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View Full Version : Jimmy Savile OUTED as a PAEDO OCT 3rd


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discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:12 AM
I'm concerned (but hardly surprised) this element seems to have been "forgotten" as well. The thing is, they don't even have to investigate do they? I mean, it appears they're not really interested in what he did to living victims, when dealing with dead ones they're on a sure-fire winner - don't even have to take statements. I can see the usual "Upon further investigation we found nothing to support claims..." type of statement at best.

Yes and where is the publics' interest in this facet? They're not all disinterested!
I think this is a good question to put on leaflets, why have statements made about Savile being a necrophiliac not been investigated further. Its the biggest sign of the cover up going, to the masses, I think.

trafficker
12-12-2012, 01:12 AM
You know what else is really still puzzling me?, the claims of Savile being a necrophiliac and working at the hospital mortuaries.

Arent the relatives of people that have died at that/those hospitals anxious to establish if their loved ones bodies were tampered with, especially young victims?? Or is it just a case of what you dont know doesnt hurt you?

It was, admittedly not nearly enough, but was still reported in the MSM, so why not the public uproar, at least from the relatives of deceased??

Have the police even bothered to investigate these claims?
Can we find out?

i reckon he was doing a lot more sinister stuff, like say a client of his has accidentally killed his supplied child prostitute, he needs that body rid of asap...no evidence ect...saviles your man....code white in white roller.

brontide
12-12-2012, 01:14 AM
Cheers :) - quick update:

Ian Paisley will protest Pope Benedict on child abuse despite his own history

Back in 1973 a full-time missionary in Paisley's church, Valerie Shaw, approached Paisley with horrific news. A senior administrator at the Kincora orphanage in Belfast and a close ally of Paisley named William McGrath was abusing boys at the home.

Paisley ignored Shaw and refused to investigate.

In January 1980 the Kincora scandal broke amid allegations, later proven of massive abuse of children at the home.

Paisley knew the ringleader McGrath very well and McGrath had accompanied him to many meetings.

He denied Shaw had told him about McGrath years earlier, but under pressure later admitted he had been told of her suspicions.

http://www.irishcentral.com/story/news/periscope/ian-paisley-will-protest-pope-benedict-on-child-abuse-despite-his-own-history-102826814.html

As you say, we need to understand the depth of the rabbit hole

Quick work.

Paisley lived just a few doors up from McGrath.

Paisley also performed the marriages of two of McGrath's children.

The BBC made a news report about all of this.

It was never broadcast.

The Savile similarities run deep.

discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:15 AM
http://www.intmensorg.info/images/mason1.jpg

Yes, definitely. But surely they dont think the public will just forget about it? For years to come people will remember the necrophiliac claims and how the police did nothing about it. Not very good pr is it?!

claydog
12-12-2012, 01:17 AM
http://www.intmensorg.info/images/mason1.jpg



Special brand and every other branch covered ;)

bubbleinthemachine
12-12-2012, 01:19 AM
You know what else is really still puzzling me?, the claims of Savile being a necrophiliac and working at the hospital mortuaries.

Arent the relatives of people that have died at that/those hospitals anxious to establish if their loved ones bodies were tampered with, especially young victims?? Or is it just a case of what you dont know doesnt hurt you?

It was, admittedly not nearly enough, but was still reported in the MSM, so why not the public uproar, at least from the relatives of deceased??

Have the police even bothered to investigate these claims?
Can we find out?

Yes, I don't "get that" either. I'd be going nuts! Where are these families?

discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:19 AM
i reckon he was doing a lot more sinister stuff, like say a client of his has accidentally killed his supplied child prostitute, he needs that body rid of asap...no evidence ect...saviles your man....code white in white roller.

Jesus yeah thats a possibility. We have to think of the depths of depravity this freak would go to, hes still surprising me.

trafficker
12-12-2012, 01:19 AM
http://www.hebdenbridgetimes.co.uk/webimage/1.5073721.1351684254!image/3191897410.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_595/3191897410.jpg

JUST over a year since his death, a village has been left shocked by sexual abuse revelations regarding shamed former television presenter Jimmy Savile.

Police have identified over 200 potential victims of the deceased former BBC presenter, who often visited Cragg Vale.

Calder Valley residents have been left horrified by the news and said they believed Savile, who raised thousands of pounds for good causes in Cragg Vale and had strong links with St John’s In The Wilderness Church, was a “nice man”.

Lynn Trewartha, from Mytholmroyd, said: “I and my friends used to do the 10-mile charity walk with him every year and he was brilliant. He would just run along in his little outfit. I’ve probably got 20 autographs off him. I never saw anything inappropriate – I only saw the good side of him. He certainly never touched me. I just feel so sorry for his victims.”

Elva Wood, who runs The Robin Hood in Cragg Vale, said: “I met him once after he had just done a fundraising walk with everybody. He was very charming.

“A lot of people did the walks but we didn’t hear a thing about anyone being abused. “He raised a lot of money for the area and saved St John’s. I know absolutely nothing about the abuse allegations and it’s never been mentioned in the community – not until last month. I don’t know anybody in the community that has claimed to be abused.”

Savile often used to visit St John’s Church, for which he raised thousands of pounds, and was an honorary church warden. He was a popular figure in the Calder Valley right up until his death. In the 1970s he had a caravan parked outside the Hinchliffe Arms Cragg Vale.

http://www.hebdenbridgetimes.co.uk/news/local/savile-shock-for-the-upper-calder-valley-1-5064442

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 01:20 AM
Interesting!

Do we know if Savile was a history buff?


The bastard lived through most of history! He's the only person who watched Highlander and thought it was a documentary. :)

ceej
12-12-2012, 01:20 AM
IMHO....


We need to be discussing what the new system should be like and what's the best way to peacefully, legally and democratically usher it in.



We absolutely do need to be discussing a better system. Like you illuminuts, I'm 100% for peaceful, legal and a more accessible democracy.

Parliamentary Representation is a sine qua non but it needs far more checks and balances. MPs and Ministers are simply not accountable enough to their constituents.

We're in this mess because ours is only a nominally a democratic system, not as deeply democratic as, say, the US.

Over the last 15yrs or so there have been many working behind the scenes legally, peacefully, accountably, openly to develop more effective and engaging democratic processes. There was even quite a lot of ostensible support from NuLab in the early years. When push came to shove they rather turned out to be even more reluctant to take new thinking on board than any party. They were carried away with power and didn't want to let go having tasted it.

Yet the country is in the state it's in precisely because political power is not shared much beyond Westminster and politics has become far too much a career rather than the calling to serve that it should be. (wait for some cynical MP to pick that up and start gobbing it out...)

One vote every 5yrs is not democracy. As many others have said, it's an elected dictatorship. That's a dangerous situation for politicians to endorse.


...You think 19 out of 20 coppers are bent? No way. Maybe 1 out of 3 to some extent and they are certainly more likely to be bent the higher they rise.


Interesting discussion (socially) with a doctor very close to police not so long ago.

His opinion was/is that mostly the more senior = the more shockingly sociopathic. So, yes, more bent in the sense of less able to understand the problems of the people they're supposed to serve and less able to care about us or their junior officers. (The anecdotes he told about the sadistic bullying /abuse that goes on from top down were sickening. What chance do we or little children have....<sigh?>).

Caveat of course, there are a good number of well intentioned officers with their hearts in the right place - but mostly they're too scared of their bosses to do what they should be doing.

brontide
12-12-2012, 01:22 AM
Yes, definitely. But surely they dont think the public will just forget about it? For years to come people will remember the necrophiliac claims and how the police did nothing about it. Not very good pr is it?!

That is precisely what they do think.

An erosion in expectations of the police is a large part of the agenda.

discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:22 AM
This is from Inside Out southwest last night. It covers the Haut de la Garenne scandal and jimmy savile. Alot of what's covered is already known, but i highly recommend you watch the guy at about 12.40. Shocking.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvtysl_inside-out-10-12-12_news#.UMekA65n1EM

Sorry i can't seem to embed it

More of that thing there called truth, please!!

Can anyone embed that?

welshwitch
12-12-2012, 01:23 AM
JUST over a year since his death, a village has been left shocked by sexual abuse revelations regarding shamed former television presenter Jimmy Savile.

Savile often used to visit St John’s Church, for which he raised thousands of pounds, and was an honorary church warden. He was a popular figure in the Calder Valley right up until his death. In the 1970s he had a caravan parked outside the Hinchliffe Arms Cragg Vale.

http://www.hebdenbridgetimes.co.uk/news/local/savile-shock-for-the-upper-calder-valley-1-5064442

There are none so blind as will not see..........................

marlowe
12-12-2012, 01:24 AM
i reckon he was doing a lot more sinister stuff, like say a client of his has accidentally killed his supplied child prostitute, he needs that body rid of asap...no evidence ect...saviles your man....code white in white roller.


Yes, i think savile had access to the hospital waste disposal area and could have got rid of any bodies or body parts. With the necrophilia, they really ought to be talking to all surviving morgue attendants at the hospitals where he was, erm, active. There are rumours of Savile paying morgue workers for time alone with the corpses. Maybe they were masons who let him in? I wonder if Savile 'worked' alone (assuming the rumours are true), or if he had friends in for a 'corpse orgy' (oh dear)? :eek:

anders7777
12-12-2012, 01:26 AM
The bastard lived through most of history! He's the only person who watched Highlander and thought it was a documentary. :)

Lol:D

tameelf
12-12-2012, 01:27 AM
brontide

can you put that picture in a link please so i can tweet it

marlowe
12-12-2012, 01:28 AM
http://www.hebdenbridgetimes.co.uk/webimage/1.5073721.1351684254!image/3191897410.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_595/3191897410.jpg




Is that a masonic thing he's doing with his fingers there, or am I mistaken?

anders7777
12-12-2012, 01:30 AM
GThat is precisely what they do think.

An erosion in expectations of the police is a large part of the agenda.

yes

Hence all the black uniforms now

No more Dixon of dock green

Now a space docking blackshirt on wraparound steroids

HideInitial assessments

On 4 October 2012, the Metropolitan Police said it would take the national lead in a process of assessing the allegations.[3][4] The assessment was undertaken by the Serious Case Team of the service's Child Abuse Investigation Command, led by Detective Superintendent David Gray working closely with the BBC. The police said, "Our priority will be to ensure a proportionate and consistent policing response putting the victims at the heart of our enquiries", and that "it is not an investigation at this stage".[3]

The Metropolitan Police announced on 9 October that the inquiry into the allegations would be called Operation Yewtree, and would be undertaken jointly with the NSPCC. The police had formally recorded eight allegations against Savile, but announced they were following 120 lines of inquiry, covering up to 25 victims of abuse, mainly girls aged between 13 and 16. The allegations covered four decades, from 1959 until the 1980s, and were on "a national scale". Commander Peter Spindler, head of specialist crime investigations,[5] said, "At this stage it is quite clear from what women are telling us that Savile was a predatory sex offender."[6] Operation Yewtree aimed to report by the end of November.[7]

"Yewtree" was chosen from a list of names which are intended to be neutral and unrelated to the particular case.[8]

Close this section
HideCriminal investigation

The Metropolitan Police launched a criminal investigation on 19 October 2012 as, in addition to the historic allegations of child sex abuse by Savile, there were "lines of inquiry involving living people that require formal investigation".[9] The police were pursuing over 400 separate lines of inquiry based on evidence of 200 witnesses via 14 police forces across the UK. The criminal investigations within Operation Yewtree were led by Detective Chief Superintendent Keith Niven, head of the Metropolitan Police's child abuse investigation command.[10]

Commander Peter Spindler said: "The public's response to this issue has been astounding. We are dealing with alleged abuse on an unprecedented scale. The profile of this operation has empowered a staggering number of victims to come forward to report the sexual exploitation which occurred during their childhood."[11][12] He said that: "We are dealing with a major criminal investigation. This is a watershed moment for child abuse investigations and Yewtree will be a landmark investigation."[10]

On 25 October the police reported that the number of possible victims was 300,[13] and on 15 November reported the number had reached 450.[14] Investigations took place into allegations that living people had undertaken abuse with Savile and other claims that had come forward of abuse not involving Savile. It was reported that about 60 of the claims related to allegations of abuse by people other than Savile.[10]

discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:30 AM
That is precisely what they do think.

An erosion in expectations of the police is a large part of the agenda.

Oh jeez, this sounds like I'm gonna have to start expanding my little old mind again! Aarggghhhh!

You mean watering down of justice, truth, will to endeavour to combat it? Bigger control over society? Lawlessness amongst the masses?

But then again hopeless societies can get angry and change dynamics and thats when revolutions start happening. Maybe thats what this country perversely needs, been too dissasociated from politics for too long.

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 01:30 AM
Wasn't Paul Gambaccini quite vocal about the necro stuff? IIRC he mentioned something about being told by a journo back in the 80's that he was aware of allegations of necrophilia. Speaking to that journo might be useful.

trafficker
12-12-2012, 01:31 AM
http://i.huffpost.com/gen/708665/thumbs/r-SIR-JIMMY-SAVILE-large570.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ky1vx696AW1qzi2nqo1_500.jpg

Late 1800s Poison Ring (sold)

I’ve never found one of these before. Usually what people call poison rings are mourning rings, with a compartment for holding a lock of hair. But this one seems truly sinister. The compartment is concealed behind the face of the ring, and pops open by depressing one side of the door. Add the religious imagery on the face, and the whole thing feels downright occult.

http://fuckyeahvictorians.tumblr.com/post/607676949/mudwerks-eriebasin-late-1800s-poison-ring

anders7777
12-12-2012, 01:33 AM
G

yes

Hence all the black uniforms now

No more Dixon of dock green

Now a space docking blackshirt on wraparound steroids

HideInitial assessments

On 4 October 2012, the Metropolitan Police said it would take the national lead in a process of assessing the allegations.[3][4] The assessment was undertaken by the Serious Case Team of the service's Child Abuse Investigation Command, led by Detective Superintendent David Gray working closely with the BBC. The police said, "Our priority will be to ensure a proportionate and consistent policing response putting the victims at the heart of our enquiries", and that "it is not an investigation at this stage".[3]

The Metropolitan Police announced on 9 October that the inquiry into the allegations would be called Operation Yewtree, and would be undertaken jointly with the NSPCC. The police had formally recorded eight allegations against Savile, but announced they were following 120 lines of inquiry, covering up to 25 victims of abuse, mainly girls aged between 13 and 16. The allegations covered four decades, from 1959 until the 1980s, and were on "a national scale". Commander Peter Spindler, head of specialist crime investigations,[5] said, "At this stage it is quite clear from what women are telling us that Savile was a predatory sex offender."[6] Operation Yewtree aimed to report by the end of November.[7]

"Yewtree" was chosen from a list of names which are intended to be neutral and unrelated to the particular case.[8]

Close this section
HideCriminal investigation

The Metropolitan Police launched a criminal investigation on 19 October 2012 as, in addition to the historic allegations of child sex abuse by Savile, there were "lines of inquiry involving living people that require formal investigation".[9] The police were pursuing over 400 separate lines of inquiry based on evidence of 200 witnesses via 14 police forces across the UK. The criminal investigations within Operation Yewtree were led by Detective Chief Superintendent Keith Niven, head of the Metropolitan Police's child abuse investigation command.[10]

Commander Peter Spindler said: "The public's response to this issue has been astounding. We are dealing with alleged abuse on an unprecedented scale. The profile of this operation has empowered a staggering number of victims to come forward to report the sexual exploitation which occurred during their childhood."[11][12] He said that: "We are dealing with a major criminal investigation. This is a watershed moment for child abuse investigations and Yewtree will be a landmark investigation."[10]

On 25 October the police reported that the number of possible victims was 300,[13] and on 15 November reported the number had reached 450.[14] Investigations took place into allegations that living people had undertaken abuse with Savile and other claims that had come forward of abuse not involving Savile. It was reported that about 60 of the claims related to allegations of abuse by people other than Savile.[10]


2011 guardian

Freemasons in the police leading the attack on David Cameron's riot response
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By Jason Lewis, Investigations Editor9:00PM BST 20 Aug 2011
Leading police officers have set up a national Masonic lodge where they can meet in secret in defiance of fears about the influence of the secret society on the criminal justice system.

The founding members include senior officials from the Police Federation, the police staff association, which is currently fighting the Government over its plans to cut budgets.

The new Masonic lodge is led by John Tully, a Metropolitan Police officer, who has given numerous interviews in recent days accusing the Prime Minister of "fighting violence, arson and looting on our city streets with sound-bites".

Other founder members include officers from the Metropolitan Police, Essex Police, Thames Valley Police and from other forces including Northumbria, Dyfed Powys, South Wales, South Yorkshire and even a high ranking officer from the Royal Gibraltar Police.

The "Sine Favore" Lodge was opened despite the conclusions of a Parliamentary inquiry which warned of public fears that "Freemasonry can have an unhealthy influence on the criminal justice system".

The inquiry followed questions about masonic involvement in the abandonment of an investigation into a shoot-to-kill policy in Northern Ireland and with the West Midlands Serious Crime Squad, which was disbanded after evidence of police malpractice.

Membership is open to all serving and retired officers across Britain and others working alongside the police, including lawyers, criminologists and even the financial advisers who manage officers' retirement plans.

The idea for the new police Masonic lodge grew out of a series unofficial get-togethers in hotel bars during Police Federation annual conferences.

Masonic rules require members to do all they can to support each other, to look after each other and to keep each others' lawful secrets.

New members of the so-called Brotherhood are blindfolded, a hangman's noose placed around their necks and they are warned their throat will be slit and their tongue torn out if they break their oath. Critics argue this could put them at odds with discharging their duty to serve the public.

The inquiry by the Home Affairs Select Committee in 1998 called for a public register of police officers who joined the Freemasons, although in the end the then Labour government proposed that officers could make voluntary disclosures about their membership. Few did.

The new "Sine Favore" lodge, is named after the Latin motto of the Police Federation, "Without Fear, Without Favour".

The founders include Police Federation Treasurer Martyn Mordecai, John Giblin, chairman of the Federation's Sergeants Central Committee, and Steve Williams, general secretary of the Federation's Inspectors Central Committee.

Earlier this year Mr Giblin told the Federation's annual conference that government ministers "hate the police service" and wanted to "destroy" it.

Other founding members include solicitor Tristan Hallam, a personal injury lawyer who specialises, according to his firm Russell Jones and Walker, in "road traffic accidents and public liability cases for both private clients and associations including the Police Federation".

Mr Hallam said: "Membership of any organisation is a personal choice. Russell Jones & Walker are aware of my membership."

Stewart Imbimbo, an ex-Thames Valley police officer and now a senior official at Milton Keynes council, Robert Taylor, a financial adviser, Eric Misselke, director of a police credit union which provides cheap loans, savings accounts and insurance, and the Metropolitan Police's resident criminologist Dr Attilio Grandani.

Dr Grandani sits on the Metropolitan Police Authority's equality and diversity sub-committee and is behind the Met's new controversial statistical-led policing model, which aims to combat areas of high crime as opposed to more thinly spread bobbies-on-the-beat territorial policing.

Lodge number 9856 was officially opened by a senior Masonic official, Russell Race. He is the Metropolitan Grand Master, head of the Grand Lodge of London, a corporate financier and chairman of a construction firm behind the huge Westfield shopping centre in west London and The Pinnacle office development, which, when complete, will be the tallest building in the City of London.

The lodge is based at 10 Duke Street in central London, which is also the headquarters of the Supreme Council of the 33rd Degree, one of the most important and mysterious bodies in international Masonic circles, which has an elite membership of only 75 people.

The building, known as Grand East by Masons, contains the "Black Room", the "Red Room" and a "Chamber of Death", used for Masonic rituals.

The Police Federation last night refused to discuss whether any of its officials had disclosed their involvement with Freemasonary.

A spokesman said: "Being a member of any organisation is a matter for the individual, so long as membership of that organisation does not compromise their duties and responsibilities as a police officer."

Lodge Secretary Mr Tully, vice chairman of the Metropolitan Police Federation refused to comment.

ceej
12-12-2012, 01:36 AM
http://www.hebdenbridgetimes.co.uk/webimage/1.5073721.1351684254!image/3191897410.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_595/3191897410.jpg

JUST over a year since his death, a village has been left shocked by sexual abuse revelations regarding shamed former television presenter Jimmy Savile.

Police have identified over 200 potential victims of the deceased former BBC presenter, who often visited Cragg Vale.

Calder Valley residents have been left horrified by the news and said they believed Savile, who raised thousands of pounds for good causes in Cragg Vale and had strong links with St John’s In The Wilderness Church, was a “nice man”.

Lynn Trewartha, from Mytholmroyd, said: “I and my friends used to do the 10-mile charity walk with him every year and he was brilliant. He would just run along in his little outfit. I’ve probably got 20 autographs off him. I never saw anything inappropriate – I only saw the good side of him. He certainly never touched me. I just feel so sorry for his victims.”

Elva Wood, who runs The Robin Hood in Cragg Vale, said: “I met him once after he had just done a fundraising walk with everybody. He was very charming.

“A lot of people did the walks but we didn’t hear a thing about anyone being abused. “He raised a lot of money for the area and saved St John’s. I know absolutely nothing about the abuse allegations and it’s never been mentioned in the community – not until last month. I don’t know anybody in the community that has claimed to be abused.”

Savile often used to visit St John’s Church, for which he raised thousands of pounds, and was an honorary church warden. He was a popular figure in the Calder Valley right up until his death. In the 1970s he had a caravan parked outside the Hinchliffe Arms Cragg Vale.

http://www.hebdenbridgetimes.co.uk/news/local/savile-shock-for-the-upper-calder-valley-1-5064442

This is exactly how pervs get away with it...

'oh he never did anything to me'
'can't believe it'
'what a lovely charming man'

When are people going to wake up to the fact that psychopaths are Oscar class actors, on purpose.

trafficker
12-12-2012, 01:38 AM
Jesus yeah thats a possibility. We have to think of the depths of depravity this freak would go to, hes still surprising me.

Pulp Fiction - The Wolf - YouTube

discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:39 AM
2011 guardian

Freemasons in the police leading the attack on David Cameron's riot response
Twitter
290
Facebook
2K

Share
2K
By Jason Lewis, Investigations Editor9:00PM BST 20 Aug 2011
Leading police officers have set up a national Masonic lodge where they can meet in secret in defiance of fears about the influence of the secret society on the criminal justice system.

The founding members include senior officials from the Police Federation, the police staff association, which is currently fighting the Government over its plans to cut budgets.

The new Masonic lodge is led by John Tully, a Metropolitan Police officer, who has given numerous interviews in recent days accusing the Prime Minister of "fighting violence, arson and looting on our city streets with sound-bites".

Other founder members include officers from the Metropolitan Police, Essex Police, Thames Valley Police and from other forces including Northumbria, Dyfed Powys, South Wales, South Yorkshire and even a high ranking officer from the Royal Gibraltar Police.

The "Sine Favore" Lodge was opened despite the conclusions of a Parliamentary inquiry which warned of public fears that "Freemasonry can have an unhealthy influence on the criminal justice system".

The inquiry followed questions about masonic involvement in the abandonment of an investigation into a shoot-to-kill policy in Northern Ireland and with the West Midlands Serious Crime Squad, which was disbanded after evidence of police malpractice.

Membership is open to all serving and retired officers across Britain and others working alongside the police, including lawyers, criminologists and even the financial advisers who manage officers' retirement plans.

The idea for the new police Masonic lodge grew out of a series unofficial get-togethers in hotel bars during Police Federation annual conferences.

Masonic rules require members to do all they can to support each other, to look after each other and to keep each others' lawful secrets.

New members of the so-called Brotherhood are blindfolded, a hangman's noose placed around their necks and they are warned their throat will be slit and their tongue torn out if they break their oath. Critics argue this could put them at odds with discharging their duty to serve the public.

The inquiry by the Home Affairs Select Committee in 1998 called for a public register of police officers who joined the Freemasons, although in the end the then Labour government proposed that officers could make voluntary disclosures about their membership. Few did.

The new "Sine Favore" lodge, is named after the Latin motto of the Police Federation, "Without Fear, Without Favour".

The founders include Police Federation Treasurer Martyn Mordecai, John Giblin, chairman of the Federation's Sergeants Central Committee, and Steve Williams, general secretary of the Federation's Inspectors Central Committee.

Earlier this year Mr Giblin told the Federation's annual conference that government ministers "hate the police service" and wanted to "destroy" it.

Other founding members include solicitor Tristan Hallam, a personal injury lawyer who specialises, according to his firm Russell Jones and Walker, in "road traffic accidents and public liability cases for both private clients and associations including the Police Federation".

Mr Hallam said: "Membership of any organisation is a personal choice. Russell Jones & Walker are aware of my membership."

Stewart Imbimbo, an ex-Thames Valley police officer and now a senior official at Milton Keynes council, Robert Taylor, a financial adviser, Eric Misselke, director of a police credit union which provides cheap loans, savings accounts and insurance, and the Metropolitan Police's resident criminologist Dr Attilio Grandani.

Dr Grandani sits on the Metropolitan Police Authority's equality and diversity sub-committee and is behind the Met's new controversial statistical-led policing model, which aims to combat areas of high crime as opposed to more thinly spread bobbies-on-the-beat territorial policing.

Lodge number 9856 was officially opened by a senior Masonic official, Russell Race. He is the Metropolitan Grand Master, head of the Grand Lodge of London, a corporate financier and chairman of a construction firm behind the huge Westfield shopping centre in west London and The Pinnacle office development, which, when complete, will be the tallest building in the City of London.

The lodge is based at 10 Duke Street in central London, which is also the headquarters of the Supreme Council of the 33rd Degree, one of the most important and mysterious bodies in international Masonic circles, which has an elite membership of only 75 people.

The building, known as Grand East by Masons, contains the "Black Room", the "Red Room" and a "Chamber of Death", used for Masonic rituals.

The Police Federation last night refused to discuss whether any of its officials had disclosed their involvement with Freemasonary.

A spokesman said: "Being a member of any organisation is a matter for the individual, so long as membership of that organisation does not compromise their duties and responsibilities as a police officer."

Lodge Secretary Mr Tully, vice chairman of the Metropolitan Police Federation refused to comment.

Thats truly terrifying. I see, of course its for the masons. Doh me!

