also tend to leave quite quickly when they are disappointed.

Mike

[razed1]

supreme council of the sublime eminence of the queer prince of all turds :D

[kweli]

OK cool about the name thing I was just checking.

Oh God yes I do, especially the claims about the West Midlands Serious Crime Squad and now of course so do the British Government.

You're obviously not aware of the Home Affairs Select Committee's investigation into " Freemasonry in the Police and Judiciary", it was big news then. In 1994 mainly led by Chris Mullins MP and Martin Short, the full weight of Parliament was brought to bear on English Freemasonry, based in the main on exactly the same claims that are repeated ad nauseum on this Forum.

Martin Short himself was the first "expert" witness rolled in for questioning by the Committee. He made all the claims made by himself and Stephen Knight to the Committee and off they went to investigate.

Our then Grand Secretary was summoned to give evidence, which he did, however the Committee asked him to supply a complete list of all the members of the UGLE, he quite rightly said that surely this would be an infringement of our Rights and all hell broke loose. In the death what happend was investigators were sent to Grand Lodge to compare the names of the WMSCS policemen to the registers of members.

I attach the findings of that Committee:

The West Midlands Serious Crimes Squad

14. The West Midlands Serious Crime Squad was arguably the most complained about unit in what was the most complained about police force in the country. Before and after it was disbanded in August 1989 the convictions of more than thirty people were quashed by the Court of Appeal after allegations of police malpractice, and most have been awarded large sums in compensation. Systematic fabrication of confessions was the main allegation. Among the more shocking cases was that of Derek Treadaway. Mr Treadaway was one of several men who alleged that he had been persuaded to confess by having a plastic bag held over his head until he lost consciousness. He was eventually awarded £50,000 damages against the West Midlands police. The judge said he was satisfied "to a high degree of probability" that Mr Treadway had been telling the truth and that the police officers had been lying.

15. During the course of its first inquiry, the Committee submitted to Grand Lodge a list of 96[26] names of officers who had served in the Serious Crime Squad between 1974 and its disbandment in 1989. We received various replies. The first indicated that eight were probably masons, six possibly, 58 were not and in another 24 cases it was not possible at that stage to tell.[27] Grand Lodge later indicated that only 10 of the 14 probable or possibles were in fact masons at the time they were in the squad and one other had been a candidate for membership; another had become a mason after he left the Squad and one other was no longer a mason when he joined.[28] Still later, in oral evidence, the Secretary of Grand Lodge (Commander Higham) reported that further checks had reduced the figure of 10 masons to five, plus one possible and one who had become a mason after leaving the Squad.[29]

16. The information handed to the Chairman, following the Committee's Order of 19 February 1998, revealed the names of seven officers who were masons during the relevant period. At this point the Chairman drew the attention of Grand Lodge to an eighth officer who had said on television that he was a mason and in due course Grand Lodge confirmed that this was so.[30] Among the names listed are two who featured prominently in allegations of corruption, although so far as we are aware neither has ever been charged or disciplined in connection with these allegations.

17. We regret that it has taken Grand Lodge five attempts to arrive at a definitive—if it is definitive—list of masons in the Serious Crimes Squad. We accept, however, that this may be explained by the difficulty in cross checking local and national records and we do not attach particular significance to this.

18. On the basis of the information supplied, we conclude that freemasonry was not a primary cause of the difficulties within the Serious Crimes Squad although we cannot entirely exclude the possibility that it may have been a contributory factor

It is possible to find all of the findings of the Committee on the Net (as I'm not at home at the moment I don't have the links to hand) including the bit where they say that there is no evidence to back any of the claims made, unfortunately Chris Mullins forced through changes to the recommedations so as to reuire Judges and Police to register their membership as "Interests" this showed that far less coppers and Judges are actually Masons than anyone believed.

Mike

Again, thanks for taking the time to reply. I will admit, they are the only books on Freemasonary I've read up to now, and of course the sort of anti - mason stuff you read on this site and others. However, I like to garner as much information as possible from all sides before making my mind up, so your information is appreciated.

I still think you're misguided though and I'm no big fan of secret societies, but hey, that's just my opinion, I'm sure we can agree to disagree on that one?

[mike martin]

Again, thanks for taking the time to reply. I will admit, they are the only books on Freemasonary I've read up to now, and of course the sort of anti - mason stuff you read on this site and others. However, I like to garner as much information as possible from all sides before making my mind up, so your information is appreciated.