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 01:41 AM
You know what else is really still puzzling me?, the claims of Savile being a necrophiliac and working at the hospital mortuaries.

Arent the relatives of people that have died at that/those hospitals anxious to establish if their loved ones bodies were tampered with, especially young victims?? Or is it just a case of what you dont know doesnt hurt you?

It was, admittedly not nearly enough, but was still reported in the MSM, so why not the public uproar, at least from the relatives of deceased??

Have the police even bothered to investigate these claims?
Can we find out?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/1136723.stm

The good people of Leeds appear to be indifferent to the possibility that Savile may have been involved in the procurement of body parts.

On a side issue but related a warning to anyone entering Wales. They are about to push through legislation that will require a person to opt out of giving permission to donate organs. If you are not on their system your body is theirs for the choosing!( And your family will get the bill for the clean up operation following a fatal crash1)

trafficker
12-12-2012, 01:41 AM
Yes, i think savile had access to the hospital waste disposal area and could have got rid of any bodies or body parts. With the necrophilia, they really ought to be talking to all surviving morgue attendants at the hospitals where he was, erm, active. There are rumours of Savile paying morgue workers for time alone with the corpses. Maybe they were masons who let him in? I wonder if Savile 'worked' alone (assuming the rumours are true), or if he had friends in for a 'corpse orgy' (oh dear)? :eek:

Kill Bill Vol. 1 - My Name Is Buck, And I&#39;m Here To Fuck - YouTube

discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:41 AM
Wasn't Paul Gambaccini quite vocal about the necro stuff? IIRC he mentioned something about being told by a journo back in the 80's that he was aware of allegations of necrophilia. Speaking to that journo might be useful.

Yes, hes the one that came out and said it, very high profile, very public. But now? Not a sausage. (bad phraseology). Who was the journo can you remember?

welshwitch
12-12-2012, 01:44 AM
Thats truly terrifying. I see, of course its for the masons. Doh me!

There are fewer masons than there are non masons. Real human beings have their own society - it doesn't need to hide behind ritual/superstition and satanism. We outnumber them. Let's never forget that. :p

blue eagke
12-12-2012, 01:45 AM
Ha ha! What with all those discos going on? I think the Met Police Helmet with "To Jimmy Saville from Marylebone Police Station" is another cracking piece. I wonder what he did for the boys at Marylbone nick that was deserving of such a touching gift? :rolleyes:

Good spot.

King Edward VII hospital – the royal choice
Duchess of Cambridge is latest in long line of royal inpatients at hospital in Marylebone, central London

The Guardian, Friday 7 December 2012 20.31 GMT
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/dec/07/king-edward-vii-hospital

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 01:45 AM
Yes, hes the one that came out and said it, very high profile, very public. But now? Not a sausage. (bad phraseology). Who was the journo can you remember?


Sadly no, was just going through articles as I can't remember if he actually named the journo. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he come out with it whilst on Nicky Campbell's radio show? NC got quite twitchy about it IIRC.

I'm still checking...

discovery77
12-12-2012, 01:49 AM
Sadly no, was just going through articles as I can't remember if he actually named the journo. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he come out with it whilst on Nicky Campbell's radio show? NC got quite twitchy about it IIRC.

I'm still checking...

It was certainly radio 5 live, dont remember if it was Campbell.
EDIT
The astonishing allegations were made on Radio 5 Live by Paul Gambaccini, who started working as a DJ on Radio 1 in 1973. He said he was made aware of the necrophilia claims in the Eighties.

Mr Gambaccini said: "The expression I came to associate with Savile's sexual partners was either one used by production assistants or one I made up to summarise their reports ...'under-age subnormals'. He targeted the institutionalised, the hospitalised – and this was known. Why did Jimmy go to hospitals? That's where the patients were."
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/paul-gambaccini-aware-of-accusations-linking-jimmy-savile-to-necrophilia-8223217.html
EDIT no. 2
It was Campbell, just remembered his pregnant pause when he heard it and said its not in the public domain, yet'.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 01:51 AM
There are fewer masons than there are non masons. Real human beings have their own society - it doesn't need to hide behind ritual/superstition and satanism. We outnumber them. Let's never forget that. :p

True

I'd like to know how many masons are working on all the whitewashes?

25pc

50 per cent!???




A Firm in a Firm: Freemasonry and Police Corruption

By, Martin Short

Is a Brother off the track?
Try the Square;
Try it well on every side.
Nothing draws a craftsman back
Like the Square when well applied.
Try the Square.

Is he crooked, is he frail?
Try the Square;
Try it early, try it late;
When all other efforts fail,
Try the Square to make him straight -
Try the Square.(1)

Since the Metropolitan Police was founded in 1829 there have been two complete reorganizations of its detective department. Both were provoked by massive corruption scandals leading to criminal trials exactly one hundred years apart, in 1877 and 1977. In each scandal Freemasonry played a dominant role.

Scotland Yard's first 'Detective Force' was set up in 1842. It consisted of only two inspectors and six sergeants. By 1869, 180 detectives were dealing with minor crime in outlying divisions but serious investigations in London were left to only twenty-seven officers out of 9,000. In the 1870's most of this squad was itself a criminal conspiracy in which not only were the prime culprits Freemasons; Freemasonry was what brought them together.(2)

In 1872 a confience trickster names William Kurr was running a bogus betting operation. Like any shrewd smalltime criminal with big ideas, he saw that the way to make real money was to bring policemen into the racket. Bribing detectives after you get caught is costly and uncertain. Far better to cut them in on the profits beforehand and avoid arrest altogether. The one safe place where Kurr could proposition policemen was his Masonic lodge.

At a lodge meeting in Islington Kurr made friends with just the man: Inspector John Meikeljohn. In return for 100 Pounds - nearly half his annual pay - Meiklejohn agreed to give Kurr advance warning of any police action against him or his betting racket. At first the corrupt officer kept the payoff to himself but as the racket expanded, he involved three chief inspectors in the Detective Force whom he also knew as brother Masons.

Kurr needed bigger and better protection because he was expanding his operation with the skills of a new friend called Harry Benson. Here was a virtoso con-man of international disrepute. In 1872, posing as a French count, he had deluded the Lord Mayor of London into giving him 1,000 Pounds for relief work in the wake of the Franco-Prussian War. He was found out and imprisoned in Newgate where he tried to burn himself to death. Instead he merely crippled himself but in 1873 he hobbled out of jail and came to know Kurr. Together they planned new scams to part mug punters from their funds.

One by one, Inspector Meiklejohn sucked his Masonic colleagues into Kurr and Benson's network. First he found out that Chief Inspector Nathaniel Druscovitch was inquiring into the swindles. He also discovered Druscovitch was 60 Pounds in debt and suggested Kurr might help him out. The deal was done, Kurr gave him the money and Druscovitch ws neutralized. His senior chief inspector, George Clarke, wsa also on the swindlers trail, but he agreed to lose the scent in return for a pay-off. A third chief inspector, William Palmer, was also bought up.

Now assured of total immunity from police zeal, Benson set up Sport, a news-sheet offering punters foolproof betting systems. In 1876, using the alias Hugh Montgomery, he deluded the Comtesse de Goncourt of Paris into 'investing' 10,000 Pounds. He rewarded here with several non-existant winners and then requested she invest a further 30,000 Pounds with a bookmaker of his choice. At this point she had a belated spasm of suspicion. She hired a London lawyer, who reported Benson and Kurr to Scotland Yard. They were soon jailed for fifteen and ten years' hard labour respectively. Only then did they reveal the role of the bent coppers. In the subsequent investigation the Yard's chief of detectives, Supt. Frederick Williamson, was dismayed to discover that three of his four chief inspectors were corrupt, along with their uninformed seducer, Meiklejohn. In 1877 all four were tried at the Old Bailey. Clarke was acquittted, but Meiklejohn, Palmer and Druscovitch were convicted and sentenced to two years' hard labour. It was a bad day for the police and hardly a distinguished one for Freemasonry with its principals of brotherly love, relief and truth.

This scandal discredited the entire Metropolitan Detective Force which was scrapped and re-formed as the Criminal Investigation Department. The CID was to have a seperate career structure and higher rates of pay than the main uniform force, a distinction which was to cause grinding irritation over the next hundred years. By 1884 the new structure of twenty-four detectives at Scotland Yard and 254 in the divisions, all under the central command of a new Assistant Commissioner (Crime), appeared to be an effective answer to corruption, Masonic or otherwise.

It took a hundred years for that illusion to be pricked, although close observers of the CID had known the truth for decades. A hint of what went wrong in the meantime comes in the story of Chief Inspector Reginald Morrish, a Metropolitan officer from 1911 to 1937. Morrish worked in the CID for sixteen years, winning forty-four commendations and eighteen awards. He also served in Scotland Yard's fraud and homicide squads. From 1943 to 197 he was a senior instructor at Hendon Police College and wrote several textbooks. One book he did not write was an autobiography. Not long before he died, aged ninety-two, he burnt his entire police papers. His son Ivor was horrified. He wrote:

During the whole of my early life at home, including a period in which we lived at a very busy police station in south London, my father's chief topics of conversation were the police, religion, bribery and corruption (which he saw as rife in all levels in the police force) and freemasonry. The one thing which seemed to worry him most of all was the connexion which he felt existed between freemasonry and corruption, and between freemasonry and self-advancement in the force. In his view there was no room for doubt about these connexions. He used to list all the officers who were masons. He noted the dates of their promotions, whether they had jumped anyone else of equal or greater ability, and all their connexions with other officers in the force.
On many occasions he was invited to join the masons (his two brothers were members) and he used to tell numerous stories of how both police officers and criminals sought favours of him in his pursuance of the detection of crimes. They seemed to assume that - like most other 'successful' officers in the Met - he was a mason of some standing. He received masonic handshakes by the score when investigating crimes, and he was offered bribes in the form of money, goods and even the services of women, in order that he might overlook vital pieces of evidence. Of course, not all those attempting bribery were masons but, according to my father, many were.

The most common expressions used by my father in relation to work were 'he is on the take', 'he is taking backhanders', 'he is receiving the drop' and 'he is on the square' with being amenable to bribes, corruption and perjury, so often did he use these phases in juxtaposition. Later on in life, when we discussed the position of freemasonry in the force and its connexion with corruption and self-advancement at the expense of others, it became clear that he regarded freemasonry as an evil per se which was to be held responsible for the larger proportion of corruption in the police force.

In 1933 or 1934 Det. Insp. Morrish had to run the Croydon Division while the divisional inspector was off sick. Looking through various registers and record books he became very suspicious of the way crimes were being recorded, so he carried out his own investigation. He concluded that the division's relatively high success rate for crime clearance was thoroughly bogus, because many crimes were being entered up as something else. A woman would have her handbag snatched, but this would be entered in the register as a case of 'Lost Property'.(3) Many other entries were far more ingenious.
After a thorough examination of every bit of routine and every crime over a period of several months, my father wrote a report on his findings and sent copies to his bosses: the divisional detective inspector and the area superintendent. As my father did not spare personalities, the facts he revealed militated strongly against both men's honesty. According to him, both were freemasons.
They met him together in private, sought at first to mollify him and then began to threaten and pressure him. He was told in no uncertain terms that, if he went on investigating the investigators, it could only lead to his own downfall. But he was adamant, and felt he had a duty to society, as well as his own integrity, to pursue the matter. He obviously had rattled his superiors who clearly warned him they would block all possible promotion for him.

I'm afraid they didn't understand what motivated him. Nothing and no one could ever browbeat him. He forthwith typed out an even fuller report which detailed all the criminal statistics he had investigated, and concluded with an account of his dealings with his superiors including their interview with him and the threats they had made. This 100 page report (which unfortunately he later burnt) he addressed to the Metropolitan Commissioner, Lord Trenchard.

Trenchard was soon paying personal visits to each station in the division, and insisted on seeing the records and documents referred to in Morrish's report. Eventually Trenchard called him up to his office but, moments before he was due to enter, Deputy Commissioner Norman Kendal tried to divert him. He suggested he need not see the Commissioner, as everything could be put right at this late stage - even his promotion - if he would only withdraw his report
Behind this soft approach my father detected a threat that, if he didn't withdraw, he could say goodbye to any future advancement. He politely refused and insisted on seeing the Commissioner. Later, as a result of the interview and the report, changes were introduced - in the Croydon Division at least - in the methods of recording and clearing up crime, and the way statistics on crime clearance were prepared.
Very soon afterwards the two superior officers retired. My father was transferred to the training centre at Scotland Yard and began his lecturing career. About six months later, when Lord Trenchard established Hendon Police College, he told my father he was promoting him to chief inspector and making him a senior instructor. When he later met my father at the college, he insisted it was he and no one else who had promoted him. The message, if oblique, seemed quuite clear to my father. I don't know whether Trenchard, or for that matter Kendal, was a mason or not, but my father always regarded the whole business as an indication that even the Brotherhood could be outwitted on occassions.

As evidence against Freemasonry, this account is difficult to assess. Sceptics would stress that the alleged incidents took place more than fifty years ago, might have been much exaggerated in the original telling and are recollected here by a son who might be spicing up his father's account. No documents have survived and we have no proof the 'villans' were Masons. A lawyer would dismiss it all as 'triple hearsay'. However, Ivor Morrish is a respected author of numerous teaching textbooks and a lifelong educationalist. He is unlikely to have invented so much detail. His father was a man of unquestioned integrity, and outstanding instructor, and deeply trusted by Lord Trenchard who was this century's greatest police reformer. As such, Reg Morrish's perceptions of Freemasonry should not be lightly discarded. What is more, they marry only too convincingly with the incontrovertible evidence revealed when scores of corrupt detectives were investigated in the 1970's. The full story of Metropolitan Police corruption at the time is told in The Fall of Scotland Yard, a book which I co-authored in 1977 with Barry Cox and John Shirley.(4) Here I isolate the Masonic aspects of the scandal.
In 1977 three Old Bailey trials revealed the tip of an iceberg of corruption in London's CID. Thirteen detectives were jailed, including two commanders, one chief superintendent and five inspectors. In the course of the investigation it emerged that most were Freemasons. The probablility is that they were all 'on the square'.

One trial focused on the Flying Squad, once legendary for its detective brilliance but now notorious for having a commander, Ken Drury, who was 'on the take' (cash, gifts, entertainments and holidays) from a professional criminal and pornographer, Jimmy Humphreys. The other trials revolved around the Obscene Publications Squad. It emerged that Craft membership was a prerequisite for any detective who wanted a share of the rich pickings to be extorted from London's profiteering pornographers.

The 'Porn Squad' was at that time a unit within the CID's central office, known as C1. Getting into this team was a prestigious step up for any detective, but selection was largely in the gift of the C1 commander or the superintendent heading the squad. From 1964 until 1972 it's eminence grise was Det. Chief Supt. Bill Moody who has a unique claim to infamy in the history of Scotland Yard. While heading one of the biggest-ever investigations into police corruption he was simultaneously collecting huge bribes from the dirty booksellers of Soho, London's notorious vice district.

Moody's extraordinary double life is revealed in The Fall of Scotland Yard. The essential details are that in 1977 he was convicted of conspiring to take money from pornographers over an eight-year period. Moody was convicted on sample charges, one of which involved a payment of 14,000 Pounds. The trial showed that for some years he had been pocketing annual kickbacks worth 40,000 Pounds. His pay-off at the Old Bailey was twelve years' imprisonment.

Bill Moody was an ardent Freemason, so ardent that he took some of his pornographer friends to his Masonic gatherings. One was Ron 'the Dustman' Davey whom he had met at another pornographer's birthday party in Trader Vic's Restaurant in the Hilton Hotel. In 1975 Davey was questioned by officers who had been appointed to investigate the porn squad's corruption. He told them he came to know Det. Sgt Cyril Jones (later sentenced to seven years in jail) through Moody's Masonic functions.

I have been to numerous of these and in fact Bill introducted me into his lodge. It has been put to me that I booked a coach on the following dates - 6.11.69 to Derry and Toms (10 people); 17.11.69 to Top Rank Suite, Croydon (12 people); 25.9.71 Regent Street. All were masonic functions at which I was a guest. Normally present were Bill Moody, Cyril Jones, 2 other police officers [whom Davey names] and our wives. I am quite sure there were many more outings.
It was part of Bill Moody's discredited defence that he had no idea Ron Davey was a pornographer. If so, he had overlooked Ron's conviction and a six-month jail term in 1960 for publishing 744 improper photographs of men and 105 of women. This fact was available to Moody not simply as head of the Obscene Publications Squad; he would have read about it in News of the World, for the newspaper had revealed how Davey was arrested in his darkroom with 2,486 dirty photographs. At another of his premises, police discovered 15,000 pornographic negatives and 15,000 snaps. Ron's home was an Aladdin's cave of naked lads. As the magistrate packed him off to prison, he told Davey he did not suppose anyone had ever before seen 'such a vast volume of absolute filth'.
Davey had been a pornographer for three years, after eight years working as a dustman. In 1975 when giving evidence against Bill Moody, he described himself as a 'maintenance engineer'. I have been unable to discover which of these three occupations he disclosed when applying for membership of the Craft.

Masonic activities in the dirty book trade went far beyond coach parties of pornographers, policemen and their wives living it up on the town. When Scotland Yard's anti-corruption squad went digging into the porn squad's later years, all sorts of Masonic connections emerged. One prosecution witness was Frank R. Andrews, who spent three years in the porn squad as a detective constable. When Moody recruited him in 1965, he already knew that everybody posted there immediately bought new cars or expensive houses. In short, he said, they 'sprouted wealth'.

Andrews was introduced to the system of another witness, D.C. Ernie Culver, himself later convicted of a cheque fraud. Culver explained how bribe moneys were shared out. Andrews recalled one chat with him about a forthcoming Masonic Ladies' Night.

He said words to the effect, 'Have you got enough money for the new dress for your wife?' I indicated that I didn't want any help but he then handed me a brown envelope aned said, 'Put that towards the cost of a new dress for your wife.' I did not want the money and decided to ditch it in a nearby waste-paper bin. We attended the ladies' evening as planned. Bill Moody was there with his wife and another sergeant.
Another convicted officer was Leslie Alton, a detective inspector and a Mason. He instructed Andrews to collect the weekly bribes in packets from pornographers, then share it out among the other officers. Andrews had known Alton was a friend for many years and tried to keep an eye on him when he got drunk.
On one occasion he got drunk and said, 'Come on, let's take a walk around the West End.' I was full of trepidation. He walked into a bookshop with me and said in a loud voice. 'I am detective inspector Alton of New Scotland Yard. How much have you taken today?' He then went to the cash register, opened it and started checking the proceeds. I was embarrassed and left him in the shop. When he came out he said words to the effect, 'Disipline. That's what these people need: discipline!'
Andrews assumed that, on past form, Alton must have stuck his hand in the till and grabbed a fistful of notes. They both left the squad in 1968 but from 1970 to 1972 its overlord was Commander Wally Virgo who, I understand, was also a Freemason. Originally jailed for twelve years for corruption, Virgo was later freed because the appeal court felt the judge's summing-up had been unduly hostile.
Under Virgo the porn squad was almost entirely Masonic. When one brother, Detective Inspector Anthony Kilkerr, became a prosecution witness his colleagues came up with a disarming explanation for the 20 Pounds in pornographers' pay-off money they had stuck in his desk drawer each week. Those crisp fivers were not the fruits of corruption, one suspect told an investigator, but whiprounds to help Kilkerr pay his Masonic inititation fees. This was a lie, of course, but the choice of lie was revealing.

Because Kilkerr would not take the money (he threw it away or left it in his desk), he was suspected of being a 'spy in the camp'. His 'Mr Clean' image so upset another detective named Peter Fisher that he told Kilkerr not to open his mouth because he was now 'involved' himself and would go down with the rest of them. If they were all caught, Fisher added, they 'could form a football team on the Isle of Wight'. This was a reference to the island's two high-security jails, but in the late 1970s convicted detectives were sent to open prisons in such large numbers that they could have formed their own Masonic lodges.

The porn and Flying Squad investigations were part of a massive anti-corruption drive by Sir Robert Mark. Soon after he became Commissioner in 1972 he set up a squad known as A 10 to 'rubber-heel' the entire force. By the time he retired five years later, A 10 had forced the dismissal or resignation of nearly 500 officers: 100 a year. The old regime had ousted an average of just sixteen. Most of the concentration of Freemasons was far greater than among uniform men. There is no way of finding out exactly how many were Masons, partly because Scotland Yard has never divulged the names of all 500.

To combat corruption Mark imposed the most thorough reform of the CID for a hundred years. In August 1975 he shuffled 300 detectives around London, in an attempt to break the dangerous custom of leaving them in one area for so many years that tended to develop a corrupt intimacy with local criminals. In 1976 he inflicted an even less welcome reform: systematic interchange between detective and uniform branches. No detective could expect much promotion unless he served in uniform for several years. This was devised not gratuitously to humilate the plain-clothes men, but to destroy the closed mentality and corrupt traditons of the 'firm in a firm'.

To what extent was this 'firm in a firm' Masonic? That phrase was immortalized by Detective Sergeant John Symonds on a surreptitious tape-recording made by two Times reporters in 1969. The tape appeared to support claims of a small-time thief that Symonds was extorting small sums of money from himl. Symonds was suspended and charged, but he fled abroad in 1972 after a threat disguised as a tip-off from the Mason in charge of his imminent trial. This was Det. Chief Supt. Bill Moody who, while taking huge kickbacks from pornographers, had been appointed by Scotland Yard to investigate the Time's allegations of relatively modest graft against lower-ranking detectives. Seven years later Symonds returned to give himself up. He was tried, convicted and given a two-year jail sentence. However he continues to proclaim his innocence, alleging (with justification) that he was offered up as a ritual sacrifice by corrupt men running the CID at that time, notably Bill Moody.

On the tape Symonds was alleged to have said:

Don't forget always to let me know straight away if you need anything because I know people everywhere. Because I'm in a little firm in a firm. Don't matter where, anywhere in London, I can get on the phone to someone I know I can trust, that talks the same as me. And if he's not the right person that can do it, he'll know the person that can. All right? ...That's the thing, and it can work - well, it's worked for years, hasn't it?
Symonds was a Freemason, and his 'firm in a firm' was essentially Masonic. Freemasonry was the security blanket - the ultimate in comforters - for a network of crooked cops throughout the metropolis. Their fraternal bonds reassured them that they could rely on each other's absolute discretion. On that basis the 'firm in a firm' provided whatever service was required. It could get criminal charges dropped against the guilty or ensure their aquital. It could secure the conviction of men who did not pay bribes or who got in the way of bigger fish who were paying. It could protect bribe-paying gangs by preventing their detection. It could even supply the direct participation of some policemen in serious crimes such as robbery. This standing conspiracy had several protective layers or shells. First, everyone in it was a policeman. Second, they were all detectives. Third they were all corrupt. Fourth, most were Freemasons.
Within this carapace crooked cops could get away, if not with murder, then with almost everything else. There was the classic case of Det. Sgt Harry Challenor, a West End Central officer who planted knives, hatchets and iron bars on dozens of innocent citizens. On one occasion he even 'found' detonators for explosives. His undoing came in 1963 when he framed a cluster of young men who had been demonstrating against a visit of Queen Frederika of Greece. He claimed that pieces of brick had been found in their pockets, presumably to throw at the Queen or at the policemen guarding her hotel. The accused were all cleared, eventually, because no brick dust couuld be traced in their pockets. Challenor himself was now put on trial for conspiring to pervert the course of justice. Three young constables who worked with him were convicted and jailed for three years, but Challenor was found unfit to plead and detaiined in a mental hospital at Her Majesty's pleasure.

According to a psychiatrist, he must have been 'very mad indeed' - clinically insane - for over a year.(5) Yet throughout this time his colleagues were apparently unaware of his lunacy. It had passed unnoticed while, with their connivance, he planted offenseive weapons on at least twenty-six men. These same officers could not see he was crazy even as they held down some of his victims so he could beat them up with unimpeded brutality.

Harry Challenor was a Freemason. So were several of his very close CID colleagues. So, too, was one recently retired high-ranking London detective who told me how in the 1960's he was appalled by the way other policemen used to exploit the Craft.

I became a Mason at the suggestion of an officer who is now deputy assistant commissioner. He wanted me to join his lodge but most of the members weren't policemen. Indeed he asked a non-policeman to propose me, so that other members did not think the police were trying to take over the lodge, as sometimes happens.
I soon realized that not all police Masons were as honourable as my sponsor. At the time I was a junior detective in Scotland Yard. One day a senior colleague came in crowing that he had been selected for a place on the intermediate command course at Bramshill. I was taken aback and asked him how he did it.

He said, 'It cost me 300 Pounds. I put it about in the right place.'

'You mean you bribed someone?'

'No. I took out "X" [a Commander] for a few lunches and invited him and his wife to my lodge ladies night. I bought her a little present, paid for the meal and the drinks. And what do you know? I'm off to Bramshill next month!'

He then told me that he'd realized the Commander could get anyone from our squad on the course. Now the Commander clearly wasn't someone you could bung fifty quid or take to a nightclub and get laid. You couldn't bribe or compromise him because he was straight. However, he was also naive so it was fairly easy to buy your way into his good books by lunching him or inviting him and his lady to your annual lodge shindig. He may have guessed what was in my colleague's mind but, even so, he felt able to accept as a fraternal Masonic gesture what in any other circumstances would have consitute an 'inducement'. You appreciate that a non-Mason would have no such opportunity.

My colleague was exceptionally unpleasant: a real crawler. Transparently obsequious, he'd do anything to get on. Most Masons are all right, so it would be unfair to damn them all because of him, but I have seen how such men manipulate Masonic connections to perpetrate acts of evil.

Some years earlier this same man worked on the same team as me. He found two villains in possession of stolen goods. They offered him a substantial bribe and he devised a way to get them out of trouble. Two fall guys were to be arrested and charged in their place. He went on holiday and our governor, a chief inspector, put me temporarily in charge of the case. However, at this stage I knew nothing of the crooked dealings which had already taken place.

I soon had to attend court because two men who had been charged with the crime were being remanded in custody. At the court one of them came up to me and said, 'You needn't think we're going to prison to save the skin of your Masonic friend' - meaning my police colleague. I asked him what he meant, and he convinced me that they had both been framed so the two villians who had committed the crime could get off.

My colleague always used Masonic phrases when speaking to anyone. He would ask people whether they were 'taught to be cautious', 'regular attenders', 'on the level' and the like. These two prisoners were not stupid and they knew from his talk that he was 'on the square', even though they were not.

I was in a quandary. I had not been involved in the arrests and I did not with to see the wrong men go to jail. I went back to Scotland Yard and reported the affair to a senior officer: a detective superintendent who was also a Mason and whom I trusted to sort it out. When my colleague came back from holiday he admitted to the superintendent that he had framed the two men on behalf of his villainous friends, and that he had taken a bribe. The superintendent was wild, but my colleague appealed to him as a brother for help.

I dreaded what might now happen. Would my colleague be put on trial for corruption? Would I be fitted up for betraying him? Or would the trial go ahead, with the defendents squealing in open court that they had been the victims of a frame-up?

To my relief at the time, the matter was sorted out - but in an extraordinary way. The defendents were given a Masonic solicitor whose brother was a barrister. The solicitor persuaded them to plead guilty to the crime which they had not committed. The barrister then did a deal with the judge who let them off with a suspended sentence and a fine. That fine and all their legal fees were paid by the villains who had committed the crime! No action was taken against the crooked officer, but I was moved to another job because he said he could not work on the same team as me!

I asked this former detective why he had done nothing about this gross perversion of justice and why, twenty years later, he was still not prepared to be named in this account.
I cannot go public even now because, although I was only the junior officer, I was implicated in the conspiracy as deeply as anyone. I had been involved in a trial when two men pleaded guilty to crimes which, I knew at the time, they had not committed. The rest of the team were as angry as I at our colleague's actions. They were equally innocent of any crimanlity, but we all became 'guilty' by being caught up in the web of protection woven around a crooked Masonic brother who had appealed for help.
Remember! This happened in the 1960s when many detectives were bent. I had reported this matter once and the powers-that-be had made their decision. If I had opened my mouth again I might have ended up on trial on my own admissions, not the villain who put me into this mess. Besides, my only evidence against him was the world of the two defendants who later pleaded guilty and were paid off.

My informant has told me this crooked Mason's name but I cannot name him for legal reasons. To be fair to Freemasonry, however, these horror stories have to be weighed against the fact that in the Porn Squad trials of 1977, three Crown witneses (Kilkerr, Andrews and Culver) were themselves 'on the square'. When it came to the crunch they were ready to tell the truth, even though it would send their Masonic brothers to jail.
Simiilarly, the officer who spearheaded Scotland Yard's anti-corruption drive in the 1970s, Deputy Assistant Commissioner Gilbert Kelland, was a Freemason. At his right hand was another Mason, DAC Ron Steventon, later head of A 10. Neither spared their brethren from the anti-corruption knife. This can be explained partly by the existence of two distinct Masonic traditions in the Metropolitan Police at this time. Gilbert Kelland, for example had spent the first twenty-five years of his service in uniform. He was not a 'carerr detective' and he never allowed his Freemasonry to intrude into, or overlap with, his police work. In contrast Freemasonry in much of the CID had become a cover for crookery and corruption.

Towering above all such distinctions, however, is the fact that no major corruption trials would have taken place at all if it had not been for the heroic if much-hated figure of Robert Mark, who was neither a detective nor a Freemason. It was Mark who created the climate in which, for the first time in a century, corruption - Masonic or otherwise - was no longer fashionable among London detectives. It was he who gave Kelland and Steventon orders to clean up the CID

It would be difficult to argue that Freemasonry had much beneficial effect on the Metropolitan CID between 1877 and 1977. Yet in the years since Brother Moody and his clan were purged, the Craft's reputation in the force has sunk even lower. This is partly because Masonic abuse in the 1970s propelled many honest and honourable policemen out of the Craft. One such man now holds a very high rank in Scotland Yard.

In the 1970s the old CID porn squad was so corrupt it had to be disbanded. I was assigned to the uniform squad which replaced it. We used to raid one dirty bookshop after another but, whenever I tried to fix a formal interview date with the shop owners, they would pull out their diaries and say pointedly, 'Sorry, I can't make Tuesday. It's my lodge night, you understand.'
They automatically assumed I was a Mason, which was not surprising since the crooked detectives we had replaced were all Masons. By letting me know they were 'on the square' the pornographers clearly expected me to drop my inquiries. Of course, the Masonic fix had been going on for so many years they had every expectation it would soon be 'business as usual'. I was so disgusted that I resigned from my lodge.

Another Yard officer also quit the Craft about this time. He is now ranked just below chief constable in another force:
I joined my lodge just after I had become a sergeant. I went along for a year and met some spendid people. I confess it struck me as a wonderful thing for a policeman's career, but my career was going splendidly anyway. The lodge meetings were very boring - the most infernally boring thing I have ever been involved in. Also, my job as a detective was taking such long and irregular hours that I could not get along each week to my lodge of instruction. And when I was free I preferred to spend time with my wife and children.
For me the crunch came when we raided a notorious West End nightclub where the hostesses were really prostitutes. I was about to charge the owners with living off immoral earnings when they appealed to me 'on the square'. They were my brother Masons and expected me to let them off. I ignored the approach and went ahead and charged them. When the case came up at the Old Bailey they were acquitted. I was appalled, but I don't think the rotten verdict had anything to do with Freemasonry.

Unfortunately, not even Scotland Yard's 'rubber-heel mob' - A 10 - was immune from Masonic manipulation. For many years I have known a London solicitor who is a Mason. In the 1970s he had a client who was also a Mason. On his behalf the solicitor made a complaint to A 10 alleging serious criminal misconduct by a detective. In due course an A 10 officer was appointed to investigate. He assured the solicitor that he had never met the detective under investigation, and that he would pursue the inquiry with the utmost zeal. Taught to be cautious, however, the solicitor used his Masonic connections to discover more about the A 10 investigator.
To my horror I discovered he was in the same lodge as the suspect detective. I promptly made another complaint to A 10 saying these men knew each other and that, in the circumstances, they should appoint another investigator. Nothing of the kind! I received a curt reply saying the two men did not know each other and I was mistaken. But I had documentation to prove they had both been masters of the same lodge, and must have known each other very well indeed.
I immediately told my client about this connection and A 10's response. He was astonighingly philisophical. He said the investigation was now certain to be a whitewash, for no Mason would ever bring criminal charges against a brother Mason in the same lodge. I wanted to have a go at A 10 and produce my conclusive Masonic evidence, but my client insisted on dropping the complaint! What could I do? I was acting on instructions.

At this time A 10 may have been going through teething problems. No such excuse could be made for the Complaints Investigation Bureau, CIB2, which replaced A 10 in the late 1970s. There are many potential conflicts of interest when one policeman investigates another. One of these is Freemasonry and CIB2 must always be aware that hidden Masonic connections might contaminate the fair investigation of complaints. In its short existence CIB2 has had enough Masons among its chiefs to be aware of the very short odds that a Mason could be given the job of investigating on of his Masonnic brothers. In 1979 CIB2's allied disciplinary team known as CIB3 was headed by Chief Supt. William Gibson. Two years later he was succeeded by Malcolm A. Ferguson. Later still, Kenneth Churchill-Coleman took over. When the Manor of St Jame's Lodge list leaked out in 1986 who should be on it but Cass, Lampard, Gibson, Ferguson and Churchill-Coleman.
Perhaps all these men would pursue any complaint laid against a Masonic colleague with even greater dedication than one against a non-Mason, if only to prove that Masonic loyalties would not get in their way. But where would a member of the Manor of St Jame's Lodge stand if he were told to investigate another member? With some fifty serving officers in the lodge, this may very likely happen (if it had not happened already). Ideally, the investigator would refuse the job and suggest a non-Mason do it instead. Heaven help Freemasonry if the public ever find out that a policeman under investigation belongs to the same lodge as his investigator!

A policeman who recently retired from Hampshire Constabulary wrote to me expressing his concern:

A detective I knew was a practising mason and had been master of his lodge. He made no secret of the fact and always wore a masonic ring, tie and cufflinks. This man was, to say the least, unscrupulous in his methods and it was well known in the legal profession that he 'doctored' his evidence in court. This was confirmed to me by a barrister. This officer was the subject of several internal discipline inquiries but always appeared to escape prosecution. Senior officers seemed to be afraid of him and I always felt this was because of influential people he moved with socially.
These days internal discipline and anti-corruption units need to be seen to be above reproach and suspicion, otherwise all sorts of lobbies and pressure groups (not just disorganized anti-Masons) will cry 'Whitewash!' In 1987 Scotland Yard's self-cleansing squad was put to the test again as another 'Masonic' corruption scandal broke.
Early one morning in July 1987 Detective Constable Alan Holmes shot himself dead in his back garden. Eight months later a corner's jury confirmed that he had committed suicide, but it did not have to say why. The answer lies in a tangle of personal and work problems complcated by Holme's Masonic bonds - not that Freemasonry was mentioned at any point during the inquest.

'Taffy' Holmes was a stocky 15-stone, broken-nosed, rugby-playing Welshman who drank to excess. He had a wife and children. He also had a mistress. He was totally devoted to the Metropolitan Police in which he had served for twenty-six years. At work he was gregarious, convivial and he would do anything for a friend. At the inquest one colleague said Taffy believed 'a problem shared is a problem solved'. Another officer felt he had 'misguided loyalties'. His perceptive father-in-law explained how it 'seemed essential to Alan that he should be liked by everybody'.

In the days before he died Holmes was under great pressure from the anti-corruption squad, CIB 2, which was investigating alleged links between a detective commander and a man convicted of receiving some of the 26 million Pounds 'Brinks-MAT' gold bullion stolen in 1983. The receiver, Kenneth Noye, is also a Freemason; the commander may be one too - but it seems unlikely that the two men have ever met. Even so, CIB 2 felt that Holmes (who worked on the Brinks-MAT robbery investigation) knew about such a relationship. CIB 2 may have arranged for another officer to secretly tape-record Holmes as he gossiped about corrupt acts by fellow-detectives. When Holmes learned about the alleged tape he was plunged into depression, partly because it seems these crooked officers were also Masons. He felt 'set-up' and betrayed. At the inquest one colleague (himself under no cloud) explained how, five days before he died, Holmes had returned very upset from an all-day grilling by CIB 2. He talked about another officer whom he had considered a friend but who had 'let him down and told lies about him'. He said he was going to kill that man and then kill himself. The colleague told the Coroner: 'He was very upset, but I didn't think he'd do it'.

Holmes was doubly appalled by this alleged treachery because he had only just introduced the 'traitor' into his own Masonic lodge. The treachery was even greater because that year Taffy was Lodge Master. What about the Five Points of Fellowship?: 'Breast to breast, your lawful secrets when entrusted to me as such I will keep my own.' Lawful or not, many brothers' secrets - Holmes included - had been betrayed.

At his funeral Taffy received full police honours. Deputy Commissioner John Dellow led dozens of Scotland Yard mourners. Holmes was eulogized as having 'a face as hard as granite but a heart as soft and vulnerable as a butterfly'. Most of the eighty wreaths came from police officers, stations and squads, but several were sent openly by Freemasons, including one large floral square-and-compasses. Another bore the inscription: 'To our brave, wonderful and worhsipful master who chose death rather than dishonour his friends and workmates.'

Death may be better than revealing one's own dishonour, but killing oneself to cover up for others is taking loyalty too far - even for a Mason. In any case, what did Holmes know which could have dishonoured his friends and workmates? In a suicde note he told his wife, 'I loved the police and never did them an ounce of harm', but might not his suicide bring more dishonour on the police than telling the truth about crooked colleagues?

Taffy Holmes was Master of Lodge no. 7114. When I was first told this fact, I thought it might be part of a pattern. Lodge 7114 is another 'Manor' lodge: the Manor of Bensham. I wondered if there was a 'Manor' lodge for each of the twenty-three old divisions of the Metropolitan Police. Might they all be like the St Jame's: jam-packed full of fuzz? With a hundred cops in each, the full slate would be 2,300. Further researches uncovered ten more lodges in Greater London with 'Manor' in the title, but only three correspond with a Metropolitan Police district and none of them is an all-police lodge. Even the Manor of Bensham recruits from all walks of life, but it does have a strong police connection. In 1986 at least five members were past or present policemen, including retired Commander Arthur Howard, QPM: once had of C 1, Scotland Yard's chief detective branch. It seems all these officers joined the Lodge while living in Croydon or serving in the local 'Z' District.

The full story behind the death of Bensham's Master may never emerge, but in March 1988 a report appeared in the News of the World saying he died for nothing.(6) It claimed another officer had told Holmes that a tape of his crooked colleagues' conversation existed when in fact no such recording had been made. Taffy's shame at having inadvertently betrayed his Masonic brethren was baseless. Whether or not that shame is what drove him to suicide, may the Great Architect have mercy on his soul.

Notes.

1. Masonic poem by David Barker, quoted in A Treasury of Masonic Thought, Robert Hale, London 1981.

2. This story was told briefly by Stephen Knight in The Brotherhood. I expand on it here to make a different point. For a full account see George Dilnot, The Trial of the Detectives, Geoffrey Bles 1928.

3. If an article was listed as 'lost', rather than stolen, no crime would appear to have been committed. Morrish's experience resembles that of Det. Con. Ron Walker of the Kent Constabulary who alleged in 1986 that some colleagues had been rigging the force's crime 'clear-up' rate by persuading convicted prisoners to confess to crimes which they had not committed.

4. Penguin 1977.

5. See the James Report (Home Office appointed Inquiry into the Challenor Affair), HMSO 1965. Mary Grigg, Challenor Case, Penguin 1965. For a more sympathetic view of Challenor, see Gilbert Kelland, op. cit.

6. News of the World, 20 March 1988.


Martin Short wrote, produced and narrated the prize-winning ITV documentary series on the Mafia in America, Crime Incorporated. To accompany the series, he wrote Crime Inc.: A History of Organized Crime in America. In addition to writing feature articles for The Times, The Spectator, New Statesman, Time Out and Special Forces, he co-authored (in 1977) The Fall of Scotland Yard, about police corruption in London. He is also the author of Lundy: The Destruction of Scotland Yard's Finest Detective (1991).

After reading history at Cambridge University, he worked - from 1969 to 1984 - on major current affairs programmes for the ITV companies Thames, Granada and London Weekend (on the Lebanon) and for Channel 4's Dispatches series (on the international arms trade). In 1988 he presented Charlie Richardson and the British Mafia for Longshot Productions and Channel 4. His series based on Inside the Brothehood appeared on ITV in 1989, and in 1994 he produced and presented the ITV series Gangbusters.

welshwitch
12-12-2012, 01:52 AM
Sadly no, was just going through articles as I can't remember if he actually named the journo. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he come out with it whilst on Nicky Campbell's radio show? NC got quite twitchy about it IIRC.

I'm still checking...

former colleague Paul Gambaccini claims on Radio Five Live that DJ was a 'necrophiliac'

Former BBC DJ said he was aware of claims in the eighties
'The expression I came to associate with Savile's sexual partners was "under-age subnormals", says colleague of the Jim'll Fix It presenter
In 1990 interview Savile dismissed claims he was a necrophiliac after saying he took pleasure in taking dead people to a hospital mortuary

By Larisa Brown

PUBLISHED: 16:25, 23 October 2012 | UPDATED: 10:20, 24 October 2012

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2221922/Jimmy-Savile-necrophiliac-says-colleague-Paul-Gambaccini.html

anders7777
12-12-2012, 01:55 AM
Sadly no, was just going through articles as I can't remember if he actually named the journo. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he come out with it whilst on Nicky Campbell's radio show? NC got quite twitchy about it IIRC.

I'm still checking...

Nicholarse shat himself - you are quite correct! :D

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 02:01 AM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2221922/Jimmy-Savile-necrophiliac-says-colleague-Paul-Gambaccini.html

Just looking for the recording, the one on the BBC site has been heavily chopped - what a surprise!

anders7777
12-12-2012, 02:01 AM
Kill Bill Vol. 1 - My Name Is Buck, And I&#39;m Here To Fuck - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbZR9PMdBfk)

Always found the Uma scene unconvincing

You are either muscularly wasted or not, can't be half and half :D

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 02:04 AM
Nicholarse shat himself - you are quite correct! :D

:D I knew I'd heard him talking to NC about it, I listened to the recording that day - you don't forget someone like NC shitting it live on air!

discovery77
12-12-2012, 02:07 AM
True

I'd like to know how many masons are working on all the whitewashes?

25pc

50 per cent!???




A Firm in a Firm: Freemasonry and Police Corruption

By, Martin Short

Is a Brother off the track?
Try the Square;
Try it well on every side.
Nothing draws a craftsman back
Like the Square when well applied.
Try the Square.

Is he crooked, is he frail?
Try the Square;
Try it early, try it late;
When all other efforts fail,
Try the Square to make him straight -
Try the Square.(1)

Since the Metropolitan Police was founded in 1829 there have been two complete reorganizations of its detective department. Both were provoked by massive corruption scandals leading to criminal trials exactly one hundred years apart, in 1877 and 1977. In each scandal Freemasonry played a dominant role.

Scotland Yard's first 'Detective Force' was set up in 1842. It consisted of only two inspectors and six sergeants. By 1869, 180 detectives were dealing with minor crime in outlying divisions but serious investigations in London were left to only twenty-seven officers out of 9,000. In the 1870's most of this squad was itself a criminal conspiracy in which not only were the prime culprits Freemasons; Freemasonry was what brought them together.(2)

In 1872 a confience trickster names William Kurr was running a bogus betting operation. Like any shrewd smalltime criminal with big ideas, he saw that the way to make real money was to bring policemen into the racket. Bribing detectives after you get caught is costly and uncertain. Far better to cut them in on the profits beforehand and avoid arrest altogether. The one safe place where Kurr could proposition policemen was his Masonic lodge.

At a lodge meeting in Islington Kurr made friends with just the man: Inspector John Meikeljohn. In return for 100 Pounds - nearly half his annual pay - Meiklejohn agreed to give Kurr advance warning of any police action against him or his betting racket. At first the corrupt officer kept the payoff to himself but as the racket expanded, he involved three chief inspectors in the Detective Force whom he also knew as brother Masons.

Kurr needed bigger and better protection because he was expanding his operation with the skills of a new friend called Harry Benson. Here was a virtoso con-man of international disrepute. In 1872, posing as a French count, he had deluded the Lord Mayor of London into giving him 1,000 Pounds for relief work in the wake of the Franco-Prussian War. He was found out and imprisoned in Newgate where he tried to burn himself to death. Instead he merely crippled himself but in 1873 he hobbled out of jail and came to know Kurr. Together they planned new scams to part mug punters from their funds.

One by one, Inspector Meiklejohn sucked his Masonic colleagues into Kurr and Benson's network. First he found out that Chief Inspector Nathaniel Druscovitch was inquiring into the swindles. He also discovered Druscovitch was 60 Pounds in debt and suggested Kurr might help him out. The deal was done, Kurr gave him the money and Druscovitch ws neutralized. His senior chief inspector, George Clarke, wsa also on the swindlers trail, but he agreed to lose the scent in return for a pay-off. A third chief inspector, William Palmer, was also bought up.

Now assured of total immunity from police zeal, Benson set up Sport, a news-sheet offering punters foolproof betting systems. In 1876, using the alias Hugh Montgomery, he deluded the Comtesse de Goncourt of Paris into 'investing' 10,000 Pounds. He rewarded here with several non-existant winners and then requested she invest a further 30,000 Pounds with a bookmaker of his choice. At this point she had a belated spasm of suspicion. She hired a London lawyer, who reported Benson and Kurr to Scotland Yard. They were soon jailed for fifteen and ten years' hard labour respectively. Only then did they reveal the role of the bent coppers. In the subsequent investigation the Yard's chief of detectives, Supt. Frederick Williamson, was dismayed to discover that three of his four chief inspectors were corrupt, along with their uninformed seducer, Meiklejohn. In 1877 all four were tried at the Old Bailey. Clarke was acquittted, but Meiklejohn, Palmer and Druscovitch were convicted and sentenced to two years' hard labour. It was a bad day for the police and hardly a distinguished one for Freemasonry with its principals of brotherly love, relief and truth.

This scandal discredited the entire Metropolitan Detective Force which was scrapped and re-formed as the Criminal Investigation Department. The CID was to have a seperate career structure and higher rates of pay than the main uniform force, a distinction which was to cause grinding irritation over the next hundred years. By 1884 the new structure of twenty-four detectives at Scotland Yard and 254 in the divisions, all under the central command of a new Assistant Commissioner (Crime), appeared to be an effective answer to corruption, Masonic or otherwise.

It took a hundred years for that illusion to be pricked, although close observers of the CID had known the truth for decades. A hint of what went wrong in the meantime comes in the story of Chief Inspector Reginald Morrish, a Metropolitan officer from 1911 to 1937. Morrish worked in the CID for sixteen years, winning forty-four commendations and eighteen awards. He also served in Scotland Yard's fraud and homicide squads. From 1943 to 197 he was a senior instructor at Hendon Police College and wrote several textbooks. One book he did not write was an autobiography. Not long before he died, aged ninety-two, he burnt his entire police papers. His son Ivor was horrified. He wrote:

During the whole of my early life at home, including a period in which we lived at a very busy police station in south London, my father's chief topics of conversation were the police, religion, bribery and corruption (which he saw as rife in all levels in the police force) and freemasonry. The one thing which seemed to worry him most of all was the connexion which he felt existed between freemasonry and corruption, and between freemasonry and self-advancement in the force. In his view there was no room for doubt about these connexions. He used to list all the officers who were masons. He noted the dates of their promotions, whether they had jumped anyone else of equal or greater ability, and all their connexions with other officers in the force.
On many occasions he was invited to join the masons (his two brothers were members) and he used to tell numerous stories of how both police officers and criminals sought favours of him in his pursuance of the detection of crimes. They seemed to assume that - like most other 'successful' officers in the Met - he was a mason of some standing. He received masonic handshakes by the score when investigating crimes, and he was offered bribes in the form of money, goods and even the services of women, in order that he might overlook vital pieces of evidence. Of course, not all those attempting bribery were masons but, according to my father, many were.

The most common expressions used by my father in relation to work were 'he is on the take', 'he is taking backhanders', 'he is receiving the drop' and 'he is on the square' with being amenable to bribes, corruption and perjury, so often did he use these phases in juxtaposition. Later on in life, when we discussed the position of freemasonry in the force and its connexion with corruption and self-advancement at the expense of others, it became clear that he regarded freemasonry as an evil per se which was to be held responsible for the larger proportion of corruption in the police force.

In 1933 or 1934 Det. Insp. Morrish had to run the Croydon Division while the divisional inspector was off sick. Looking through various registers and record books he became very suspicious of the way crimes were being recorded, so he carried out his own investigation. He concluded that the division's relatively high success rate for crime clearance was thoroughly bogus, because many crimes were being entered up as something else. A woman would have her handbag snatched, but this would be entered in the register as a case of 'Lost Property'.(3) Many other entries were far more ingenious.
After a thorough examination of every bit of routine and every crime over a period of several months, my father wrote a report on his findings and sent copies to his bosses: the divisional detective inspector and the area superintendent. As my father did not spare personalities, the facts he revealed militated strongly against both men's honesty. According to him, both were freemasons.
They met him together in private, sought at first to mollify him and then began to threaten and pressure him. He was told in no uncertain terms that, if he went on investigating the investigators, it could only lead to his own downfall. But he was adamant, and felt he had a duty to society, as well as his own integrity, to pursue the matter. He obviously had rattled his superiors who clearly warned him they would block all possible promotion for him.

I'm afraid they didn't understand what motivated him. Nothing and no one could ever browbeat him. He forthwith typed out an even fuller report which detailed all the criminal statistics he had investigated, and concluded with an account of his dealings with his superiors including their interview with him and the threats they had made. This 100 page report (which unfortunately he later burnt) he addressed to the Metropolitan Commissioner, Lord Trenchard.

Trenchard was soon paying personal visits to each station in the division, and insisted on seeing the records and documents referred to in Morrish's report. Eventually Trenchard called him up to his office but, moments before he was due to enter, Deputy Commissioner Norman Kendal tried to divert him. He suggested he need not see the Commissioner, as everything could be put right at this late stage - even his promotion - if he would only withdraw his report
Behind this soft approach my father detected a threat that, if he didn't withdraw, he could say goodbye to any future advancement. He politely refused and insisted on seeing the Commissioner. Later, as a result of the interview and the report, changes were introduced - in the Croydon Division at least - in the methods of recording and clearing up crime, and the way statistics on crime clearance were prepared.
Very soon afterwards the two superior officers retired. My father was transferred to the training centre at Scotland Yard and began his lecturing career. About six months later, when Lord Trenchard established Hendon Police College, he told my father he was promoting him to chief inspector and making him a senior instructor. When he later met my father at the college, he insisted it was he and no one else who had promoted him. The message, if oblique, seemed quuite clear to my father. I don't know whether Trenchard, or for that matter Kendal, was a mason or not, but my father always regarded the whole business as an indication that even the Brotherhood could be outwitted on occassions.

As evidence against Freemasonry, this account is difficult to assess. Sceptics would stress that the alleged incidents took place more than fifty years ago, might have been much exaggerated in the original telling and are recollected here by a son who might be spicing up his father's account. No documents have survived and we have no proof the 'villans' were Masons. A lawyer would dismiss it all as 'triple hearsay'. However, Ivor Morrish is a respected author of numerous teaching textbooks and a lifelong educationalist. He is unlikely to have invented so much detail. His father was a man of unquestioned integrity, and outstanding instructor, and deeply trusted by Lord Trenchard who was this century's greatest police reformer. As such, Reg Morrish's perceptions of Freemasonry should not be lightly discarded. What is more, they marry only too convincingly with the incontrovertible evidence revealed when scores of corrupt detectives were investigated in the 1970's. The full story of Metropolitan Police corruption at the time is told in The Fall of Scotland Yard, a book which I co-authored in 1977 with Barry Cox and John Shirley.(4) Here I isolate the Masonic aspects of the scandal.
In 1977 three Old Bailey trials revealed the tip of an iceberg of corruption in London's CID. Thirteen detectives were jailed, including two commanders, one chief superintendent and five inspectors. In the course of the investigation it emerged that most were Freemasons. The probablility is that they were all 'on the square'.