Well you can get all of the others that I've listed and once you've read them you too will see that it is the same old stuff recycled despite being decades apart from each other. If you want I can recommend you some proper Masonic titles but you won't find the kind of titillating material you're used to from Anti and CT stuff. As has also been mentioned elsewhere you can even get hold of M&D online or for about £20 on Ebay and you would not recognise the 100 odd words that get misquoted (again and again) in amongst the 900 pages of the book.

I still think you're misguided though and I'm no big fan of secret societies, but hey, that's just my opinion, I'm sure we can agree to disagree on that one?

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, it's just when it's flaunted as fact that I get irritated.

I'm a member of Freemasonry, it's not secret it never has been, in fact it has, at different times in history, been "fashionable". If it was "secret" you wouldn't know about it, as we would all be under oath to not tell anyone about it, wouldn't we. Now Orders like the Independent Order of Oddfellows and the Knights of St Columbanus are less well know but even then they're still not secret.

Mike

[razed1]

then why is it more important to the mainstream media to report on britney missing underwear

but they dont find it important to report on the fact that the movers and shakers of world politics/ hollywood/ religions are members of an international network of 'brothers'

wink wink, tisk tisk, BLAH BLAH alrite, you living in delusions man, you dont even see the ramifications of even just the existence of an organization like yours

[the guy in pink]

then why is it more important to the mainstream media to report on britney missing underwear but they dont find it important to report on the fact that the movers and shakers of world politics/ hollywood/ religions are members of an international network of 'brothers'.


Can you picture it, The Front pages of our newspapers giving us full of reports of our monthy meetings.
"24 members were present and three fell asleep during the reading of the minutes of the previous minutes""
and
"After a show of hands the members decided to replace the candles on the warden pedestals with electric imitiation candles to comply with council fire requlations"
Thrilling stuff ! Bound to increase sales of the National Daily papers.

[mike martin]

then why is it more important to the mainstream media to report on britney missing underwear

That's easy and there's no conspiracy, it's because the Media report on what the "proles" want to read and what makes it money.

but they dont find it important to report on the fact that the movers and shakers of world politics/ hollywood/ religions are members of an international network of 'brothers'
Even the the Media finds it difficult to report people's theories especially when most of them don't even bear up to the Media's own depraved view of what constitutes news.

wink wink, tisk tisk, BLAH BLAH alrite, you living in delusions man, you dont even see the ramifications of even just the existence of an organization like yours
The words pot, black and kettle spring to mind when reading your words fellah!!

Mike

[razed1]

Can you picture it, The Front pages of our newspapers giving us full of reports of our monthy meetings.
"24 members were present and three fell asleep during the reading of the minutes of the previous minutes""
and
"After a show of hands the members decided to replace the candles on the warden pedestals with electric imitiation candles to comply with council fire requlations"
Thrilling stuff ! Bound to increase sales of the National Daily papers.

"Meanwhile at the top of these sheep's pyramid, the members of the royal bloodline (who hold titles of Grandmaster and such) sacrificed another human child, raped a 9 yr old boy and drank his blood, during their monthly ritual at midnight mass"

[razed1]

Even the the Media finds it difficult to report people's theories especially when most of them don't even bear up to the Media's own depraved view of what constitutes news.


theories huh?


so i suppose that the same media that just 5 years ago, denounced the existance of the Bilderberg meeting were just having a laugh, since Bill Clinton himself admitted on camera, in front of a live audience that he DID attend a bilderberg meeting

Im not so easily swayed by your perceived words of wisdom,

the enemy that has created your organization is showing their face more and more, and you ppl who make up the fodder are going to be consumed by this BEAST system

[the guy in pink]

"Meanwhile at the top of these sheep's pyramid, the members of the royal bloodline (who hold titles of Grandmaster and such) sacrificed another human child, raped a 9 yr old boy and drank his blood, during their monthly ritual at midnight mass"

With such goings on the schools would be depleted of 4th grade boys six months into the school year. You would have thought that someone would have noticed a population imbalance by now.

Dream on ...

[thelonious]

Ohh. "Supreme Council", hmm? Like the sound of that, important like. Tell us about that. :)

"Supreme Council" is the administrative board of the Scottish Rite of Masonry. Each Scottish Rite jurisdiction has its own Supreme Council, which governs the Rite within its own territorial boundaries.

Albert Pike, the gentleman whose book is in question, was a member of the Scottish Rite Supreme Council of the Southern Jurisdiction of the USA. He was eventually elected Sovereign Grand Commander, which is the Supreme Council's presiding officer.

[thelonious]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_b3LMoQUJ0

You've got to change your evil ways, baby.

:)