One trial focused on the Flying Squad, once legendary for its detective brilliance but now notorious for having a commander, Ken Drury, who was 'on the take' (cash, gifts, entertainments and holidays) from a professional criminal and pornographer, Jimmy Humphreys. The other trials revolved around the Obscene Publications Squad. It emerged that Craft membership was a prerequisite for any detective who wanted a share of the rich pickings to be extorted from London's profiteering pornographers.

The 'Porn Squad' was at that time a unit within the CID's central office, known as C1. Getting into this team was a prestigious step up for any detective, but selection was largely in the gift of the C1 commander or the superintendent heading the squad. From 1964 until 1972 it's eminence grise was Det. Chief Supt. Bill Moody who has a unique claim to infamy in the history of Scotland Yard. While heading one of the biggest-ever investigations into police corruption he was simultaneously collecting huge bribes from the dirty booksellers of Soho, London's notorious vice district.

Moody's extraordinary double life is revealed in The Fall of Scotland Yard. The essential details are that in 1977 he was convicted of conspiring to take money from pornographers over an eight-year period. Moody was convicted on sample charges, one of which involved a payment of 14,000 Pounds. The trial showed that for some years he had been pocketing annual kickbacks worth 40,000 Pounds. His pay-off at the Old Bailey was twelve years' imprisonment.

Bill Moody was an ardent Freemason, so ardent that he took some of his pornographer friends to his Masonic gatherings. One was Ron 'the Dustman' Davey whom he had met at another pornographer's birthday party in Trader Vic's Restaurant in the Hilton Hotel. In 1975 Davey was questioned by officers who had been appointed to investigate the porn squad's corruption. He told them he came to know Det. Sgt Cyril Jones (later sentenced to seven years in jail) through Moody's Masonic functions.

I have been to numerous of these and in fact Bill introducted me into his lodge. It has been put to me that I booked a coach on the following dates - 6.11.69 to Derry and Toms (10 people); 17.11.69 to Top Rank Suite, Croydon (12 people); 25.9.71 Regent Street. All were masonic functions at which I was a guest. Normally present were Bill Moody, Cyril Jones, 2 other police officers [whom Davey names] and our wives. I am quite sure there were many more outings.
It was part of Bill Moody's discredited defence that he had no idea Ron Davey was a pornographer. If so, he had overlooked Ron's conviction and a six-month jail term in 1960 for publishing 744 improper photographs of men and 105 of women. This fact was available to Moody not simply as head of the Obscene Publications Squad; he would have read about it in News of the World, for the newspaper had revealed how Davey was arrested in his darkroom with 2,486 dirty photographs. At another of his premises, police discovered 15,000 pornographic negatives and 15,000 snaps. Ron's home was an Aladdin's cave of naked lads. As the magistrate packed him off to prison, he told Davey he did not suppose anyone had ever before seen 'such a vast volume of absolute filth'.
Davey had been a pornographer for three years, after eight years working as a dustman. In 1975 when giving evidence against Bill Moody, he described himself as a 'maintenance engineer'. I have been unable to discover which of these three occupations he disclosed when applying for membership of the Craft.

Masonic activities in the dirty book trade went far beyond coach parties of pornographers, policemen and their wives living it up on the town. When Scotland Yard's anti-corruption squad went digging into the porn squad's later years, all sorts of Masonic connections emerged. One prosecution witness was Frank R. Andrews, who spent three years in the porn squad as a detective constable. When Moody recruited him in 1965, he already knew that everybody posted there immediately bought new cars or expensive houses. In short, he said, they 'sprouted wealth'.

Andrews was introduced to the system of another witness, D.C. Ernie Culver, himself later convicted of a cheque fraud. Culver explained how bribe moneys were shared out. Andrews recalled one chat with him about a forthcoming Masonic Ladies' Night.

He said words to the effect, 'Have you got enough money for the new dress for your wife?' I indicated that I didn't want any help but he then handed me a brown envelope aned said, 'Put that towards the cost of a new dress for your wife.' I did not want the money and decided to ditch it in a nearby waste-paper bin. We attended the ladies' evening as planned. Bill Moody was there with his wife and another sergeant.
Another convicted officer was Leslie Alton, a detective inspector and a Mason. He instructed Andrews to collect the weekly bribes in packets from pornographers, then share it out among the other officers. Andrews had known Alton was a friend for many years and tried to keep an eye on him when he got drunk.
On one occasion he got drunk and said, 'Come on, let's take a walk around the West End.' I was full of trepidation. He walked into a bookshop with me and said in a loud voice. 'I am detective inspector Alton of New Scotland Yard. How much have you taken today?' He then went to the cash register, opened it and started checking the proceeds. I was embarrassed and left him in the shop. When he came out he said words to the effect, 'Disipline. That's what these people need: discipline!'
Andrews assumed that, on past form, Alton must have stuck his hand in the till and grabbed a fistful of notes. They both left the squad in 1968 but from 1970 to 1972 its overlord was Commander Wally Virgo who, I understand, was also a Freemason. Originally jailed for twelve years for corruption, Virgo was later freed because the appeal court felt the judge's summing-up had been unduly hostile.
Under Virgo the porn squad was almost entirely Masonic. When one brother, Detective Inspector Anthony Kilkerr, became a prosecution witness his colleagues came up with a disarming explanation for the 20 Pounds in pornographers' pay-off money they had stuck in his desk drawer each week. Those crisp fivers were not the fruits of corruption, one suspect told an investigator, but whiprounds to help Kilkerr pay his Masonic inititation fees. This was a lie, of course, but the choice of lie was revealing.

Because Kilkerr would not take the money (he threw it away or left it in his desk), he was suspected of being a 'spy in the camp'. His 'Mr Clean' image so upset another detective named Peter Fisher that he told Kilkerr not to open his mouth because he was now 'involved' himself and would go down with the rest of them. If they were all caught, Fisher added, they 'could form a football team on the Isle of Wight'. This was a reference to the island's two high-security jails, but in the late 1970s convicted detectives were sent to open prisons in such large numbers that they could have formed their own Masonic lodges.

The porn and Flying Squad investigations were part of a massive anti-corruption drive by Sir Robert Mark. Soon after he became Commissioner in 1972 he set up a squad known as A 10 to 'rubber-heel' the entire force. By the time he retired five years later, A 10 had forced the dismissal or resignation of nearly 500 officers: 100 a year. The old regime had ousted an average of just sixteen. Most of the concentration of Freemasons was far greater than among uniform men. There is no way of finding out exactly how many were Masons, partly because Scotland Yard has never divulged the names of all 500.

To combat corruption Mark imposed the most thorough reform of the CID for a hundred years. In August 1975 he shuffled 300 detectives around London, in an attempt to break the dangerous custom of leaving them in one area for so many years that tended to develop a corrupt intimacy with local criminals. In 1976 he inflicted an even less welcome reform: systematic interchange between detective and uniform branches. No detective could expect much promotion unless he served in uniform for several years. This was devised not gratuitously to humilate the plain-clothes men, but to destroy the closed mentality and corrupt traditons of the 'firm in a firm'.

To what extent was this 'firm in a firm' Masonic? That phrase was immortalized by Detective Sergeant John Symonds on a surreptitious tape-recording made by two Times reporters in 1969. The tape appeared to support claims of a small-time thief that Symonds was extorting small sums of money from himl. Symonds was suspended and charged, but he fled abroad in 1972 after a threat disguised as a tip-off from the Mason in charge of his imminent trial. This was Det. Chief Supt. Bill Moody who, while taking huge kickbacks from pornographers, had been appointed by Scotland Yard to investigate the Time's allegations of relatively modest graft against lower-ranking detectives. Seven years later Symonds returned to give himself up. He was tried, convicted and given a two-year jail sentence. However he continues to proclaim his innocence, alleging (with justification) that he was offered up as a ritual sacrifice by corrupt men running the CID at that time, notably Bill Moody.

On the tape Symonds was alleged to have said:

Don't forget always to let me know straight away if you need anything because I know people everywhere. Because I'm in a little firm in a firm. Don't matter where, anywhere in London, I can get on the phone to someone I know I can trust, that talks the same as me. And if he's not the right person that can do it, he'll know the person that can. All right? ...That's the thing, and it can work - well, it's worked for years, hasn't it?
Symonds was a Freemason, and his 'firm in a firm' was essentially Masonic. Freemasonry was the security blanket - the ultimate in comforters - for a network of crooked cops throughout the metropolis. Their fraternal bonds reassured them that they could rely on each other's absolute discretion. On that basis the 'firm in a firm' provided whatever service was required. It could get criminal charges dropped against the guilty or ensure their aquital. It could secure the conviction of men who did not pay bribes or who got in the way of bigger fish who were paying. It could protect bribe-paying gangs by preventing their detection. It could even supply the direct participation of some policemen in serious crimes such as robbery. This standing conspiracy had several protective layers or shells. First, everyone in it was a policeman. Second, they were all detectives. Third they were all corrupt. Fourth, most were Freemasons.
Within this carapace crooked cops could get away, if not with murder, then with almost everything else. There was the classic case of Det. Sgt Harry Challenor, a West End Central officer who planted knives, hatchets and iron bars on dozens of innocent citizens. On one occasion he even 'found' detonators for explosives. His undoing came in 1963 when he framed a cluster of young men who had been demonstrating against a visit of Queen Frederika of Greece. He claimed that pieces of brick had been found in their pockets, presumably to throw at the Queen or at the policemen guarding her hotel. The accused were all cleared, eventually, because no brick dust couuld be traced in their pockets. Challenor himself was now put on trial for conspiring to pervert the course of justice. Three young constables who worked with him were convicted and jailed for three years, but Challenor was found unfit to plead and detaiined in a mental hospital at Her Majesty's pleasure.

According to a psychiatrist, he must have been 'very mad indeed' - clinically insane - for over a year.(5) Yet throughout this time his colleagues were apparently unaware of his lunacy. It had passed unnoticed while, with their connivance, he planted offenseive weapons on at least twenty-six men. These same officers could not see he was crazy even as they held down some of his victims so he could beat them up with unimpeded brutality.

Harry Challenor was a Freemason. So were several of his very close CID colleagues. So, too, was one recently retired high-ranking London detective who told me how in the 1960's he was appalled by the way other policemen used to exploit the Craft.

I became a Mason at the suggestion of an officer who is now deputy assistant commissioner. He wanted me to join his lodge but most of the members weren't policemen. Indeed he asked a non-policeman to propose me, so that other members did not think the police were trying to take over the lodge, as sometimes happens.
I soon realized that not all police Masons were as honourable as my sponsor. At the time I was a junior detective in Scotland Yard. One day a senior colleague came in crowing that he had been selected for a place on the intermediate command course at Bramshill. I was taken aback and asked him how he did it.

He said, 'It cost me 300 Pounds. I put it about in the right place.'

'You mean you bribed someone?'

'No. I took out "X" [a Commander] for a few lunches and invited him and his wife to my lodge ladies night. I bought her a little present, paid for the meal and the drinks. And what do you know? I'm off to Bramshill next month!'

He then told me that he'd realized the Commander could get anyone from our squad on the course. Now the Commander clearly wasn't someone you could bung fifty quid or take to a nightclub and get laid. You couldn't bribe or compromise him because he was straight. However, he was also naive so it was fairly easy to buy your way into his good books by lunching him or inviting him and his lady to your annual lodge shindig. He may have guessed what was in my colleague's mind but, even so, he felt able to accept as a fraternal Masonic gesture what in any other circumstances would have consitute an 'inducement'. You appreciate that a non-Mason would have no such opportunity.

My colleague was exceptionally unpleasant: a real crawler. Transparently obsequious, he'd do anything to get on. Most Masons are all right, so it would be unfair to damn them all because of him, but I have seen how such men manipulate Masonic connections to perpetrate acts of evil.

Some years earlier this same man worked on the same team as me. He found two villains in possession of stolen goods. They offered him a substantial bribe and he devised a way to get them out of trouble. Two fall guys were to be arrested and charged in their place. He went on holiday and our governor, a chief inspector, put me temporarily in charge of the case. However, at this stage I knew nothing of the crooked dealings which had already taken place.

I soon had to attend court because two men who had been charged with the crime were being remanded in custody. At the court one of them came up to me and said, 'You needn't think we're going to prison to save the skin of your Masonic friend' - meaning my police colleague. I asked him what he meant, and he convinced me that they had both been framed so the two villians who had committed the crime could get off.

My colleague always used Masonic phrases when speaking to anyone. He would ask people whether they were 'taught to be cautious', 'regular attenders', 'on the level' and the like. These two prisoners were not stupid and they knew from his talk that he was 'on the square', even though they were not.

I was in a quandary. I had not been involved in the arrests and I did not with to see the wrong men go to jail. I went back to Scotland Yard and reported the affair to a senior officer: a detective superintendent who was also a Mason and whom I trusted to sort it out. When my colleague came back from holiday he admitted to the superintendent that he had framed the two men on behalf of his villainous friends, and that he had taken a bribe. The superintendent was wild, but my colleague appealed to him as a brother for help.

I dreaded what might now happen. Would my colleague be put on trial for corruption? Would I be fitted up for betraying him? Or would the trial go ahead, with the defendents squealing in open court that they had been the victims of a frame-up?

To my relief at the time, the matter was sorted out - but in an extraordinary way. The defendents were given a Masonic solicitor whose brother was a barrister. The solicitor persuaded them to plead guilty to the crime which they had not committed. The barrister then did a deal with the judge who let them off with a suspended sentence and a fine. That fine and all their legal fees were paid by the villains who had committed the crime! No action was taken against the crooked officer, but I was moved to another job because he said he could not work on the same team as me!

I asked this former detective why he had done nothing about this gross perversion of justice and why, twenty years later, he was still not prepared to be named in this account.
I cannot go public even now because, although I was only the junior officer, I was implicated in the conspiracy as deeply as anyone. I had been involved in a trial when two men pleaded guilty to crimes which, I knew at the time, they had not committed. The rest of the team were as angry as I at our colleague's actions. They were equally innocent of any crimanlity, but we all became 'guilty' by being caught up in the web of protection woven around a crooked Masonic brother who had appealed for help.
Remember! This happened in the 1960s when many detectives were bent. I had reported this matter once and the powers-that-be had made their decision. If I had opened my mouth again I might have ended up on trial on my own admissions, not the villain who put me into this mess. Besides, my only evidence against him was the world of the two defendants who later pleaded guilty and were paid off.

My informant has told me this crooked Mason's name but I cannot name him for legal reasons. To be fair to Freemasonry, however, these horror stories have to be weighed against the fact that in the Porn Squad trials of 1977, three Crown witneses (Kilkerr, Andrews and Culver) were themselves 'on the square'. When it came to the crunch they were ready to tell the truth, even though it would send their Masonic brothers to jail.
Simiilarly, the officer who spearheaded Scotland Yard's anti-corruption drive in the 1970s, Deputy Assistant Commissioner Gilbert Kelland, was a Freemason. At his right hand was another Mason, DAC Ron Steventon, later head of A 10. Neither spared their brethren from the anti-corruption knife. This can be explained partly by the existence of two distinct Masonic traditions in the Metropolitan Police at this time. Gilbert Kelland, for example had spent the first twenty-five years of his service in uniform. He was not a 'carerr detective' and he never allowed his Freemasonry to intrude into, or overlap with, his police work. In contrast Freemasonry in much of the CID had become a cover for crookery and corruption.

Towering above all such distinctions, however, is the fact that no major corruption trials would have taken place at all if it had not been for the heroic if much-hated figure of Robert Mark, who was neither a detective nor a Freemason. It was Mark who created the climate in which, for the first time in a century, corruption - Masonic or otherwise - was no longer fashionable among London detectives. It was he who gave Kelland and Steventon orders to clean up the CID

It would be difficult to argue that Freemasonry had much beneficial effect on the Metropolitan CID between 1877 and 1977. Yet in the years since Brother Moody and his clan were purged, the Craft's reputation in the force has sunk even lower. This is partly because Masonic abuse in the 1970s propelled many honest and honourable policemen out of the Craft. One such man now holds a very high rank in Scotland Yard.

In the 1970s the old CID porn squad was so corrupt it had to be disbanded. I was assigned to the uniform squad which replaced it. We used to raid one dirty bookshop after another but, whenever I tried to fix a formal interview date with the shop owners, they would pull out their diaries and say pointedly, 'Sorry, I can't make Tuesday. It's my lodge night, you understand.'
They automatically assumed I was a Mason, which was not surprising since the crooked detectives we had replaced were all Masons. By letting me know they were 'on the square' the pornographers clearly expected me to drop my inquiries. Of course, the Masonic fix had been going on for so many years they had every expectation it would soon be 'business as usual'. I was so disgusted that I resigned from my lodge.

Another Yard officer also quit the Craft about this time. He is now ranked just below chief constable in another force:
I joined my lodge just after I had become a sergeant. I went along for a year and met some spendid people. I confess it struck me as a wonderful thing for a policeman's career, but my career was going splendidly anyway. The lodge meetings were very boring - the most infernally boring thing I have ever been involved in. Also, my job as a detective was taking such long and irregular hours that I could not get along each week to my lodge of instruction. And when I was free I preferred to spend time with my wife and children.
For me the crunch came when we raided a notorious West End nightclub where the hostesses were really prostitutes. I was about to charge the owners with living off immoral earnings when they appealed to me 'on the square'. They were my brother Masons and expected me to let them off. I ignored the approach and went ahead and charged them. When the case came up at the Old Bailey they were acquitted. I was appalled, but I don't think the rotten verdict had anything to do with Freemasonry.

Unfortunately, not even Scotland Yard's 'rubber-heel mob' - A 10 - was immune from Masonic manipulation. For many years I have known a London solicitor who is a Mason. In the 1970s he had a client who was also a Mason. On his behalf the solicitor made a complaint to A 10 alleging serious criminal misconduct by a detective. In due course an A 10 officer was appointed to investigate. He assured the solicitor that he had never met the detective under investigation, and that he would pursue the inquiry with the utmost zeal. Taught to be cautious, however, the solicitor used his Masonic connections to discover more about the A 10 investigator.
To my horror I discovered he was in the same lodge as the suspect detective. I promptly made another complaint to A 10 saying these men knew each other and that, in the circumstances, they should appoint another investigator. Nothing of the kind! I received a curt reply saying the two men did not know each other and I was mistaken. But I had documentation to prove they had both been masters of the same lodge, and must have known each other very well indeed.
I immediately told my client about this connection and A 10's response. He was astonighingly philisophical. He said the investigation was now certain to be a whitewash, for no Mason would ever bring criminal charges against a brother Mason in the same lodge. I wanted to have a go at A 10 and produce my conclusive Masonic evidence, but my client insisted on dropping the complaint! What could I do? I was acting on instructions.

At this time A 10 may have been going through teething problems. No such excuse could be made for the Complaints Investigation Bureau, CIB2, which replaced A 10 in the late 1970s. There are many potential conflicts of interest when one policeman investigates another. One of these is Freemasonry and CIB2 must always be aware that hidden Masonic connections might contaminate the fair investigation of complaints. In its short existence CIB2 has had enough Masons among its chiefs to be aware of the very short odds that a Mason could be given the job of investigating on of his Masonnic brothers. In 1979 CIB2's allied disciplinary team known as CIB3 was headed by Chief Supt. William Gibson. Two years later he was succeeded by Malcolm A. Ferguson. Later still, Kenneth Churchill-Coleman took over. When the Manor of St Jame's Lodge list leaked out in 1986 who should be on it but Cass, Lampard, Gibson, Ferguson and Churchill-Coleman.
Perhaps all these men would pursue any complaint laid against a Masonic colleague with even greater dedication than one against a non-Mason, if only to prove that Masonic loyalties would not get in their way. But where would a member of the Manor of St Jame's Lodge stand if he were told to investigate another member? With some fifty serving officers in the lodge, this may very likely happen (if it had not happened already). Ideally, the investigator would refuse the job and suggest a non-Mason do it instead. Heaven help Freemasonry if the public ever find out that a policeman under investigation belongs to the same lodge as his investigator!

A policeman who recently retired from Hampshire Constabulary wrote to me expressing his concern:

A detective I knew was a practising mason and had been master of his lodge. He made no secret of the fact and always wore a masonic ring, tie and cufflinks. This man was, to say the least, unscrupulous in his methods and it was well known in the legal profession that he 'doctored' his evidence in court. This was confirmed to me by a barrister. This officer was the subject of several internal discipline inquiries but always appeared to escape prosecution. Senior officers seemed to be afraid of him and I always felt this was because of influential people he moved with socially.
These days internal discipline and anti-corruption units need to be seen to be above reproach and suspicion, otherwise all sorts of lobbies and pressure groups (not just disorganized anti-Masons) will cry 'Whitewash!' In 1987 Scotland Yard's self-cleansing squad was put to the test again as another 'Masonic' corruption scandal broke.
Early one morning in July 1987 Detective Constable Alan Holmes shot himself dead in his back garden. Eight months later a corner's jury confirmed that he had committed suicide, but it did not have to say why. The answer lies in a tangle of personal and work problems complcated by Holme's Masonic bonds - not that Freemasonry was mentioned at any point during the inquest.

'Taffy' Holmes was a stocky 15-stone, broken-nosed, rugby-playing Welshman who drank to excess. He had a wife and children. He also had a mistress. He was totally devoted to the Metropolitan Police in which he had served for twenty-six years. At work he was gregarious, convivial and he would do anything for a friend. At the inquest one colleague said Taffy believed 'a problem shared is a problem solved'. Another officer felt he had 'misguided loyalties'. His perceptive father-in-law explained how it 'seemed essential to Alan that he should be liked by everybody'.

In the days before he died Holmes was under great pressure from the anti-corruption squad, CIB 2, which was investigating alleged links between a detective commander and a man convicted of receiving some of the 26 million Pounds 'Brinks-MAT' gold bullion stolen in 1983. The receiver, Kenneth Noye, is also a Freemason; the commander may be one too - but it seems unlikely that the two men have ever met. Even so, CIB 2 felt that Holmes (who worked on the Brinks-MAT robbery investigation) knew about such a relationship. CIB 2 may have arranged for another officer to secretly tape-record Holmes as he gossiped about corrupt acts by fellow-detectives. When Holmes learned about the alleged tape he was plunged into depression, partly because it seems these crooked officers were also Masons. He felt 'set-up' and betrayed. At the inquest one colleague (himself under no cloud) explained how, five days before he died, Holmes had returned very upset from an all-day grilling by CIB 2. He talked about another officer whom he had considered a friend but who had 'let him down and told lies about him'. He said he was going to kill that man and then kill himself. The colleague told the Coroner: 'He was very upset, but I didn't think he'd do it'.

Holmes was doubly appalled by this alleged treachery because he had only just introduced the 'traitor' into his own Masonic lodge. The treachery was even greater because that year Taffy was Lodge Master. What about the Five Points of Fellowship?: 'Breast to breast, your lawful secrets when entrusted to me as such I will keep my own.' Lawful or not, many brothers' secrets - Holmes included - had been betrayed.

At his funeral Taffy received full police honours. Deputy Commissioner John Dellow led dozens of Scotland Yard mourners. Holmes was eulogized as having 'a face as hard as granite but a heart as soft and vulnerable as a butterfly'. Most of the eighty wreaths came from police officers, stations and squads, but several were sent openly by Freemasons, including one large floral square-and-compasses. Another bore the inscription: 'To our brave, wonderful and worhsipful master who chose death rather than dishonour his friends and workmates.'

Death may be better than revealing one's own dishonour, but killing oneself to cover up for others is taking loyalty too far - even for a Mason. In any case, what did Holmes know which could have dishonoured his friends and workmates? In a suicde note he told his wife, 'I loved the police and never did them an ounce of harm', but might not his suicide bring more dishonour on the police than telling the truth about crooked colleagues?

Taffy Holmes was Master of Lodge no. 7114. When I was first told this fact, I thought it might be part of a pattern. Lodge 7114 is another 'Manor' lodge: the Manor of Bensham. I wondered if there was a 'Manor' lodge for each of the twenty-three old divisions of the Metropolitan Police. Might they all be like the St Jame's: jam-packed full of fuzz? With a hundred cops in each, the full slate would be 2,300. Further researches uncovered ten more lodges in Greater London with 'Manor' in the title, but only three correspond with a Metropolitan Police district and none of them is an all-police lodge. Even the Manor of Bensham recruits from all walks of life, but it does have a strong police connection. In 1986 at least five members were past or present policemen, including retired Commander Arthur Howard, QPM: once had of C 1, Scotland Yard's chief detective branch. It seems all these officers joined the Lodge while living in Croydon or serving in the local 'Z' District.

The full story behind the death of Bensham's Master may never emerge, but in March 1988 a report appeared in the News of the World saying he died for nothing.(6) It claimed another officer had told Holmes that a tape of his crooked colleagues' conversation existed when in fact no such recording had been made. Taffy's shame at having inadvertently betrayed his Masonic brethren was baseless. Whether or not that shame is what drove him to suicide, may the Great Architect have mercy on his soul.

Notes.

1. Masonic poem by David Barker, quoted in A Treasury of Masonic Thought, Robert Hale, London 1981.

2. This story was told briefly by Stephen Knight in The Brotherhood. I expand on it here to make a different point. For a full account see George Dilnot, The Trial of the Detectives, Geoffrey Bles 1928.

3. If an article was listed as 'lost', rather than stolen, no crime would appear to have been committed. Morrish's experience resembles that of Det. Con. Ron Walker of the Kent Constabulary who alleged in 1986 that some colleagues had been rigging the force's crime 'clear-up' rate by persuading convicted prisoners to confess to crimes which they had not committed.

4. Penguin 1977.

5. See the James Report (Home Office appointed Inquiry into the Challenor Affair), HMSO 1965. Mary Grigg, Challenor Case, Penguin 1965. For a more sympathetic view of Challenor, see Gilbert Kelland, op. cit.

6. News of the World, 20 March 1988.


Martin Short wrote, produced and narrated the prize-winning ITV documentary series on the Mafia in America, Crime Incorporated. To accompany the series, he wrote Crime Inc.: A History of Organized Crime in America. In addition to writing feature articles for The Times, The Spectator, New Statesman, Time Out and Special Forces, he co-authored (in 1977) The Fall of Scotland Yard, about police corruption in London. He is also the author of Lundy: The Destruction of Scotland Yard's Finest Detective (1991).

After reading history at Cambridge University, he worked - from 1969 to 1984 - on major current affairs programmes for the ITV companies Thames, Granada and London Weekend (on the Lebanon) and for Channel 4's Dispatches series (on the international arms trade). In 1988 he presented Charlie Richardson and the British Mafia for Longshot Productions and Channel 4. His series based on Inside the Brothehood appeared on ITV in 1989, and in 1994 he produced and presented the ITV series Gangbusters.

No wonder really is it that every time we discuss masonry on here we get a new member causing disruption and diversion! Who will be the next one I wonder?!

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTNIqxJ2V1AzHlMn0bb4sPn5O_lgqq1z ECJWrxOi3zbloDDKwI1

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 02:08 AM
845 childrens( thats children) body parts were retained for research study by the consultant at Alder Hey Liverpool.

Frank Dobson ordered the enquiry......and that was the end of his political career.

Someone posted on herehundreds of pages back that Saviles links to top level body building in the 60`s and how experimentation with the eating of certain body glands was believed to be beneficial for bone and muscle growth.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 02:12 AM
I dont know if anyone had considered that Max may have been responsible for his own secret filming, he clearly states he has dirt on everyone who may leave him to take a rap!

Said his stash was far away

Just turn over his holiday homes ...

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 02:20 AM
Said his stash was far away

Just turn over his holiday homes ...

Or does he use Iron Mountain? I've been to one of their warehouses - I remarked to one to one of the staff "This place is like the final scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark". He replied "Yep! And it's probably got some equally interesting items inside". :eek:

dentedarthur
12-12-2012, 02:21 AM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/1136723.stm

The good people of Leeds appear to be indifferent to the possibility that Savile may have been involved in the procurement of body parts.

On a side issue but related a warning to anyone entering Wales. They are about to push through legislation that will require a person to opt out of giving permission to donate organs. If you are not on their system your body is theirs for the choosing!( And your family will get the bill for the clean up operation following a fatal crash1)

heh,
why do you think the NHS was set up in the first place?
considering we live in a totalitarian state and have done since fuck knows when.....


the new duchess on the scene has ancestors from leeds
and these synchronicities are doin' my freaked out nut in

it's a crazy rollercoaster ride from here on in

can feel it, building
like a powder keg

marlowe
12-12-2012, 02:32 AM
As I recall, it was a Sun journalist/s who were talking about Savile's necrophilia to Gambaccini.

tangodeltafoxtrot
12-12-2012, 02:33 AM
You know what else is really still puzzling me?, the claims of Savile being a necrophiliac and working at the hospital mortuaries.

Arent the relatives of people that have died at that/those hospitals anxious to establish if their loved ones bodies were tampered with, especially young victims?? Or is it just a case of what you dont know doesnt hurt you?

It was, admittedly not nearly enough, but was still reported in the MSM, so why not the public uproar, at least from the relatives of deceased??

Have the police even bothered to investigate these claims?
Can we find out?

The truth is, these families probably are in uproar, but we're not seeing them on Sky News or the BBC because William's brood mare had a hiccup or something and that is deemed more reportable and newsworthy.

The MSM operates on the basis of provoking or indeed inventing and creating uproar and outrage, rather than accurately and faithfully reporting it.

"The medium is the message"- Marshall McLuhan

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 02:37 AM
As I recall, it was a Sun journalist/s who were talking about Savile's necrophilia to Gambaccini.

You mean the one who Gambaccini says told him back in the 80's? Been looking and can't find any mention of a name or where they worked - only references to "a reporter" telling him back in the 80's.

marlowe
12-12-2012, 02:44 AM
You mean the one who Gambaccini says told him back in the 80's? Been looking and can't find any mention of a name or where they worked - only references to "a reporter" telling him back in the 80's.


He said it was ten years ago, a reporter from the Scottish Sun boasting at a wedding that everyone at the Sun knew about Savile's necrophilia. And he said that the NOTW and the Sunday People knew about it decades ago.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 02:46 AM
I dont know if anyone had considered that Max may have been responsible for his own secret filming, he clearly states he has dirt on everyone who may leave him to take a rap!

That's the way. :)




Lol. Blackmailed freemason alert. :D And we have another heroine. She stuck it to him and rightfully so! That's two heroines in two days revealed on this thread. :)





It's certainly one thing Sam Smith should have mentioned in the Inside Out programme and not something i've seen mentioned in the MSM since the Channel 4 News report.





Well, it surprises me to hear it. Maybe you are just in a bad area for it.



1245 LE Marquand = spineless fecal matter needs bleaching and kill
All germs via the truth process

coco the clown
12-12-2012, 02:49 AM
You mean the one who Gambaccini says told him back in the 80's? Been looking and can't find any mention of a name or where they worked - only references to "a reporter" telling him back in the 80's.

He didn't name him. He actually said;
"Why 10 years ago, did a reporter from the Scottish Sun, go around a wedding boasting that everybody at the Sun knew about the Savile necrophilia story?
Was it because they did have a necrophilia story? or was it because people from the Sun just go around calling celebrities necrophilia's?

There's a question to answer there.
Why did the News of the World and the Sunday People, which knew about this decades ago, not act?"

He then added;
"And who vetted the knighthood? Coco the Clown?"

I'm still waiting for my £185k cheque from the BBC....

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 02:51 AM
heh,
why do you think the NHS was set up in the first place?
considering we live in a totalitarian state and have done since fuck knows when.....


the new duchess on the scene has ancestors from leeds
and these synchronicities are doin' my freaked out nut in

it's a crazy rollercoaster ride from here on in

can feel it, building
like a powder keg

yeah I was doing some linking of Saviles mother to Mountbatten via the Cayzer family on here this morning who were all high ranking admiralty with Mountbatten but stockbrokers as well.

As I followed through on the link I realised that the family had an estate in Perth and as I recall Saviles father/ grandfather was a gamekeeper/estate manager in Perth before the move to Leeds.

One of them appears to have been married to Mcliballs daughter in the 80`s

Then to bring it up to date the multi billion pound trust fund(CALEDONIA) in 2012 is now chaired by the father of Pip M`s boyfriend.

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 02:54 AM
He said it was ten years ago, a reporter from the Scottish Sun boasting at a wedding that everyone at the Sun knew about Savile's necrophilia. And he said that the NOTW and the Sunday People knew about it decades ago.

He didn't name him. He actually said;
Why 10 years ago, did a reporter from the Scottish Sun, go around a wedding boasting that everybody at the Sun knew about the Savile necrophilia story?
Was it because they did have a necrophilia story? or was it because people from the Sun just go around calling celebrities necrophilia's?

Thanks guys. I think in one of the earlier articles I read something (or maybe misread! :o) about him saying HE knew back in the 80's. Obviously what he said was what you've said - that certain journos knew back then, he was told about it later. So back to my earlier question - who are the journos who knew, what exactly did they know and what were their sources? Would love to know!

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 03:00 AM
Thanks guys. I think in one of the earlier articles I read something (or maybe misread!) about him saying HE knew back in the 80's. Obviously what he said/meant was what you've said - that certain journos knew back then, he was told about it later. So back to my earlier question - who are the journos who knew, what exactly did they know and what were their sources? Would love to know!

Well PIERS is in L.A and i`m guessing he isn`t in a hurry to come back soon.

Kelvin has been saved by Hillsborough because he is such a c**t no one would believe him even if it was the truth and that leaves Rebecca....but she isn`t in the mood for talking just yet:)

marlowe
12-12-2012, 03:03 AM
Thanks guys. I think in one of the earlier articles I read something (or maybe misread! :o) about him saying HE knew back in the 80's. Obviously what he said was what you've said - that certain journos knew back then, he was told about it later. So back to my earlier question - who are the journos who knew, what exactly did they know and what were their sources? Would love to know!


The source would have to be staff at the hospital, or friends/acquaintances of Savile who he told about the necrophilia and who passed it on to journalists. That's why the mortuary staff should have been questioned. Journalists know all kinds of stuff about people, but they keep it hidden for leverage or because someone has told them not to write anything about it.

dentedarthur
12-12-2012, 03:04 AM
There's a question to answer there.
Why did the News of the World and the Sunday People, which knew about this decades ago, not act?"



it's called censorship.
it's ending.

slowly slowly catchee monkey ;)

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:08 AM
Well PIERS is in L.A and i`m guessing he isn`t in a hurry to come back soon.

Kelvin has been saved by Hillsborough because he is such a c**t no one would believe him even if it was the truth and that leaves Rebecca....but she isn`t in the mood for talking just yet:)


You think? :D The thing is, and like I was saying earlier, the necrophilia is probably not even worth pursuing is it? Not being defeatist, let's face it - if you're messing with corpses there's no witnesses. As I said before, Police don't really give a shit about the living victims so they're in no hurry to investigate what he did to the dead. Only the testimony of a fellow porter or other member of staff who was there is going to expose any further light on this. And I won't hold my breath for that :(

Edit - @Marlowe - was typing as you replied, yes I agree ^^^

coco the clown
12-12-2012, 03:15 AM
You think? :D The thing is, and like I was saying earlier, the necrophilia is probably not even worth pursuing is it? Not being defeatist, let's face it - if you're messing with corpses there's no witnesses. As I said before, Police don't really give a shit about the living victims so they're in no hurry to investigate what he did to the dead. Only the testimony of a fellow porter or other member of staff who was there is going to expose any further light on this. And I won't hold my breath for that :(

I think you are right - forgive the pun, but its a dead end. ;)

The Jersey home is the place to crack.
The fact that Savile was sooo upset with the Sun story, and the sued them is imo very significant.

Someone suggested earlier (can't recall who) that maybe he wasn't so Teflon coated there, and could be linked to something serious seemed credible.

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 03:19 AM
You think? :D The thing is, and like I was saying earlier, the necrophilia is probably not even worth pursuing is it? Not being defeatist, let's face it - if you're messing with corpses there's no witnesses. As I said before, Police don't really give a shit about the living victims so they're in no hurry to investigate what he did to the dead. Only the testimony of a fellow porter or other member of staff who was there is going to expose any further light on this. And I won't hold my breath for that :(

Edit - @Marlowe - was typing as you replied, yes I agree ^^^

I would think that in an institution such as the NHS job security linked to heirarchy will ensure that any reports are hushed up. Savile assisted Franey to promotion and probably others too.

Taking out Clifford will ensure that the common mans route to kiss and tell has ensured that any prospective stories will not reach a wider MSM audience.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 03:21 AM
:D I knew I'd heard him talking to NC about it, I listened to the recording that day - you don't forget someone like NC shitting it live on air!

I was doing cartwheels in the kitchen, the pompous inbred twatters!!! :D

sweetcheeks
12-12-2012, 03:21 AM
845 childrens( thats children) body parts were retained for research study by the consultant at Alder Hey Liverpool.

Frank Dobson ordered the enquiry......and that was the end of his political career.

Someone posted on herehundreds of pages back that Saviles links to top level body building in the 60`s and how experimentation with the eating of certain body glands was believed to be beneficial for bone and muscle growth.

Connections to Arnie Schwarz and Savile, Arnie was suspected of taking human hormone glands in early seventies, Savile was head of National amateur body building association (NABBA) at time of Arnie winning.


"Frank Dobson: To ask the Prime Minister (1) who nominated Jimmy Savile for a knighthood; [123299]

(2) whether Jimmy Savile was vetted before being nominated for a knighthood. [123300]

The Prime Minister: It has been the practice of successive Governments not to comment on individual honours cases.
23 Oct 2012 : Column 757W

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201213/cmhansrd/cm121023/text/121023w0001.htm

claydog
12-12-2012, 03:23 AM
You think? :D The thing is, and like I was saying earlier, the necrophilia is probably not even worth pursuing is it? Not being defeatist, let's face it - if you're messing with corpses there's no witnesses. As I said before, Police don't really give a shit about the living victims so they're in no hurry to investigate what he did to the dead. Only the testimony of a fellow porter or other member of staff who was there is going to expose any further light on this. And I won't hold my breath for that :(

Edit - @Marlowe - was typing as you replied, yes I agree ^^^



It's just one kink that these sociopaths indulge in, they have access to these places and love taking major liberties right under our noses. But like you said, the dead can't give any statements, we have some real shockers to come yet I imagine. After seeing spit the dog on here yesterday I am ready for any thing. I wonder if spit has the injunction or Bob?

We should be focusing on the royals and their foot-soldiers in the police force and Vatican city and the entire paedo blackmailed political collection of fucktards pretending to be in charge.. And not forgetting the celebs also, I bet a desire for column inches is at an all time low.. They are all keeping it on the low low I reckon. Hoping it'll all blow over like it did with Diana, But this is the big one..

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:24 AM
I think you are right - forgive the pun, but its a dead end. ;)

The Jersey home is the place to crack.
The fact that Savile was sooo upset with the Sun story, and the sued them is imo very significant.

Someone suggested earlier (can't recall who) that maybe he wasn't so Teflon coated there, and could be linked to something serious seemed credible.

HDLG is definitely a huge piece of the jigsaw. Just going back to the necrophilia, the only other thing I would say is what others have touched on - did it go beyond that? Was it more than sex with corpses? Was it a means to conceal other things? Steal bodies or body parts even? If it was any of those things (more than just Savile having his way with dead people) then there may be more chance of uncovering it as it's more likely others were privvy/party to that activity. The Alder Hey scandal is on my mind now.

Jersey - to be honest it was reading the stuff about that and the links to Savile on this site last year which pricked my consciousness about JS and wider/related issues. It's very important IMO too.

tangodeltafoxtrot
12-12-2012, 03:24 AM
Connections to Arnie Schwarz and Savile, Arnie was suspected of taking human hormone glands in early seventies, Savile was head of National amateur body building association (NABBA) at time of Arnie winning.


"Frank Dobson: To ask the Prime Minister (1) who nominated Jimmy Savile for a knighthood; [123299]

(2) whether Jimmy Savile was vetted before being nominated for a knighthood. [123300]

The Prime Minister: It has been the practice of successive Governments not to comment on individual honours cases.
23 Oct 2012 : Column 757W

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201213/cmhansrd/cm121023/text/121023w0001.htm

Ergo, the honours system is demonstrably non-transparent
Ergo, the honours system is obviously subject to corruption
Ergo, the honours system should be scrapped or dramatically reformed.

Once again, the obvious corruption is hiding in plain sight.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 03:25 AM
As I recall, it was a Sun journalist/s who were talking about Savile's necrophilia to Gambaccini.

Nicholarse wearing out his box of depends on live radio ... :eek:

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 03:32 AM
Ergo, the honours system is demonstrably non-transparent
Ergo, the honours system is obviously subject to corruption
Ergo, the honours system should be scrapped or dramatically reformed.

Once again, the obvious corruption is hiding in plain sight.

I would think that outside of the youthful sporting element this years New Years Honours List will be a tainted damp squib.

Who would now want to join the ranks of such noble counterparts as Sir Jimmy?

Ahh for services to celebrity broadcasting and charity Sir Philileas.

claydog
12-12-2012, 03:38 AM
Ergo, the honours system is demonstrably non-transparent
Ergo, the honours system is obviously subject to corruption
Ergo, the honours system should be scrapped or dramatically reformed.

Once again, the obvious corruption is hiding in plain sight.



If I were pushing the buttons right now, the entire new years honors and lords list still living would be in stress positions being asked very specific questions right now.. That would be far quicker than yewtree, which sounds like more free-masonic fuckery.


"Ok, Brucie.. Higher than a jack, you say a queen" I am glad I don't have title or any kind of attachment to grace and favour right now.. it use to have benefits now it has implications.. Just saying..

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 03:41 AM
Just randomly skipping back pages. Found something from last month.....

This is interesting, Ciaran Jenkins of Channel 4 news has tweeted....

"Correction: Promise of "seismic" child abuse story from @markwatts_1 inv several "senior ex-Tory ministers", but "separate" from north Wales"

https://twitter.com/C4Ciaran

Ciaran Jenkins ‏@C4Ciaran
Correction: Promise of "seismic" child abuse story from @markwatts_1 inv several "senior ex-Tory ministers", but "separate" from north Wales

12 Nov Tessa Hauke ‏@TessaHauke
@C4Ciaran @MarkWatts_1 is this promise of "seismic" child abuse story for @Channel4News tonight or elsewhere?

12 Nov Ciaran Jenkins ‏@C4Ciaran
@TessaHauke The promise of the story is from @markwatts_1 who is the editor of Exaro News.

16/11/12

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/4704/analysis-why-media-must-still-investigate-claims-of-child-abuse

Is anybody here signed up there? or would anybody sign up for the free trial to see what's behind the paywall?

marlowe
12-12-2012, 03:45 AM
I guess Jersey could be where the real horrors took place because it's such an elite masonic establishment rich people's playground with fewer of the inconvenient restrictions that the mainland has.

claydog
12-12-2012, 03:51 AM
I guess Jersey could be where the real horrors took place because it's such an elite masonic establishment rich people's playground with few inconvenient restrictions.

If old bill are in on it and local proprietors then it would be a piece of piss to maintain, I still say they welcomed the Nazi party there as it was probably already agreed any way. Edward VIII who I still think is a contender for Sa-viles dad was visiting his family member, Heir Hitler while the early part of WWII was under way.. They sold us out regardless of how they all agreed to end the fucking charade and sell it to us as the official his-story. It was just more industrial enterprise and blood sacrifice sold to us by the mind programming of patriotism.

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 03:53 AM
If I were pushing the buttons right now, the entire new years honors and lords list still living would be in stress positions being asked very specific questions right now.. That would be far quicker than yewtree, which sounds like more free-masonic fuckery.


"Ok, Brucie.. Higher than a jack, you say a queen" I am glad I don't have title or any kind of attachment to grace and favour right now.. it use to have benefits now it has implications.. Just saying..

Sir Wogan was perceptive to the situation on CiN. I`m guessing that the more barrel has been scraped for celebrity knighthoods now. Although in their deluded blissfully out of touch world( uncannily similar to MP`s) I can see the dinner party conversation right now:-

Dail: Steven a little bird told me your in for a BIG surprise!

Steven: Ohh my my my you shouldn`t believe all you read on TWATTER even if I can confirm that I will be elevated to the illustrious ranks of Sir Elton.

Dail: Oh i`m so pleased for you put in a word for me while you`re there!

Utterly Pointless.

coco the clown
12-12-2012, 03:53 AM
Just going back to the necrophilia, the only other thing I would say is what others have touched on - did it go beyond that? Was it more than sex with corpses? Was it a means to conceal other things? Steal bodies or body parts even? If it was any of those things (more than just Savile having his way with dead people) then there may be more chance of uncovering it as it's more likely others were privvy/party to that activity. The Alder Hey scandal is on my mind now.


Just following that through, if he were to be obtaining body parts, three things spring to mind;

1. He wouldn't be doing it for free - therefore money or favour involved.
2. Drug companies would be the likely recipients - and therefore maybe a trail?
3. Working backwards, speculation on likely research companies might be an angle for example; Seeing who the Alder Hay, etc customers were might be a start:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-18050/Body-parts-taken-living-children.htm

A spokeswoman for Alder Hey refused to name the company involved, but it is understood to be Aventis Pasteur, a leading vaccination research firm which has its headquarters are in the French city of Lyons.

Research along these lines might lead somewhere :)

Sorry about jumping in with HDLG, I see now it was rude of me - apologies :o

claydog
12-12-2012, 03:58 AM
Sir Wogan was perceptive to the situation on CiN. I`m guessing that the more barrel has been scraped for celebrity knighthoods now. Although in their deluded blissfully out of touch world( uncannily similar to MP`s) I can see the dinner party conversation right now:-

Dail: Steven a little bird told me your in for a BIG surprise!

Steven: Ohh my my my you shouldn`t believe all you read on TWATTER even if I can confirm that I will be elevated to the illustrious ranks of Sir Elton.

Dail: Oh i`m so pleased for you put in a word for me while you`re there!

Utterly Pointless.


"Bring forth the guillotine" Might get their attentions..:D

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 04:01 AM
Just following that through, if he were to be obtaining body parts, three things spring to mind;

1. He wouldn't be doing it for free - therefore money or favour involved.
2. Drug companies would be the likely recipients - and therefore maybe a trail?
3. Working backwards, speculation on likely research companies might be an angle for example; Seeing who the Alder Hay, etc customers were might be a start:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-18050/Body-parts-taken-living-children.htm





Research along these lines might lead somewhere :)

Sorry about jumping in with HDLG, I see now it was rude of me - apologies :o

This is what makes this thread so unbelievably fantastic. What seems like a dead end one minute can allow for some creative thinking to pull in some alternative line of research.

marlowe
12-12-2012, 04:05 AM
I think Satanists also use body parts in some rituals, maybe Savile was procuring for them too.

sweetcheeks
12-12-2012, 04:11 AM
Interesting article from Nick Davies, The Guardian Oct 1997, regarding Welsh Homes Abuse Inquiry. Bear in mind that it is suspected that Steve Messham is 'Leon' in the article.

http://www.nickdavies.net/1997/10/01/secrecy-imposed-on-the-exposure-of-alleged-child-abuse-news-and-feature/

It is also interesting that Ex-Senator Stuart Syvret of Jersey has been twittering with Messham and appears very supportive of him.

http://twitter.com/smessham

I feel immensely sorry for the people of Jersey, getting stuck with Le Maquand and losing a good man like Syvret.

+

http://www.economicvoice.com/is-the-establishment-really-hiding-a-giant-paedophile-ring/50033531#axzz2EnqOsiCc

ceej
12-12-2012, 04:32 AM
WTF

No, really, WTF is going on?

Are we to believe that there were TWO Jacintha Saldanhas working in UAE??

Meet living Jacintha Saldanha. Jacintha is a Christian lady from Mangalore who works currently in UAE. Log into her Facebook to see verification via her friend's comment. http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=1&theater
8 December at 13:21 · Like
Denzil Fernandes What is happening? I almost wrote and send a comment to daiji and then on second thoughts withdrew the comments. I am confused really. Are there two Jacinthas ? one in UAE and another one in UK I wonder? If someone can please clarify. Thanks and God Bless.

http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-ash3/c113.46.711.711/s160x160/556673_563227730359104_692863178_n.jpg


The following is an MSM article about dead Jacintha Saldanha. Jacintha is a Christian lady from Mangalore who USED to work in UAE....

Read what Jacintha's good friends in UAE have to say about her - the dead one (or maybe it's the living one...or both...?)



http://www.emirates247.com/news/emir...12-11-1.486770


Probe Jacintha Saldhana's death, demand her UAE nurse friends

Practical, clever, strong… Jacintha worked in Mumbai before Muscat and Kuwait and then the UK, say ex-colleagues based here
By Joseph George
Published Tuesday, December 11, 2012

IMG DEL

Jacintha Saldhana would have never have committed suicide and her death should be thoroughly probed.

IMG DEL

That is the firm belief and opinion of her former classmates, friends and colleagues, many of whom are based here in the UAE.


IMG DEL

Jacintha, working as a nurse in the King Edward VII hospital received a call from two prankster Australian radio jockey she, in absence of a receptionist, passed on the call to the desired destination.

Mrs Saldhana put the call through to Duchess Kate’s ward, where an unnamed colleague gave details of the duchess’s treatment for severe morning sickness.

A recording of the conversation was broadcast on the 2Day FM station with the DJs gleefully boasting about their successful hoax Few days later Saldhana was found dead in in the nurse's accommodation under mysterious circumstances.

IMG DEL

Grieving husband Benedict Barboza has revealed his fury to as he struggles to come to terms with the suicide of his beloved wife.

He is not alone.

People who knew her during her college days at the Father Muller’s School of Nursing in Mangalore described her as bold, smart and a very hardworking girl.

IMG DEL

Speaking to Emirates 24|7, Stella M, her colleague and classmate who now works at Welcare Hospital in Dubai says, “The news of her suicide was very shocking.”

“We were in the same batch (1984-89) at the nursing school in Mangalore.

“I still cherish a lot of memories of the good old student days. We were in touch on Facebook. The account has been deactivated after her death,” she says.

Describing Jacintha during her student days, Stella says, “She was very dedicated to her profession, very friendly with patients and devoted to the nursing profession.



“Moreover she was very bold and beautiful as well. She was not the type who would chicken out of difficult situations.

“Never had we imagined that she could take away her own life. She was not the type of person who would commit suicide,” she adds.

According to her friends, Jacintha worked in Mumbai for a while before working in Muscat and Kuwait for a few years. She then moved to the UK.

“We are all shattered. I have worked with her and was her junior in college,” says another Abu Dhabi-based nurse currently working in a government hospital.

“She was a very practical person, very clever and never a weak hearted. That is why her suicide is very suspicious.

“Friends of ours who know her grandmother in India are being told that she had never discussed anything about the hoax call in her last phone call just days before she died,” the nurse said, speaking on condition of anonymity.


[I've posted this on the nurse thread too - am posting here as well because of higher footfall. Post comments/thoughts/astonishment here (http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1061191906#post1061191906) ]

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:43 AM
WTF

No, really, WTF is going on?

Are we to believe that there were TWO Jacintha Saldanhas working in UAE??

Meet living Jacintha Saldanha. Jacintha is a Christian lady from Mangalore who works currently in UAE. Log into her Facebook to see verification via her friend's comment. http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=1&theater

http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-ash3/c113.46.711.711/s160x160/556673_563227730359104_692863178_n.jpg


The following is an MSM article about dead Jacintha Saldanha. Jacintha is a Christian lady from Mangalore who USED to work in UAE....

Read what Jacintha's good friends in UAE have to say about her - the dead one (or maybe it's the living one...or both...?)



http://www.emirates247.com/news/emir...12-11-1.486770



[I've posted this on the nurse thread too - am posting here as well because of higher footfall. Post comments/thoughts/astonishment here (http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1061191906#post1061191906) ]

We were joshing last week about cloned lizard eggs (I was, in a lucid dream) - we have the Laud/Eubanks doppelgängers, and now we have the Queen's nurse clones...???

Can it get any more bizarro???

(yes)

alljokesaside
12-12-2012, 05:03 AM
tell me about..........


http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/78/2002912_48292178.jpg



strange how you never see savile without a cigar.

http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/2686/cigaru.jpg

King Edward VII enjoyed smoking cigarettes and cigars, much to the chagrin of his mother, Queen Victoria. After her death, legend has it, King Edward said to his male guests at the end of a dinner party, "Gentlemen, you may smoke." In his name, a line of inexpensive American cigars has long been named King Edward. Classical pianist and composer Franz Liszt was quoted as saying "A good Cuban cigar closes the door to the vulgarities of the world".[11] Even a female literary giant of the Victorian era, George Sand, observed "The cigar is a perfect complement to an elegant lifestyle".[12]
Cigar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

all hail king savile!

dentedarthur
12-12-2012, 05:12 AM
I think you are right - forgive the pun, but its a dead end. ;)

The Jersey home is the place to crack.
The fact that Savile was sooo upset with the Sun story, and the sued them is imo very significant.

Someone suggested earlier (can't recall who) that maybe he wasn't so Teflon coated there, and could be linked to something serious seemed credible.

"The Jersey home is the place to crack."

lol
fucking domestos city
saviles dead, HDLG is as clean as the duchess' womb

alljokesaside
12-12-2012, 06:03 AM
WTF

No, really, WTF is going on?

Are we to believe that there were TWO Jacintha Saldanhas working in UAE??

Meet living Jacintha Saldanha. Jacintha is a Christian lady from Mangalore who works currently in UAE. Log into her Facebook to see verification via her friend's comment. http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=1&theater


http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-ash3/c113.46.711.711/s160x160/556673_563227730359104_692863178_n.jpg


The following is an MSM article about dead Jacintha Saldanha. Jacintha is a Christian lady from Mangalore who USED to work in UAE....

Read what Jacintha's good friends in UAE have to say about her - the dead one (or maybe it's the living one...or both...?)



http://www.emirates247.com/news/emir...12-11-1.486770



[I've posted this on the nurse thread too - am posting here as well because of higher footfall. Post comments/thoughts/astonishment here (http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1061191906#post1061191906) ]

this story is code. more dots presented for connection.

2xJS. 1 alive . 1 dead. 1 fake. 1 real.

is the real savile still alive?


dots so far in the hanging nurse story:
- DJ's.
- royal baby.
- edward vii.
- agnes.
- Jacintha Saldanha - JS - The Doctor.
- Jimmy Savile - JS - The Fixer.
- the fool (or he who plays it).
- Tom Watson MP who brought to the attention of the nation the possibility of an organised history of paedophelia within government, gives a talk about his book Dial M for Murdoch in Sheffield on Thursday 6th December at King Edward VII Upper School, Main Hall.
- cigars (king edward)
- 2 x JS. 1 fake. 1 real.

heartbeatsalute
12-12-2012, 07:10 AM
http://edinburgheye.wordpress.com/2012/10/04/this-is-rape-culture/
RAPE IS NEVER THE SURVIVOR'S FAULT

illuminumnuts
12-12-2012, 07:16 AM
Frank Dobson: To ask the Prime Minister:
(1) who nominated Jimmy Savile for a knighthood.
(2) whether Jimmy Savile was vetted before being nominated for a knighthood.

The Prime Minister: It has been the practice of successive Governments not to comment on individual honours cases.

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201213/cmhansrd/cm121023/text/121023w0001.htm

Has it been the practice of successive governments to honour gangster nonces? :confused: If not, then I would suggest it would be a good idea to alter established practice on this particular occasion. :)



We absolutely do need to be discussing a better system. Like you illuminuts, I'm 100% for peaceful, legal and a more accessible democracy.

Glad to hear it. Entrenched political parties don't work, corruption will always leak in, and need to be voted out of power. We need to vote in independent M.P.'s and they need to participate in a government forming mechanism after they reach parliament. Same thing after the following General Election and ad infinitum. All very simple and straightforward really. :)



As I recall, it was a Sun journalist/s who were talking about Savile's necrophilia to Gambaccini.

It was definitely Nicky 'not in the public domain so don't talk about it' Campbell on the radio with Gambaccini though.

dentedarthur
12-12-2012, 08:02 AM
Glad to hear it. Entrenched political parties don't work, corruption will always leak in, and need to be voted out of power. We need to vote in independent M.P.'s and they need to participate in a government forming mechanism after they reach parliament. Same thing after the following General Election and ad infinitum. All very simple and straightforward really. :)




government never has been successful for the many and never will succeed

how can anyone consent to be governed by a cabinet a table and a chair?

how about natural persons not artificial persons..

bollocks to legal fictions

and don't trust anyone who tells you they know what is good for you
period

we don't need government
we don't need tesco
we don't need care homes
we don't need any state intervention

we CAN help each other, but it need not involve paperwork and legalese

socialism capitalism fascism ism ism ism ism ism
bollocks to the isms

tired old narrative that if anything bad happens to the sick royals or government or state that we will all start rioting or eating each other, bollocks

GOVERNMENT IS FEAR

FREEDOM FROM FEAR

you are deluding yourself if you believe there has ever been a democracy
not here, not anywhere.

britain is not great
britain is sick

jubbly
12-12-2012, 08:29 AM
Looks like the Jersey care home situation is repeated around the world

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2246378/Dozier-School-Report-reveals-19-unmarked-graves-Florida-boys-reform-school.html

50 grave shafts in a school but only 31 have crosses.

brontide
12-12-2012, 08:35 AM
Connections to Arnie Schwarz and Savile, Arnie was suspected of taking human hormone glands in early seventies, Savile was head of National amateur body building association (NABBA) at time of Arnie winning.


"Frank Dobson: To ask the Prime Minister (1) who nominated Jimmy Savile for a knighthood; [123299]

(2) whether Jimmy Savile was vetted before being nominated for a knighthood. [123300]

The Prime Minister: It has been the practice of successive Governments not to comment on individual honours cases.
23 Oct 2012 : Column 757W

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201213/cmhansrd/cm121023/text/121023w0001.htm

Sweetcheeks....and anyone else:

Would you be willing to submit a carefully worded FOI request?

This really merits further examination.

We know that Savile was awarded his knighthood as part of the Queen's birthday honours announced in June 1990.

"Chairman, Broadmoor Hospital Advisory Committee ans Stoke Mandeville Hospital Spinal Injuries Centre, for charitable services."

It would undoubtedly have come from the Department of Health's 'quota'.

Kenneth 'internal market' Clarke was the Secretary of State for Health at the time.

As I say...this is a real line of enquiry...

If you want to pursue it, put in a FOI request.

chillyheat
12-12-2012, 09:03 AM
We keep on going

Name names legally

Or if people have things on lets say....Mr Moobs...Out it.

chillyheat
12-12-2012, 09:20 AM
From Twitter

Danny Shaw ‏@DannyShawBBC

#Savile report still being finalised, to be published in New Year. Well over 500 victims have come forward. Arrest yesterday was not a celeb

Perhaps my thought of who to trust could be right.....But no.....Weve been TOLD who to listen to and not listen to.....

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Je-lBaY-AH4/ULjPT8HcLeI/AAAAAAAAEg4/LBDcaswrwkM/s1600/spanner+in+the+works.jpg

We rely on our own judgements.....Im fed up with being told what to read or who to listen to....

chillyheat
12-12-2012, 09:33 AM
So, if yesterday's arrest was not a celeb, and was not connected to the ''VILE + others'' strand of investigation....

What (or who) could they be? :confused:

Lets ask Chris.....He knows everything.
Have you ever you tried to start a conversation with a loudmouth? You can’t. Your role is immediately reduced to being merely the cue card between loudmouth’s sequences of monologues.

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 09:41 AM
Back to the Channel Islands

"Jimmy Savile abuse complaint made in Guernsey"

"It is the seventh person to make a complaint about the radio and TV presenter in the Channel Islands, but the only one to have been lodged with Guernsey Police.

The other claims allegedly took place in Jersey."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-jersey-20664507

With the Savile strand of Yewtree closed. I wonder if his connection to Jersey will be in the final report. If the investigation was proper and above board, then it should be.

nickc
12-12-2012, 10:16 AM
Paul Burrell sues Max Clifford for bearch of confidentiality

Ex-Royal Butler: 'Max Clifford Sold Me Out'

news.sky.com/story/1024159/ex-royal-butler-max-clifford-sold-me-out (http://news.sky.com/story/1024159/ex-royal-butler-max-clifford-sold-me-out)


Maybe Claydog has something to add about this...

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 10:26 AM
Having desentitised myself from BBC NEWS in recent weeks ( SINCE THE NEWSNIGHT FIASCO) I returned last week to see the reporting of Clifford.

10o`clock news 2nd story ITV lead story. Newsnight no mention of it what soever. No real surprise there.

Last night I attempted to watch the 10 o`clock news and realised that something is different.

It seems disjointed with no real focus on a lead story, avoidance of Savile etc is expected but the real World Story at the moment is SYRIA/ISRAEL AREA and yet there appears to be no real portrayal of what may be happening.

The last time I caught sight of William Hague was about a month back on this thread in a picture next to Jimmy Savile.

He has a history of fuelling the reality of potentialconflict/war tension and yet he is conspicuously quiet when something potentially catastrophic may be happening:confused:

nathan heller
12-12-2012, 10:44 AM
Just following that through, if he were to be obtaining body parts, three things spring to mind;

1. He wouldn't be doing it for free - therefore money or favour involved.
2. Drug companies would be the likely recipients - and therefore maybe a trail?
3. Working backwards, speculation on likely research companies might be an angle for example; Seeing who the Alder Hay, etc customers were might be a start:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-18050/Body-parts-taken-living-children.htm



Research along these lines might lead somewhere :)

Sorry about jumping in with HDLG, I see now it was rude of me - apologies :o

I am reminded of the artist who was prosecuted for using stolen body parts in his work.

"Anthony-Noel Kelly (born 1956) is a British artist who was found guilty of the theft of body parts from the Royal College of Surgeons, which he had used to make moulds for sculptures. He was sentenced to nine months imprisonment in 1998, and the case raised issues of the ethics of art and the legal status of body parts used for medical research.
Between 1991 and 1994[1] he persuaded a hospital worker to smuggle out the dissected remains of up to 40 bodies from the Royal College of Surgeons[2] Casts of the body parts were used for an exhibition at the London Contemporary Art Fair in 1997. The cadavers were exhibited in a series of casts, painted silver and pinned to a wall, in order to view anatomy "in a historical context" according to Kelly. However, he was arrested soon after and formally charged with stealing human bodies following the discovery of plaster casts of deceased men and women as well as around 30 body parts during police raids at his South London studio and his family's home, Romden Castle in Kent, in April 1997. Kelly was sentenced to nine months in prison. The lab technician who had helped him, Niel Lyndsay, received a six-month suspended sentence.
Kelly's guilty verdict was made possible by a landmark ruling by the trial judge, His Honour Judge Geoffrey Rivlin QC, that human remains used for medical research could be classed as property, and were therefore stolen in this case.[2] He and Lyndsay were the first people ever to be convicted in England for stealing body parts.[3]
Kelly was later able to reclaim art works confiscated by the police, due to a legal technicality.[4] His work was exhibited in 2000 at the Anne Faggionato Gallery, London.[4]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony-Noel_Kelly

marf
12-12-2012, 10:55 AM
I just watched the Theroux Clifford documentary and it seems the whole programme was Clifford trying to create stories about Theroux or Cowell. A theme throughout seemed to be about creating a story or perhaps an illusion about Cowells relationship status and creating pictures such as in Cliffords words speaking to Cowell 'well you get some pictures in the office we just need head and shoulders some pictures across the road and renos and probably be a picture of the the two of you walking down the street its just so ive got pictures so it will show background to the story im going to put out.'
The story did come out in the News of the World Georgina Laws story and in cliffords words later 'ive orchestated the whole thing'

Later in the programme near the end Clifford arranges journalists to be present in his Sainsburys to Louis surprise.
Clifford 'I've been keeping an eye on you'
Caught on radio mic Guardian journalist 'do you think we should level with him'
Clifford 'no no I will never hear the last of it' followed by advice to the journalist on what story to create.
when Louis confronts Max about all of this Max swears and storms off in Sainsburys and at the end says tellingly to the producer 'bye bye .... keep up the good work'

Anyway sounds like Max and vile both were pr gurus and knew how to create illusions.
I suspect that Max was a real match for plods questioning.
Max's prowness is stopping unwanted (by his client) information, coming out by as he puts it 'having a quiet word' or manipulating the media; tv, press or Internet.

Vile did very similar in manipulating the media and hence what people knew.
What we still need to discover and probably never will is what were all the true stories.

Images of Cowell that Max might not want coming out or even Mountbatten/Battenberg that Vile might not want compared.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/album.php?albumid=1310&pictureid=12399

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/album.php?albumid=1310&pictureid=12400

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/album.php?albumid=1310&pictureid=12400

Does MB look like he has similar facial features? Does Cowell look happy?

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 10:55 AM
For a while something was bugging me about the Savile story. Very early on in the thread someone provided a link to someone claiming the original story in the news was fake.
The blogger who claims this goes by the name of annaracoon and claims she was at dunscroft at the time this abuse was meant to of occured
She claimed amongst many things
She never saw Savile there at that time
that Miss Jones ( the head) was most probably more interested in women than men
and that some of the names coming forward saying they were abused at that time were not there ( she was quite firm on that)
She claims that she spoke to friends in the media and Times, but they did not want to hear her story as soon as she mentions the above

http://www.annaraccoon.com/annas-personal-stuff/past-lives-and-present-misgivings-part-eight/

Now I dont know who this blogger is maybe some more internet savy people here might know a bit or her reputation. Some of her other postings seem to be about how the powers that be are trying to control the media and internet, especially twitter and bloggers.

But here is where my thinking is going.
Yes Savile is everything this thread has uncovered about him.
But with all his connections and influence how did the story break. Yes he was dead but it opened a pandors box bringing to the limelight people and rings who until now operated in the background - The politicians, the care home cover ups, Royalty. Too many people in power had a lot to loose if the story broke.
Now if this anna racoons story has truth then the story that broke and ignighted the touchpaper was largley fake. Why?
If it is true and it was fake, how come no one in the MSM highlighted it.. fear of Leveson and this coming out adding to it? BBC already tarnished due to Savile and expose's being canned etc?
Since that story we have had the Schofield, Meesham, McAlpine, various names dropped into the internet -- all inviting speculation, and recriminations where the BBC head leaves ( with a good pay off) and commentators talking about the unregulated internet.
We got the Leverson enquiry looking into the Printed media with a conclusion of state regulation.
Then we got the radio hoax call and the dead nurse ( or as the case may be not dead)
Then recently we got hints of celebs being arrested , yet no names given... yet again inviting speculation on the net.

Im wondering if some of what we are seeing is a carefully crafted play with the inevitable being tighter control over the media and particulary the internet.
Not saying any of the scandals, abuse or people we are uncovering is not real, but its a conduit to the bigger game and that is control over the media and the internet especially the alternative sources of news from places such as here or blogs.
Just a theory, one that im not totally sure of if im honest but to me there is some logic to it.

oldp
12-12-2012, 10:57 AM
This is from Inside Out southwest last night. It covers the Haut de la Garenne scandal and jimmy savile. Alot of what's covered is already known, but i highly recommend you watch the guy at about 12.40. Shocking.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvtysl_inside-out-10-12-12_news#.UMekA65n1EM

Sorry i can't seem to embed it

The legal profession shown in its full glory.

Lie, hedge, fudge, waffle, collect their money, keep their jobs. Anything rather than facing up to a serious situation with common sense action.

oldp
12-12-2012, 11:18 AM
For an offense as prosaic as burglary the filth will be looking at either downgrading the crime or ignoring it all together. If they can fit you up with something whilst 'investigating' your complaint all the better, as it guarantees them an arrest. It's about statistics linked to funding. My advice to victims of crime is really simple, if you have the wherewithal deal with the problem yourself do so. I know this won't be popular but if some piece of shit interfered with someone near and dear to me I would not be going to the cops.

Would agree.

I was burgled many years ago - none of the obvious taken just some collectables so the insurance claim was small. The burglars knew what they wanted and where it was (the house was on the market at the time so giving ample opportunity for a nose about).

The first copper round was OK, but 2 detectives visited me twice and I had the distinct impression it was me they were interested in and not the burglar who they dismissed as an opportunist thief.

Be very careful when dealing with the police!

sweetcheeks
12-12-2012, 11:20 AM
+1 Just had a long conversation with my son in Australia. He said I am the only one he can talk too about this, "even though he thought I was a nutter previously" lol He has tried to talk to his wife, friends and family but they just look at him as if he was a nutcase. Told him I am exactly the same, friends and family either just want to talk about reality tv or worse how the media should lay off the dead, celebrities and royals!!

Asked him how the Oz DJ story is being reported...no big deal really, but he did notice Leveson was in Oz but again no big deal down under!

Off to bang head against the wall:D

Any chance your Son could undertake Code McAlpine and see if he can find anything unusual that we don't have access to here?

sweetcheeks
12-12-2012, 11:27 AM
Im wondering if some of what we are seeing is a carefully crafted play with the inevitable being tighter control over the media and particulary the internet.
Not saying any of the scandals, abuse or people we are uncovering is not real, but its a conduit to the bigger game and that is control over the media and the internet especially the alternative sources of news from places such as here or blogs.
Just a theory, one that im not totally sure of if im honest but to me there is some logic to it.

That is most certainly part of their aim and has been mentioned before on here. The internet allows people to compare stories and name Names. It does not allow them to bury past indiscretions and gives us the power of an ENORMOUS shovel.

romany_jones
12-12-2012, 11:35 AM
That is the picture I have had on my iPad since the day jacintha died.I haven't known how to post it as safari and iPad don't mix. How strange is that. I didn't realise it wasn't the same person.

I have iPad and safari and you can post pictures...... just copy image and post the jpg url in the picture box in the reply section.

gojam
12-12-2012, 11:37 AM
I just watched the Theroux Clifford documentary and it seems the whole programme was Clifford trying to create stories about Theroux or Cowell. A theme throughout seemed to be about creating a story or perhaps an illusion about Cowells relationship status and creating pictures such as in Cliffords words speaking to Cowell 'well you get some pictures in the office we just need head and shoulders some pictures across the road and renos and probably be a picture of the the two of you walking down the street its just so ive got pictures so it will show background to the story im going to put out.'
The story did come out in the News of the World Georgina Laws story and in cliffords words later 'ive orchestated the whole thing'

Later in the programme near the end Clifford arranges journalists to be present in his Sainsburys to Louis surprise.
Clifford 'I've been keeping an eye on you'
Caught on radio mic Guardian journalist 'do you think we should level with him'
Clifford 'no no I will never hear the last of it' followed by advice to the journalist on what story to create.
when Louis confronts Max about all of this Max swears and storms off in Sainsburys and at the end says tellingly to the producer 'bye bye .... keep up the good work'

Anyway sounds like Max and vile both were pr gurus and knew how to create illusions.
I suspect that Max was a real match for plods questioning.
Max's prowness is stopping unwanted (by his client) information, coming out by as he puts it 'having a quiet word' or manipulating the media; tv, press or Internet.

Vile did very similar in manipulating the media and hence what people knew.
What we still need to discover and probably never will is what were all the true stories.
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/album.php?albumid=1310&pictureid=12399

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/album.php?albumid=1310&pictureid=12400

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/album.php?albumid=1310&pictureid=12399

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/album.php?albumid=1310&pictureid=12399


Does MB look like he has similar facial features? Does Cowell look happy?

Do you have a working link to the documentary ?

sweetcheeks
12-12-2012, 11:58 AM
Paul Burrell sues Max Clifford for bearch of confidentiality

Ex-Royal Butler: 'Max Clifford Sold Me Out'

news.sky.com/story/1024159/ex-royal-butler-max-clifford-sold-me-out (http://news.sky.com/story/1024159/ex-royal-butler-max-clifford-sold-me-out)


This is extremely interesting, we already know that Clifford, in his video, stated that he gave the papers stories, in exchange for them withholding others.

His comment is more based on the fact that Burrel has no right to confidentiality than categorically denying that he passed information on

""It is an affront to common sense to suggest that Mr Burrell, who has sold stories to the newspapers, made countless appearances on TV and has even written a book about his dealings with the royal family, now feels able to claim that any information he provided was confidential.

"We will defend these claims in court and will be asking the judge at the earliest opportunity to strike out these claims as having no prospect of success and an abuse of process."

He cannot be trusted and his 'protection racket' is finished. Who will trust him now?

Burrell is also very interesting. He was in a really good position to survey the relationship between Savile and Diana. Remember that he secreted some of Diana's possessions and hid them in his loft for 'safe keeping'. He almost came a cropper, until the Queen gave him an 11th hour reprieve 'suddenly' remembering asking Burrell to take care of some of Diana's things. Hmmm.
His flower shop had two arson attacks before he escaped to America. (Possible threats to keep quiet?)

My opinion is that Savile developed a relationship with Diana on behalf of Charles or MI5 and helped with marriage issues in order to circumvent, and be privy to, any actions that she may have been planning to take. I believe he also played the same role with Andrew and Fergie. That knowledge gave him additional power and leverage.

ceej
12-12-2012, 12:02 PM
Just following that through, if he were to be obtaining body parts, three things spring to mind;

1. He wouldn't be doing it for free - therefore money or favour involved.
2. Drug companies would be the likely recipients - and therefore maybe a trail?
3. Working backwards, speculation on likely research companies might be an angle for example; Seeing who the Alder Hay, etc customers were might be a start:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-18050/Body-parts-taken-living-children.htm



Research along these lines might lead somewhere :)

Sorry about jumping in with HDLG, I see now it was rude of me - apologies :o

What if were using his 'mortuary moments' to avail himself of disposal facilities?

dolores1
12-12-2012, 12:17 PM
I guess Jersey could be where the real horrors took place because it's such an elite masonic establishment rich people's playground with fewer of the inconvenient restrictions that the mainland has.



LINK:
http://rosaleen-thewhistler.blogspot.co.uk/2009/10/mother-of-darkness-castle.html



18 October 2009
Mothers of Darkness Castle (1)- Is Madeleine McCann Held Here? part (1)





Chateau des Amérois -
known as
Mothers Of Darkness Castle - place of MKUltra programming of children




Chateau des Faulx les Tombs
http://www.castles.nl/eur/be/fau/fau.html




Chateau Sautou
--

Michel Fourniret


Fourniret is the owner of Chateau Sautou and paedophile,convicted murderer of 20 virgins
from: http://illuminati-bloodlines.blogspot.com/ (label- Mothers of Darkness Castle)


I guess I have an obsession with this castle, it appears that the owner does everything that they can to keep it invisible. Almost every image of it has been removed from the internet, as soon as a good video appears about it on Youtube it is aken down. The images here have been rescued from Google's cache, the view of the castle on Google Maps is interesting, it appears as a nondescript blue blob.
I've discovered through research that the castle is owned by Solvay, the people who provide us with controversial antidepressant, for example Prozac and Paroxetine. Drugs which have been held responsible for the spurge of mass killings being witnessed in schools and universities around the world. Solvay also provide Children's camps across the globe and interestingly in Brussels. Would you trust these people to look after your child?

Look up the Detroux affair A massive pedophile network came to light and was hushed up and 20 key witnesses "Commited Suicide"Belgium Pedophilia Scandal /Did Authorities Cover Up Its Scope?
Barry James, International Herald Tribune , 16/12/1999

BRUSSELS - In Belgium, the X-Files refer not to the U.S. television series but to a series of horrific witness accounts of an alleged pedophile network.
The five women and the male transvestite who testified anonymously in Belgium under the code-name ''X '' described an underworld of snuff movies and sadomasochist torture
that was almost impossible to believe. And they said that politicians and other highly

The images here have been rescued from Google's cache, the view of the castle on Google Maps is interesting (see left), it appears as a nondescript blue blob
+
Chateau des Amérois The castle was owned by Prince Philipp von Saxe-Coburg-Gotha and later by the Solvay family. The Solvay family is one of the leading industrial families of Europe (producer of medicines, plastics, and chemicals like fluor). In their 1996 book, Fritz Springmeier and Cisco Wheeler (very unsure what to think of their information) referred to it as the 'Mothers of Darkness castle'.

Documentation
which indicates that The Solvay family still own the castle.

See following Hunting permit: See original blog as above for documents.R
------------------------
"Bloodlines of the Illuminati"
"p. 205) and his speeches Fritz Springmeier cites a secret castle situated near the village of Muno in Belgium. This castle according to Springmeier, is a center of the occult and has a cathedral with a dome containing 1000 lights. The castle is referred to as the Mothers-of-Darkness castle and Monarch programming is supposedly performed on children there. This castle is also known as the "Castle of Kings". Its real name is "Chateau des Amerois" and it is located in Bouillon (Belgium), near the village of Muno. This castle and its domain, the Muno forest once belonged to Prince Philippe of Saxe-Cobourg-Gotha, Count of Flanders and father of King Albert I. He purchased the property in 1869 to the Marquis van der Noot d'Assche.The castle of Romantic style was built in 1877 for Philippe of Saxe-Cobourg Gotha by the architect Gustave Saintenoy. It has 365 windows. This castle was later bought by Alice Solvay, niece of the Belgian scientist and industrialist Ernest Solvay and today is apparently still owned by the Solvay's.
+

Photo: Prince Philippe of Saxe-Cobourg-Gotha

He was born Prince Ferdinand Philipp Maria August Raphael of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha-Koháry, he was the eldest son of August of Saxe-Coburg-Kohary and Clémentine of Orléans.
-------------------------------------------------
excerpt from Dutroux X Files:
"From personal experience, X2 mentioned having seen Prince Laurent, the brother of Belgium's present crown prince. Laurent apparently was more interested in masturbating at child abuse orgies than taking part in the actual abuse (199).
+


D.

forydalynclwyd
12-12-2012, 12:19 PM
This is extremely interesting, we already know that Clifford, in his video, stated that he gave the papers stories, in exchange for them withholding others.

His comment is more based on the fact that Burrel has no right to confidentiality than categorically denying that he passed information on

""It is an affront to common sense to suggest that Mr Burrell, who has sold stories to the newspapers, made countless appearances on TV and has even written a book about his dealings with the royal family, now feels able to claim that any information he provided was confidential.

"We will defend these claims in court and will be asking the judge at the earliest opportunity to strike out these claims as having no prospect of success and an abuse of process."

He cannot be trusted and his 'protection racket' is finished. Who will trust him now?

Burrell is also very interesting. He was in a really good position to survey the relationship between Savile and Diana. Remember that he secreted some of Diana's possessions and hid them in his loft for 'safe keeping'. He almost came a cropper, until the Queen gave him an 11th hour reprieve 'suddenly' remembering asking Burrell to take care of some of Diana's things. Hmmm.
His flower shop had two arson attacks before he escaped to America. (Possible threats to keep quiet?)

My opinion is that Savile developed a relationship with Diana on behalf of Charles or MI5 and helped with marriage issues in order to circumvent, and be privy to, any actions that she may have been planning to take. I believe he also played the same role with Andrew and Fergie. That knowledge gave him additional power and leverage.

I think that Savile was a complete charlatan masquerading as Jimmy from Leeds as perfect cover when it is clear that we have struggled to piece together much of his first 20 years.

If he was released on the people as some sort of deep cover agent then this would make sense of his ability to mix in any circle of society especially if he was deprogrammed as a child.

Someone said that perhaps he was autistic.This could explain his high IQ but may also explain his inability to develop a personal relationship but at the same time invade peoples personal space.

He comes from an era where children who had disabilities were institutionalised. I know of some one whose sibling was sent to a school for death children in the late 40`s 250 miles from home. The family visited once a year.

It is possible that amongst all the care home and psycho analysis experts that a young Jimmy was seen as different and was sent into the specialist care of a mentor who may have monitored him through his early years.

I`m guessing that such analysts would have been paid by the state to monitor and research the children and unleash them into the world.

This could explain his liking for institutions. Many institutions dealt with mental health on a massive scale.

I am not defending him I just wonder whether he was a product of something that has been linked in a similar way to Laud and Eubank?

dolores1
12-12-2012, 12:21 PM
This is what makes this thread so unbelievably fantastic. What seems like a dead end one minute can allow for some creative thinking to pull in some alternative line of research.

Chateau des Amerois - Mother of Darkness Castle - Red Ice Creations
www.redicecreations.com/article.php?id=359Researcher from Philippines Provides A Look At Satanic Worshipping In Vatican And Castle Of Darkness In Belgium Dan Burisch's flight to Brussels and the "Mother of ...


D.

millers
12-12-2012, 12:29 PM
Do you have a working link to the documentary ?

I have this stored on my computer and would willingly share but would have to be instructed how to do it. :)

dolores1
12-12-2012, 12:31 PM
It's just one kink that these sociopaths indulge in, they have access to these places and love taking major liberties right under our noses. But like you said, the dead can't give any statements, we have some real shockers to come yet I imagine. After seeing spit the dog on here yesterday I am ready for any thing. I wonder if spit has the injunction or Bob?

We should be focusing on the royals and their foot-soldiers in the police force and Vatican city and the entire paedo blackmailed political collection of fucktards pretending to be in charge.. And not forgetting the celebs also, I bet a desire for column inches is at an all time low.. They are all keeping it on the low low I reckon. Hoping it'll all blow over like it did with Diana, But this is the big one..

Confession No. 7: Researcher from Philippines Provides A Look At Satanic Worshipping In Vatican And Castle Of Darkness In Belgium
According to Bobby G. Limeta, who has researched the Jesuits for 16 years, they seem to "have their dirty hands in everything."
4 Jun 2006

By Greg Szymanski



A Brushy Creek Sunday Confession reader said the chain of command in America reads as follows



Bonesman George W. Bush taking orders from his immediate master CFR Dick Cheney, whose master is Bonesman George H. W. Bush, whose master is Edward Cardinal Egan, whose master is Pope Benedict XVI, whose master is Jesuit Superior General Peter-Hans Kolvenbach---whose master is the Devil.



So this takes us without hesitation right to our subject of discussion in this week's Sunday Confession No. 7 -- satanic worshipping in the "House that Lucifer Built," being the controlled House of the Jesuit Order, the Vatican.



A subject many people shun or are frightened to tackle, the veil of suppression is lifted this week since, according to a growing number of researchers, the Jesuit Order is at the helm of the New World Order, attempting as we speak to destroy America's sovereignty and very existence.



As written in the Arctic Beacon based on eye-witness testimony from and Italian victim, the underground tombs and catacombs of the Vatican provide a perfect cover for evil. Here is what one eye witness described:



While Mass is being said in the Sistine Chapel and tourists are being shown the works of Michelangelo, deep within the bowels of the Vatican sits a large, circular room with 13 separate chambers, each leading to a distinct catacomb.



When a mummified body is placed in front of each doorway, a young child is then brutally sacrificed with a long, golden knife during what is said to be a secret induction ceremony for new members of the Illuminati, better known as the New World Order.



Most people can't imagine such a scene and immediately attack the credibility of the eye-witness and the messenger. In this case, the eye-witness who described the above scene in the bowels of the Vatican can no longer be attacked since she jumped or was pushed to death, falling to cobblestones on St. Peter's Square in the early morning hours in the 1980's.



But her memories and story lives on despite her untimely death as this week researcher and historian Bobby G. Limeta, a freedom fighter from the Philippines, provides two attached PDF files concerning the Jesuit Order and satanic rituals in the Vatican, as well as rituals in the Castle of Darkness in Muno, Belgium.



"I humbly wish to attached herewith Acrobat PDF File (security locked-code protected) concerning the Jesuit Order satanic rituals inside the Vatican," said Limeta, adding that the evil hand of the Jesuits are also destroying his country, the Philippines. "You'll be surprised that Roman Catholic hierarchy are practicing satanic rituals inside the Vatican, the late Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XIV (former Cardinal Ratzinger) knew that these satanism is happening inside the Vatican.



"It was revealed by the late Jesuit priest Fr. Malachi Martin. Fr. Martin did not recant anything he wrote in his authored book. I also humbly wish to attached herewith Acrobat PDF File (security locked-code protected) concerning the Jesuit Order's Satanic Rituals inside the Castle of Darkness in Muno, Belgium.



"You'll also surprise that the European Union (EU) members are members of the Illuminati. The Illuminati is a secret society founded by a Jesuit named Adam Weishaupt. The Illuminati is controlled by the Jesuits and the Jesuits are believed to be Illuminati.



"You'll also be surprised that EU is suppressing any information pertaining to Marc Dutroux being associated with the satanic-cult rituals. But the Al-Jazeera News in the Middle East did mention satanism.



Here are the two PDF files provided by Limeta on a taboo subject that is typically suppressed:



JESUIT ORDER - Satanic Ritual Inside Vatican.pdf



JESUIT ORDER - Satanic Ritual Castle Of Darkness.pdf



In an effort to connect the dots in America, Limeta provides the following eye-witness testimony of what is going on behind the scenes in the Philippines, as he presently is seeking entrance into New Zealand for protection against the Jesuits:



"I'm permanently residing in the Philippines and we are thousands of miles away from each other. All I can do, is to provide you authenticated news and up-dates concerning Jesuit operations in the Philippines. God knows as my faithful witness that our country is a Jesuit Republic of the Philippines like Jesuit Republic of South America "Reductions of Paraguay" like that.



"Our government officials and politicians nor military, police, political analysts, elite and rich families and businessmen will quarrel everyday due to political crisis and social agitations and rebellions without seeing the true culprits behind or even the shadows or footprint of the Jesuits.



"Simply, they don't know the real story of the Jesuits. Since 1990 when I become a true Christian, I read the Bible and began seriously looking for the real trouble makers around the world. I started to read world history, buying countless reference books and articles as part of my investment to nourish my spiritual being and mind.



"You'll be surprised my habit every Saturday and Sunday was a continuous 20-hours of reading, analyzing and re-reading for understanding and not for pleasure. For a period of 16-years, I poured my attention, dedication, focus and entire financial resources just to find out the truth. I was stunned and it almost toppled me out of my chair when I finally saw the faces of the Jesuits as being the real problem.



"Throughout 16 years of research, I found whenever events and tragedies occurred, the Jesuits were always there. Soon, I may migrate and live permanently in so called God's territory of New Zealand.



"The New Zealand government already shown their great interest to accept me and live in their country when I was interviewed last year. In fact, the New Zealand immigration personnel told me to leave my country. There, however, I will attack the Jesuits blow by blow."



Greg Szymanski Greg also has his own daily show on the Republic Broadcast Network. Go to www.rbnlive.com Greg Szymanski is an independent investigative journalist and his articles can been seen at www.LewisNews.com. He also writes for American Free Press and has his own site www.arcticbeacon.com

Listen to my Radio Broadcast live Monday night at 8pm Pacific time on LewisNews, returning Jan. 1 2006 Radio http://webs.lewisnews.com/radio/index.html. Greg is also regular on Rense.com the first Thursday of every month at 9-10 pm pacific time.



D

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 12:38 PM
Confession No. 7: Researcher from Philippines Provides A Look At Satanic Worshipping In Vatican And Castle Of Darkness In Belgium
According to Bobby G. Limeta, who has researched the Jesuits for 16 years, they seem to "have their dirty hands in everything."
4 Jun 2006

D

Apologies but how does this fit in with the theories expounded that its the Jews that control everything? not saying its your theory just a general question.

PS also how is it going with the advert fund mechanism? im still up for contributing, so just wonderd how it was going

teddanson
12-12-2012, 12:45 PM
I am finding it quite difficult in keeping up with the saVILE thread...each day takes me an hour or more to catch up on previous posts, so sorry if this comment I'm about to make was from ages ago or already been said..

In my opinion, this unknown person in their 60's from London, I severely doubt it's anybody who is no longer active in showbiz, ie Timmy Mallett, Leslie Grantham.
If it was there'd be no real reason why the identity would be kept secret.
I think it has to be someone very significant in todays media, and if/when the name gets out many people would be majorly shocked. (Well we probably wouldn't!).

I read many posts back, that maybe Max Clifford had not had any involvement in direct abuse, but had knowledge of people involved and had helped covered up abuse....if so my opinion is all theoretical but what if this person in their 60's was someone with knowledge not necessarily an abuser.
My bet would have been Esther Rantzen if she wasn't 72!

dolores1
12-12-2012, 12:53 PM
Apologies but how does this fit in with the theories expounded that its the Jews that control everything? not saying its your theory just a general question.

PS also how is it going with the advert fund mechanism? im still up for contributing, so just wonderd how it was going

Weishupt was a sanyam (spelling?) he became Catholic. - The Jesuits, the Black Pope are a hidden Jewish sect within the church, their founder and most leaders were Jewish. Their oaths Jewish. They always infiltrate!:eek:


I'm still waiting to hear back from the mods for permission on the advert in UK Column and also Brian Gerrish is addressing the questions himself.


D.:)

marf
12-12-2012, 12:56 PM
so we may get more on vile and hdlg

So worth watching either on Iplayer or links. Inside out south west

Funny how the Jersey legal guy well actually I would say involved in cover up guy is rattled by journos questions and tries to wriggle out of why the new enquiry shouldn't reinvestigate cases.

Lenny Harper should get massive obe or whatever is best award for his work.
He knew so much more and wished fir more prosecutions but was 'silenced'.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01p980c/Inside_Out_South_West_10_12_2012/

http://voiceforchildren.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/inside-out-jersey-child-abuse.html

bellahunter
12-12-2012, 01:07 PM
I think that Savile was a complete charlatan masquerading as Jimmy from Leeds as perfect cover when it is clear that we have struggled to piece together much of his first 20 years.

If he was released on the people as some sort of deep cover agent then this would make sense of his ability to mix in any circle of society especially if he was deprogrammed as a child.

Someone said that perhaps he was autistic.This could explain his high IQ but may also explain his inability to develop a personal relationship but at the same time invade peoples personal space.

He comes from an era where children who had disabilities were institutionalised. I know of some one whose sibling was sent to a school for death children in the late 40`s 250 miles from home. The family visited once a year.

It is possible that amongst all the care home and psycho analysis experts that a young Jimmy was seen as different and was sent into the specialist care of a mentor who may have monitored him through his early years.

I`m guessing that such analysts would have been paid by the state to monitor and research the children and unleash them into the world.

This could explain his liking for institutions. Many institutions dealt with mental health on a massive scale.

I am not defending him I just wonder whether he was a product of something that has been linked in a similar way to Laud and Eubank?

Don't forget the severe head injury and the coma he was in for 3 months. Who knows what damage that did especially at a time when the brain was just developing

tameelf
12-12-2012, 01:18 PM
Don't forget the severe head injury and the coma he was in for 3 months. Who knows what damage that did especially at a time when the brain was just developing

but theres nothing documented in mining website re his acident

i spent all sunday trying to find were savile was taught simply to find classmates and continue links i got nowhere any hints?

teddanson
12-12-2012, 01:20 PM
Would agree.

I was burgled many years ago - none of the obvious taken just some collectables so the insurance claim was small. The burglars knew what they wanted and where it was (the house was on the market at the time so giving ample opportunity for a nose about).

The first copper round was OK, but 2 detectives visited me twice and I had the distinct impression it was me they were interested in and not the burglar who they dismissed as an opportunist thief.

Be very careful when dealing with the police!

Indeed....when I was 17 I was physically attacked in the street late one night with my partner at the time. We both got a bit of a beating, and it was an attempted robbery.
Two of the three guys were actually beating us, the third I recognised from school, he was trying to stop them.
I told the police that and we had to attend an ID parade, I identified but my partner (who got the more severe beating) couldn't, and as the guy hadn't actually committed a crime, and denied even being there, was let off.
Months later, my partner phoned me to say CID had been in touch with him to say they received an anonymous phone call that we had started the initial argument in a nightclub the week before, and this was revenge for that.
A complete lie!
Then I got the phone call, and I told CID straight that the nightclub story was untrue, I didn't frequent clubs at that age, and I wasn't even in the country the week before the attack.
The CID lady, turned it on me and said she never said anything to me about a nightclub...I said no, but my partner had just called me to tell me what had been told to him!
We were the victims in a violent attempted robbery, and CID made me feel like we were lying and we had caused the attack - which even if the nightclub story were true, it didn't warrant a violent assault.
I have had little faith in the police treating victims since then.

tameelf
12-12-2012, 01:22 PM
BBC News - Jersey torchbearer Ralph Mauger, 77, guilty of child abuse http://bbc.in/U4FkSv

A Jersey man who was chosen to carry the Olympic torch has been convicted of indecently assaulting young girls.

Former Centenier Ralph Mauger, 77, from Grouville, was charged with seven counts of indecent assault and one of inciting an act of gross indecency.

But at the Royal Court, he was convicted of five counts of indecent assault, cleared of two further counts and the gross indecency charge.

He was remanded in custody and is due to be sentenced on 16 January.

Mauger had been chosen as an Olympic torch bearer in Jersey but pulled out following the charges being laid in March.

The offences related to three girls, and were carried across and an eight-year period, between 1998 and 2006.

The court was told one victim was six when Mauger started abusing her, and was subjected to attacks over a three-year period.

During the trial at Jersey's Royal Court, which lasted more than a week, the court heard evidence from the three victims via video link and in person.

Centeniers are senior members of the honorary police force. They are the only officers in Jersey able to charge and bail offenders

shanticat
12-12-2012, 01:24 PM
Admin Note

A few posts have been removed....
So just a reminder that there are currently 2 threads in today's news discussing Jacintha Saldanha.
Please post your comments on one or both of those.

Thanks

trafficker
12-12-2012, 01:25 PM
What if were using his 'mortuary moments' to avail himself of disposal facilities?

yeah I mentioned this last night, and left me thinking of the father from the movie LET THE RIGHT ONE IN (Swedish version is best). who went about collecting blood for his vampire child......wont spoil the plot.....but just say savile procured the blood from the mortuary for satanic blood drinking?


The drinking of blood, either human or animal is consistently part of the ritual abuse survivors disclosures (Pictures #1,3,5,8,9, and 10). According to the victims, the Satanists believe that the life force of the sacrificial victim is in the blood. Partaking of the blood is believed to empower and add longevity of life. Child victims have related accounts of how the cult members would always drain and save the blood of their victims in apple juice jars, pans, bottles, and pots.

The very young children are sometimes introduced to the taste of blood gradually by mixing it with milk, formula, punch, and other beverages. Eventually, with increases in blood content in these drinks, the child victim will be able to drink the blood without dilution. Pictures #9,12,16,20, and 23 show body parts removed to be used in a ritual, including the drinking of blood. Picture #10 illustrates 'blood punch' made from the blood of a sacrificed child. The child victim titled this picture "Birthday Colt [Cult] Celebration". The trauma to child victims, resulting from this type of forced participation in satanic rituals such as these is immeasurable.

Al Bielek told us that in order to maintain a human form, purebred reptilians need to regularly drink human blood.

Satanism and Luciferianism and other similar cults are blood cults that require blood to be sacrificed to pull in certain demons. For instance, blood may be taken from both the tongue and the genital area and mixed in a certain ceremony to invoke a particular demon.

The Bloody Passovers of Dr Toaff By Israel Shamir this Trento crime was not an exception: Toaff discovered many cases of such bloody sacrifices connected with the mutilation of children, outpouring of blood and its baking in Matzo (unleavened bread) spanning five hundred years of European history. Blood, this magic drink, was a popular medicine of the time, and of any time: Herod tried to keep young bathing in blood of babies, alchemists used blood to turn lead into gold. Jewish wizards meddled in magic and used it as much as anybody.

There was a thriving market in such delicacies as blood, powder made of blood and bloody matzo.

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 01:44 PM
Would agree.

I was burgled many years ago - none of the obvious taken just some collectables so the insurance claim was small. The burglars knew what they wanted and where it was (the house was on the market at the time so giving ample opportunity for a nose about).

The first copper round was OK, but 2 detectives visited me twice and I had the distinct impression it was me they were interested in and not the burglar who they dismissed as an opportunist thief.

Be very careful when dealing with the police!

Indeed....when I was 17 I was physically attacked in the street late one night with my partner at the time. We both got a bit of a beating, and it was an attempted robbery.
Two of the three guys were actually beating us, the third I recognised from school, he was trying to stop them.
I told the police that and we had to attend an ID parade, I identified but my partner (who got the more severe beating) couldn't, and as the guy hadn't actually committed a crime, and denied even being there, was let off.
Months later, my partner phoned me to say CID had been in touch with him to say they received an anonymous phone call that we had started the initial argument in a nightclub the week before, and this was revenge for that.
A complete lie!
Then I got the phone call, and I told CID straight that the nightclub story was untrue, I didn't frequent clubs at that age, and I wasn't even in the country the week before the attack.
The CID lady, turned it on me and said she never said anything to me about a nightclub...I said no, but my partner had just called me to tell me what had been told to him!
We were the victims in a violent attempted robbery, and CID made me feel like we were lying and we had caused the attack - which even if the nightclub story were true, it didn't warrant a violent assault.
I have had little faith in the police treating victims since then.

I know this goes slightly off topic, and I was the one who started telling stories of encounters with the police, but it's interesting when you actually speak to people who've had negative experiences when dealing with them. I've spoken to many before now and there's some common themes/tactics. As I said in a previous post, I'm in no doubt that the onus is more and more on the victim nowadays.

Now think of just how much harder it is for sex abuse victims to pluck up the courage, speak up and follow it through all the way. If it's allowed to go all the way that is. That's why I get angry when I hear people say things like "why did it take 30 years to come forward"?

voodoo8
12-12-2012, 01:47 PM
this story is code. more dots presented for connection.

2xJS. 1 alive . 1 dead. 1 fake. 1 real.

is the real savile still alive?


dots so far in the hanging nurse story:
- DJ's.
- royal baby.
- edward vii.
- agnes.
- Jacintha Saldanha - JS - The Doctor.
- Jimmy Savile - JS - The Fixer.
- the fool (or he who plays it).
- Tom Watson MP who brought to the attention of the nation the possibility of an organised history of paedophelia within government, gives a talk about his book Dial M for Murdoch in Sheffield on Thursday 6th December at King Edward VII Upper School, Main Hall.
- cigars (king edward)
- 2 x JS. 1 fake. 1 real.

Don't forget
- The arrest of Max Clifford (same day) - Which leads to Burrell and the royal familiy
- Leveson in Australia promoting his agenda

michaelulterra
12-12-2012, 01:50 PM
Admin Note

A few posts have been removed....
So just a reminder that there are currently 2 threads in today's news discussing Jacintha Saldanha.
Please post your comments on one or both of those.

Thanks

Thanks shanticat.

ceej
12-12-2012, 01:51 PM
I am finding it quite difficult in keeping up with the saVILE thread...each day takes me an hour or more to catch up on previous posts, so sorry if this comment I'm about to make was from ages ago or already been said..

In my opinion, this unknown person in their 60's from London, I severely doubt it's anybody who is no longer active in showbiz, ie Timmy Mallett, Leslie Grantham.
If it was there'd be no real reason why the identity would be kept secret.
I think it has to be someone very significant in todays media, and if/when the name gets out many people would be majorly shocked. (Well we probably wouldn't!).

I read many posts back, that maybe Max Clifford had not had any involvement in direct abuse, but had knowledge of people involved and had helped covered up abuse....if so my opinion is all theoretical but what if this person in their 60's was someone with knowledge not necessarily an abuser.
My bet would have been Esther Rantzen if she wasn't 72!

I'll go along with this. Very stringent lockdown on all info. Wonder who would have the clout to compel that. To my mind, MC may have little to do with this latest. People with knowledge don't get usually get arrested or interviewed under caution. They get asked to help with police inquiries.:cool:

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 01:55 PM
Just following that through, if he were to be obtaining body parts, three things spring to mind;

1. He wouldn't be doing it for free - therefore money or favour involved.
2. Drug companies would be the likely recipients - and therefore maybe a trail?
3. Working backwards, speculation on likely research companies might be an angle for example; Seeing who the Alder Hay, etc customers were might be a start:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-18050/Body-parts-taken-living-children.htm



Research along these lines might lead somewhere :)

Sorry about jumping in with HDLG, I see now it was rude of me - apologies :o

Absolutely no need to apologise, not to me anyway. As it says below:

This is what makes this thread so unbelievably fantastic. What seems like a dead end one minute can allow for some creative thinking to pull in some alternative line of research.

Too right. Sharing of minds and all that, if we didn't question, interrupt and challenge eachother then we'd get nowhere.

Coco - the 3 points you make:

1. He wouldn't be doing it for free - therefore money or favour involved.
2. Drug companies would be the likely recipients - and therefore maybe a trail?
3. Working backwards, speculation on likely research companies might be an angle for example; Seeing who the Alder Hay, etc customers were might be a start:


That's why I said before the only realistic chance of proving any of the necro stuff is if it went beyond that - there would have to be someone being supplied if it was body parts etc. I can't get Alder Hey out my mind now. Anyone know who was involved with AH? Senior staff, Directors, trustees, fundraisers? Might be a start.

trafficker
12-12-2012, 02:00 PM
" Its not what you have done for this country, but what you have done for Israel"

Just imagine all the intelligence Jimmy supplied to mossad, no wonder the UK abstain on votes.....scared that pics of them abusing children will come to light?

mossad have dirt on our politicians because of savile.

Jimmy Savile received a medal from Israel in 1979, for services rendered. Reportedly, Savile visited Israel in 1975 to advise Israel's President Ephraim Katzir on a matter of security.

Reportedly, Savile visited Israel a number of times to offer his advice.

Savile claimed during an interview with The Guardian newspaper that he told Professor Katzir: "I’m very disappointed because you’ve all forgotten how to be Jewish and that’s why everyone is taking you to the cleaners … You won the Six Day War, you took all that land, you gave it all back, including the only oil well in the area, and now you’re paying the Egyptians for the oil you already had."

Savile also maintained that the president invited him to repeat his words at a Cabinet meeting. "They asked my opinion about a couple of things, to which I said, ‘Nothing’s impossible’. They did exactly what I suggested and it worked out 100 per cent successful."

The occasion was confirmed partly by Roger Ordish, producer of Jim'll Fix It, who said: "I know he met the President when we were in Israel in 1975."

maybe because of the dirt savile supplied to Israel, it was inevitable that we fought in Iraq and Afganistan?

ceej
12-12-2012, 02:04 PM
I know this goes slightly off topic, and I was the one who started telling stories of encounters with the police, but it's interesting when you actually speak to people who've had negative experiences when dealing with them. I've spoken to many before now and there's some common themes/tactics. As I said in a previous post, I'm in no doubt that the onus is more and more on the victim nowadays.

Now think of just how much harder it is for sex abuse victims to pluck up the courage, speak up and follow it through all the way. If it's allowed to go all the way that is. That's why I get angry when I hear people say things like "why did it take 30 years to come forward"?

Yes, totally agree - as a victim of crime I recognise everyone's experience as very similar.

Police can be very intimidating, callous, very quick to find anything, any tiny scrap, to flip victims into offenders. It's one way of reducing crime whilst scoring more hits I suppose.

I've often wondered if they treat perps like they do anxious or vulnerable victims of crime.

In our case, they referred the nasty piece of shit, a decades long repeat offender, to social services and protected them all along the way. :eek:

By law, offenders have clear legal rights. Victims have no such statutory rights.

thentherewere4
12-12-2012, 02:07 PM
"Lockdown on info.."

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/9821/princevideosfreemasons.jpg

"Sometimes info is a one way street."

borsabil
12-12-2012, 02:12 PM
Who was the 'man in his sixties, from London' who was arrested a couple of days ago?

Ever since crickets......and soon after an announcement from operation Yewtree that the investigation into Savile had been concluded......after a whole eight weeks!

Who was that guy? Why won't the media name him? Super injunctions can't be applied to people who have been arrested, why the secrecy? Did the cops go a bit too high in the food chain, and were they shut down as a result? If anyone knows who the alleged nonce was it's time to speak up.

chuggy
12-12-2012, 02:12 PM
If anyone is expecting the police to tell the truth please think again!

The police lied for 30 years about the Hillsboro' footy disaster
they lie all the time to protect the peados in power, their mason friends.

Along with Hillsboro' remember any of these, Shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes, Stephen Lawrence, Phone hacking, etc, etc, etc,
Checkout Met commissioners many have resigned due to lies/scandals/cover ups.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commissioner_of_Police_of_the_Metropolis#List_of_C ommissioners

Do you honestly believe the current Met commissioner is likely to be any different?

All Yewtree was ever gonna be was a damage limitation excercise!

Well done to the mods for keeping this thread on track.

"They hide it plain sight for everyone to see, but no one takes notice if it's not on their TV"

goodness
12-12-2012, 02:13 PM
Back to the Savile / Prince Charles connection. That time Prince Charles visited Savile at his home, looked to be a photo op for a newspaper article. Was that a local news item? Has anyone come forward as one of the three women or someone someone who knew them?

Was this discussed locally? I would think so. It would have been a big deal for 3 local women to be chosen for this "honor".

It would be interesting to hear their version of the event.

Any other links out there to this occasion?

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 02:17 PM
Two star suspects added to Savile list

A FORMER detective who helped expose Jimmy Savile’s sex abuse has been told the names of two more celebs linked to the police probe.

Mark Williams-Thomas claimed the identity of the “household names” had been revealed to him in the last 48 hours.

And the pair could now be quizzed by Operation Yewtree cops.

The ex-Surrey officer — who worked on a TV documentary about BBC pervert Savile — tweeted: “Told about 2 new ones today”, adding that they were “well known”.

It is believed at least 25 celebs have been reported to cops. Savile died last year aged 84.

A man in his 60s was arrested on Monday.

Comic Freddie Starr, 69, PR guru Max Clifford, 69, and DJ Dave Lee Travis, 67, have all been arrested and deny any wrongdoing. Gary Glitter, 68, was also arrested.

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4693468/Two-star-household-name-suspects-added-to-Jimmy-Savile-list.html#ixzz2EqL1E4kl

Anyone else find this odd, them using a pic of MC with this story??? Could they be trying to tell us something?? :confused:

trafficker
12-12-2012, 02:17 PM
this story is code. more dots presented for connection.

2xJS. 1 alive . 1 dead. 1 fake. 1 real.

is the real savile still alive?


dots so far in the hanging nurse story:
- DJ's.
- royal baby.
- edward vii.
- agnes.
- Jacintha Saldanha - JS - The Doctor.
- Jimmy Savile - JS - The Fixer.
- the fool (or he who plays it).
- Tom Watson MP who brought to the attention of the nation the possibility of an organised history of paedophelia within government, gives a talk about his book Dial M for Murdoch in Sheffield on Thursday 6th December at King Edward VII Upper School, Main Hall.
- cigars (king edward)
- 2 x JS. 1 fake. 1 real.


THE SAVILE CODE......................

They are trying to get hold of the middle east....since 9/11, this from the muslim quran

Then Ya'jooj and Majooj will emerge and surge forth in all their fury. When those from among them who constitute the former part of their army pass the lake of Tiberias (which is in northern Palestine), they will drink up all the water of that lake and by the time those that constitute the latter part of that same army pass the lake, they will say, "There used to be water here (long ago). When they reach the Mount of Khamr in Jerusalem, they will arrogantly proclaim: 'We have conquered the people of the earth, now we will annihilate those in the sky.' So saying they will fire their arrows towards the sky. When the arrows return to the ground they will be blood stained.

Ya'jooj and Majooj are human beings and according to a narration they are from the progeny of Yafith ibn Nooh alayhis salaam.

IRAQ and SYRIA

GENOCIDE
A man from Abu Sufyaan’s progeny massacres descendents of Rasulullah sallallahu alayhi wasallam and rules over Syria and Egypt.

Abu Nadhrah says: "We were sitting in the company of Jabir bin Abdullah (R.A.) when he said: 'Soon the people of IRAQ will neither receive any food (grain) nor any money.'" We asked, "Why would such a thing happen?" He replied, "Because of the non-Arabs." (i.e they will prevent food from going into Iraq, in the form of "sanctions" to this day.) He then said: "Soon the people of Shaam (SYRIA) will neither receive any money nor grain." We asked as to why this would happen. He replied: "Because of the Romans (christians)."

In 1977, Israel’s Prime Minister Menachem Begin had a meeting with Egyptian president Anwar Sadat.

This led to 'peace' between the two countries.

Sir Jimmy Savile received a medal from Israel in 1979, for services rendered.

Reportedly, Savile visited Israel in 1975 to advise Israel's President Ephraim Katzir on a matter of security.

Reportedly, Savile told the Israeli cabinet that he "was very disappointed: the Israelis had won the Six Day War but they had given back all the land, including the only oil well in the region, and were now paying the Egyptians more for oil than if they had bought it from Saudi Arabia."

trafficker
12-12-2012, 02:28 PM
Who was the 'man in his sixties, from London' who was arrested a couple of days ago?

Ever since crickets......and soon after an announcement from operation Yewtree that the investigation into Savile had been concluded......after a whole eight weeks!

Who was that guy? Why won't the media name him? Super injunctions can't be applied to people who have been arrested, why the secrecy? Did the cops go a bit too high in the food chain, and were they shut down as a result? If anyone knows who the alleged nonce was it's time to speak up.

Jon Bird told The Sun: 'One woman... says there were at least three members of backstage staff at Top of the Pops who used to take young girls to parties, where horrific and inappropriate things took place."

http://aangirfan.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/jimmy-savile-horace-mann-roy-cohn-cia.html

marf
12-12-2012, 02:29 PM
"Lockdown on info.."

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/9821/princevideosfreemasons.jpg

"Sometimes info is a one way street."

Tony Prince suggests on this obituary that vile should have been Prime Minister. He also saw him recently so was he in the majick Friday group too or whoever recognises those funeral hand signals.

Watch if you haven't seen before Prince on Vile-
http://youtu.be/ozbZ5JTLKcQ

ceej
12-12-2012, 02:29 PM
Two star suspects added to Savile list

A FORMER detective who helped expose Jimmy Savile’s sex abuse has been told the names of two more celebs linked to the police probe.

Mark Williams-Thomas claimed the identity of the “household names” had been revealed to him in the last 48 hours.

And the pair could now be quizzed by Operation Yewtree cops.

The ex-Surrey officer — who worked on a TV documentary about BBC pervert Savile — tweeted: “Told about 2 new ones today”, adding that they were “well known”.

It is believed at least 25 celebs have been reported to cops. Savile died last year aged 84.

A man in his 60s was arrested on Monday.

Comic Freddie Starr, 69, PR guru Max Clifford, 69, and DJ Dave Lee Travis, 67, have all been arrested and deny any wrongdoing. Gary Glitter, 68, was also arrested.

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4693468/Two-star-household-name-suspects-added-to-Jimmy-Savile-list.html#ixzz2EqL1E4kl

Anyone else find this odd, them using a pic of MC with this story??? Could they be trying to tell us something?? :confused:

Yep, luv evreone, I find this all strange. I'm getting a bit dubious about MWT's involvement TBH. Sometimes feels like he's muddying the waters. Playing a game.

goodness
12-12-2012, 02:37 PM
Two star suspects added to Savile list

A FORMER detective who helped expose Jimmy Savile’s sex abuse has been told the names of two more celebs linked to the police probe.

Mark Williams-Thomas claimed the identity of the “household names” had been revealed to him in the last 48 hours.

And the pair could now be quizzed by Operation Yewtree cops.

The ex-Surrey officer — who worked on a TV documentary about BBC pervert Savile — tweeted: “Told about 2 new ones today”, adding that they were “well known”.

It is believed at least 25 celebs have been reported to cops. Savile died last year aged 84.

A man in his 60s was arrested on Monday.

Comic Freddie Starr, 69, PR guru Max Clifford, 69, and DJ Dave Lee Travis, 67, have all been arrested and deny any wrongdoing. Gary Glitter, 68, was also arrested.

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4693468/Two-star-household-name-suspects-added-to-Jimmy-Savile-list.html#ixzz2EqL1E4kl

Anyone else find this odd, them using a pic of MC with this story??? Could they be trying to tell us something?? :confused:

In the link above there is an article in the side column about Simon Cowell and his girlfriend. Interesting to note what articles are being pushed on the public right now.

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 02:39 PM
Where's gojam? I liked his input.

goodness
12-12-2012, 02:40 PM
In the link above there is an article in the side column about Simon Cowell and his girlfriend. Interesting to note what articles are being pushed on the public right now.

Also interesting, is that of all the "journalists" in the UK, only Mark Williams-Thomas is being fed timely info on these cases. Who is feeding him & only him, and why?

anders7777
12-12-2012, 02:42 PM
"The Jersey home is the place to crack."

lol
fucking domestos city
saviles dead, HDLG is as clean as the duchess' womb

The only thing not tried yet is a fire - evidence will be very hard to come by and will entail a lot of dismantling and digging and sifting. Besides, LE fuckface said at 22:45 there would be no digging allowed...

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 02:46 PM
Yep, luv evreone, I find this all strange. I'm getting a bit dubious about MWT's involvement TBH. Sometimes feels like he's muddying the waters. Playing a game.

Or heavily pressured. He's not in an enviable position is he?

I'm still convinced that the Savile documents that were laid out in his PA's garage were some kind of prop. Bait to lure someone into contacting her. Someone worried.

marf
12-12-2012, 02:47 PM
I just watched the Theroux Clifford documentary and it seems the whole programme was Clifford trying to create stories about Theroux or Cowell. A theme throughout seemed to be about creating a story or perhaps an illusion about Cowells relationship status and creating pictures such as in Cliffords words speaking to Cowell 'well you get some pictures in the office we just need head and shoulders some pictures across the road and renos and probably be a picture of the the two of you walking down the street its just so ive got pictures so it will show background to the story im going to put out.'
The story did come out in the News of the World Georgina Laws story and in cliffords words later 'ive orchestated the whole thing'

Later in the programme near the end Clifford arranges journalists to be present in his Sainsburys to Louis surprise.
Clifford 'I've been keeping an eye on you'
Caught on radio mic Guardian journalist 'do you think we should level with him'
Clifford 'no no I will never hear the last of it' followed by advice to the journalist on what story to create.
when Louis confronts Max about all of this Max swears and storms off in Sainsburys and at the end says tellingly to the producer 'bye bye .... keep up the good work'

Anyway sounds like Max and vile both were pr gurus and knew how to create illusions.
I suspect that Max was a real match for plods questioning.
Max's prowness is stopping unwanted (by his client) information, coming out by as he puts it 'having a quiet word' or manipulating the media; tv, press or Internet.

Vile did very similar in manipulating the media and hence what people knew.
What we still need to discover and probably never will is what were all the true stories.

Images of Cowell that Max might not want coming out or even Mountbatten/Battenberg that Vile might not want compared.
http://imageshack.us/a/img515/2373/imagecqa.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/515/imagecqa.jpg/)
http://imageshack.us/a/img547/5254/imagemos.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/547/imagemos.jpg/)
http://imageshack.us/a/img837/4954/imagepsz.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/837/imagepsz.jpg/)

Does MB look like he has similar facial features? Does Cowell look happy?

ceej
12-12-2012, 02:48 PM
Who was the 'man in his sixties, from London' who was arrested a couple of days ago?

Ever since crickets......and soon after an announcement from operation Yewtree that the investigation into Savile had been concluded......after a whole eight weeks!

Who was that guy? Why won't the media name him? Super injunctions can't be applied to people who have been arrested, why the secrecy? Did the cops go a bit too high in the food chain, and were they shut down as a result? If anyone knows who the alleged nonce was it's time to speak up.

...and bring down the wrath of the gods on oneself?! :D

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 02:48 PM
For a while something was bugging me about the Savile story. Very early on in the thread someone provided a link to someone claiming the original story in the news was fake.
The blogger who claims this goes by the name of annaracoon and claims she was at dunscroft at the time this abuse was meant to of occured
She claimed amongst many things
She never saw Savile there at that time
that Miss Jones ( the head) was most probably more interested in women than men
and that some of the names coming forward saying they were abused at that time were not there ( she was quite firm on that)
She claims that she spoke to friends in the media and Times, but they did not want to hear her story as soon as she mentions the above

http://www.annaraccoon.com/annas-personal-stuff/past-lives-and-present-misgivings-part-eight/

Now I dont know who this blogger is maybe some more internet savy people here might know a bit or her reputation. Some of her other postings seem to be about how the powers that be are trying to control the media and internet, especially twitter and bloggers.

But here is where my thinking is going.
Yes Savile is everything this thread has uncovered about him.
But with all his connections and influence how did the story break. Yes he was dead but it opened a pandors box bringing to the limelight people and rings who until now operated in the background - The politicians, the care home cover ups, Royalty. Too many people in power had a lot to loose if the story broke.
Now if this anna racoons story has truth then the story that broke and ignighted the touchpaper was largley fake. Why?
If it is true and it was fake, how come no one in the MSM highlighted it.. fear of Leveson and this coming out adding to it? BBC already tarnished due to Savile and expose's being canned etc?
Since that story we have had the Schofield, Meesham, McAlpine, various names dropped into the internet -- all inviting speculation, and recriminations where the BBC head leaves ( with a good pay off) and commentators talking about the unregulated internet.
We got the Leverson enquiry looking into the Printed media with a conclusion of state regulation.
Then we got the radio hoax call and the dead nurse ( or as the case may be not dead)
Then recently we got hints of celebs being arrested , yet no names given... yet again inviting speculation on the net.

Im wondering if some of what we are seeing is a carefully crafted play with the inevitable being tighter control over the media and particulary the internet.
Not saying any of the scandals, abuse or people we are uncovering is not real, but its a conduit to the bigger game and that is control over the media and the internet especially the alternative sources of news from places such as here or blogs.
Just a theory, one that im not totally sure of if im honest but to me there is some logic to it.

Racoon is an agent. She turns up every-time there is a contentious story, Maddie, Hollie, Savile etc. She claims she was at Duncroft. If she was, it wasn't at the same time as JS. She claims to have ''outed'' one lady who claims she was abused by JS (Bebe Roberts), saying she was there at the time and JS hadn't been there then, this is in the late 60s, before JS was a regular in the 70s.

She and a team of helpers tried to discredit the Duncroft story and failed. One in particular claims she was still in very close contact with Miss Jones, they were defending her name to no end.

I don't think the story is/was faked, but i think some elements were sketchy/misleading, there has been a few lies told, but that doesn't nullify or prove anything beyond that.

The story was definitely ''let out'' for whatever reason. As the original JS Newsnight story set the ball rolling. That was then reported in the MSM and would have been brought back at sometime regardless, as the info was out the bottle by that point. Anybody claiming MWT/ITV broke the story has not thought about why the BBC made the investigation in the first place. Either they wanted this out (for nefarious means), or someone in the Beeb wanted this out to shine a light on it (thus TPTB had to come up with a reason for the story and a story-line they could benefit from).

Either way, they are going to use it for their own aims like they always do.

http://parker-joseph.com/pjcjournal/2011/04/16/anna-raccoon-taken-at-face-value/

http://holliedemandsjustice.org/content/anna-raccoon-she-working-paedophile-rings-within-government/

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 02:49 PM
......LE fuckface said at 22:45 there would be no digging allowed.....

This guy made my blood boil.

And the public wonder why victims didn't come forward? Sigh.

margery_bruce
12-12-2012, 02:50 PM
Vendetta ‏@jack_frost2030
BBC now admits al qaeda never existed http://fb.me/20uUIYkbF
Retweeted by paul
Hide media Reply Retweet Favorite More

BBC now admits al qaeda never existed
* Al Qaeda is a creation of the CIA. It is simply a database of names of jihadists who were trained to fight against the Russians during the Afghan-Soviet co...

YouTube @YouTube · Follow
2
RETWEETS
5:30 AM - 12 Dec 12 · Details Flag media
Tweet textImage will appear as a link

anders7777
12-12-2012, 02:50 PM
Also interesting, is that of all the "journalists" in the UK, only Mark Williams-Thomas is being fed timely info on these cases. Who is feeding him & only him, and why?

Yes I have alerts set up for VILE

ALMOST EVERY ONE I GET US ABOUT A WHISPERED NEW ARREST TWEETED BY MWT

SUSS OR WHAT?

Ex child nonce cop?

Alleged by Spivey to be a mason - can anyone confirm?

If he's a mason he's breaking his initiation oath by tweeting anything at all about yewtree, as it is crawling with triremes of crooked Masonic trousering troughing toewipes...

chuggy
12-12-2012, 02:53 PM
" Its not what you have done for this country, but what you have done for Israel"

Just imagine all the intelligence Jimmy supplied to mossad, no wonder the UK abstain on votes.....scared that pics of them abusing children will come to light?

mossad have dirt on our politicians because of savile.

Jimmy Savile received a medal from Israel in 1979, for services rendered. Reportedly, Savile visited Israel in 1975 to advise Israel's President Ephraim Katzir on a matter of security.

Reportedly, Savile visited Israel a number of times to offer his advice.

Savile claimed during an interview with The Guardian newspaper that he told Professor Katzir: "I’m very disappointed because you’ve all forgotten how to be Jewish and that’s why everyone is taking you to the cleaners … You won the Six Day War, you took all that land, you gave it all back, including the only oil well in the area, and now you’re paying the Egyptians for the oil you already had."

Savile also maintained that the president invited him to repeat his words at a Cabinet meeting. "They asked my opinion about a couple of things, to which I said, ‘Nothing’s impossible’. They did exactly what I suggested and it worked out 100 per cent successful."

The occasion was confirmed partly by Roger Ordish, producer of Jim'll Fix It, who said: "I know he met the President when we were in Israel in 1975."

maybe because of the dirt savile supplied to Israel, it was inevitable that we fought in Iraq and Afganistan?


Was probably a 'Friend of Israel' just like Cameron and most of the MP's in this country

http://www2.cfoi.co.uk/ conservative friends

http://www.lfi.org.uk/ labour friends

http://ldfi.org.uk/ lib dem friends

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 02:53 PM
Vendetta ‏@jack_frost2030
BBC now admits al qaeda never existed http://fb.me/20uUIYkbF
Retweeted by paul
Hide media Reply Retweet Favorite More

BBC now admits al qaeda never existed
* Al Qaeda is a creation of the CIA. It is simply a database of names of jihadists who were trained to fight against the Russians during the Afghan-Soviet co...

YouTube @YouTube · Follow
2
RETWEETS
5:30 AM - 12 Dec 12 · Details Flag media
Tweet textImage will appear as a link

That is a clip of a relatively old Adam Curtis film. Power of Nightmares I think.

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 02:55 PM
In the link above there is an article in the side column about Simon Cowell and his girlfriend. Interesting to note what articles are being pushed on the public right now.

Yup, i noticed.

Headline:
SIMON IS TRUE TO FORM......

They're telling us straight

Maybe the wrong word to use :D

anders7777
12-12-2012, 02:59 PM
"Lockdown on info.."

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/9821/princevideosfreemasons.jpg

"Sometimes info is a one way street."

"Black is the new purple..." :eek:

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:11 PM
On Twatter:

https://twitter.com/afneil/status/278582932749303808

18 hours ago...

Andrew Neil ‏@afneil
Have now tracked down my Channel 4 interview with J Savile i. 1995. Trying to get permission to post. Revealing


Permission to post? Not a Twatter user but is that how it works, you need "permission" to post something about a dead paedophile? FFS!

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 03:15 PM
Also interesting, is that of all the "journalists" in the UK, only Mark Williams-Thomas is being fed timely info on these cases. Who is feeding him & only him, and why?

Good point, suppose time will tell if he really is genuine

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 03:16 PM
On Twatter:

https://twitter.com/afneil/status/278582932749303808

18 hours ago...

Andrew Neil ‏@afneil
Have now tracked down my Channel 4 interview with J Savile i. 1995. Trying to get permission to post. Revealing


Permission to post? Not a Twatter user but is that how it works, you need "permission" to post something about a dead paedophile? FFS!

If Channel 4 own the rights then it's only normal. Looking forward to seeing it though.

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:19 PM
If Channel 4 own the rights then it's only normal. Looking forward to seeing it though.

That I understand but what's stopping him making a comment? No breach of rights by saying something like "Let me tell you some things about the time I interviewed Savile..."? CH4 would only own the rights to the footage.

dolores1
12-12-2012, 03:22 PM
yeah I mentioned this last night, and left me thinking of the father from the movie LET THE RIGHT ONE IN (Swedish version is best). who went about collecting blood for his vampire child......wont spoil the plot.....but just say savile procured the blood from the mortuary for satanic blood drinking?


The drinking of blood, either human or animal is consistently part of the ritual abuse survivors disclosures (Pictures #1,3,5,8,9, and 10). According to the victims, the Satanists believe that the life force of the sacrificial victim is in the blood. Partaking of the blood is believed to empower and add longevity of life. Child victims have related accounts of how the cult members would always drain and save the blood of their victims in apple juice jars, pans, bottles, and pots.

The very young children are sometimes introduced to the taste of blood gradually by mixing it with milk, formula, punch, and other beverages. Eventually, with increases in blood content in these drinks, the child victim will be able to drink the blood without dilution. Pictures #9,12,16,20, and 23 show body parts removed to be used in a ritual, including the drinking of blood. Picture #10 illustrates 'blood punch' made from the blood of a sacrificed child. The child victim titled this picture "Birthday Colt [Cult] Celebration". The trauma to child victims, resulting from this type of forced participation in satanic rituals such as these is immeasurable.

Al Bielek told us that in order to maintain a human form, purebred reptilians need to regularly drink human blood.

Satanism and Luciferianism and other similar cults are blood cults that require blood to be sacrificed to pull in certain demons. For instance, blood may be taken from both the tongue and the genital area and mixed in a certain ceremony to invoke a particular demon.

The Bloody Passovers of Dr Toaff By Israel Shamir this Trento crime was not an exception: Toaff discovered many cases of such bloody sacrifices connected with the mutilation of children, outpouring of blood and its baking in Matzo (unleavened bread) spanning five hundred years of European history. Blood, this magic drink, was a popular medicine of the time, and of any time: Herod tried to keep young bathing in blood of babies, alchemists used blood to turn lead into gold. Jewish wizards meddled in magic and used it as much as anybody.

There was a thriving market in such delicacies as blood, powder made of blood and bloody matzo.

Check out this please.

The Bloody Passovers of Dr Toaff
By Israel Shamir

The Bloody Passovers of Dr Toaff
www.israelshamir.net/English/Eng11.htmThe Bloody Passovers of Dr Toaff. By Israel Shamir . Blood, betrayal, torture, and surrender are intervowen in the story of an Italian Jew, Dr Ariel Toaff ...

Link:

D.

gojam
12-12-2012, 03:24 PM
Where's gojam? I liked his input.

What would you like to know ?

welshwitch
12-12-2012, 03:25 PM
On Tw
https://twitter.com/afneil/status/278582932749303808

18 hours ago...

Andrew Neil ‏@afneil
Have now tracked down my Channel 4 interview with J Savile i. 1995. Trying to get permission to post. Revealing

:rolleyes:


Permission to post? Not a Twatter user but is that how it works, you need "permission" to post something about a dead paedophile? FFS!


Why now? When So-Vile investigation part 1 is closed?

aleppo
12-12-2012, 03:25 PM
In the link above there is an article in the side column about Simon Cowell and his girlfriend. Interesting to note what articles are being pushed on the public right now.

Yes, despite last Thursday's police interview and now Burrell's lawsuit, it's business as usual at Surrey HQ...


http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/12/12/simon-cowell-new-girlfriend-true-blood-janina-gavankar_n_2283037.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk-ws-bb%7Cdl2%7Csec1_lnk3%26pLid%3D141294

anders7777
12-12-2012, 03:26 PM
this story is code. more dots presented for connection.

2xJS. 1 alive . 1 dead. 1 fake. 1 real.

is the real savile still alive?


dots so far in the hanging nurse story:
- DJ's.
- royal baby.
- edward vii.
- agnes.
- Jacintha Saldanha - JS - The Doctor.
- Jimmy Savile - JS - The Fixer.
- the fool (or he who plays it).
- Tom Watson MP who brought to the attention of the nation the possibility of an organised history of paedophelia within government, gives a talk about his book Dial M for Murdoch in Sheffield on Thursday 6th December at King Edward VII Upper School, Main Hall.
- cigars (king edward)
- 2 x JS. 1 fake. 1 real.

Good work CEEJ!!!

Occultists and those who've studied hidden history will know/

Patterns

Reversals

Plays on words and spellings

Ditto time

Ditto people

(it's that old déjà vu "feeling" all over again!!!)

Usually part of a long con

The start

Middle

Maybe even the end

The trick is in figuring out wtf is going on...

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 03:27 PM
On Twatter:

https://twitter.com/afneil/status/278582932749303808

18 hours ago...

Andrew Neil ‏@afneil
Have now tracked down my Channel 4 interview with J Savile i. 1995. Trying to get permission to post. Revealing


Permission to post? Not a Twatter user but is that how it works, you need "permission" to post something about a dead paedophile? FFS!

I've watched clips from it, yet, when i went back to find them and post them here i couldn't find them anywhere....

Is This Your Life?
2 Series
"a must-see, the most incisive chat show on the box" - A.A.Gill
Presented by Andrew Neil.
Guests: Fatima Whitbread, Jimmy Savile, Albert Reynolds, Olivia Newton-John, Max Clifford, Morris Cerullo, Peter Tatchell, Ian Botham, Germaine Greer, Jeremy Beadle.
BAFTA nomination: Best talk show.

gojam
12-12-2012, 03:29 PM
It would be far more interesting to know the details of Andrew Neil's connection with Max Clifford.

Or more precisely what Max Clifford has on Andrew Neil.

blue eagke
12-12-2012, 03:29 PM
Gary Glitter and man in 70s re-bailed by Savile police

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2012-12-12/gary-glitter-re-bailed-by-savile-police/

gojam
12-12-2012, 03:31 PM
Gary Glitter and man in 70s re-bailed by Savile police

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2012-12-12/gary-glitter-re-bailed-by-savile-police/

De'ath was rebailed also but I can't find the link under BBC Cambridgeshire

thentherewere4
12-12-2012, 03:31 PM
Mark Williams Thomas is a Freemason.

His lodge meetings are held in St. James.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 03:31 PM
Or if people have things on lets say....Mr Moobs...Out it.

Moobs put up £50,000 in bail money for Joking...

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:32 PM
I've watched clips from it, yet, when i went back to find them and post them here i couldn't find them anywhere....

Is This Your Life?
2 Series
"a must-see, the most incisive chat show on the box" - A.A.Gill
Presented by Andrew Neil.
Guests: Fatima Whitbread, Jimmy Savile, Albert Reynolds, Olivia Newton-John, Max Clifford, Morris Cerullo, Peter Tatchell, Ian Botham, Germaine Greer, Jeremy Beadle.
BAFTA nomination: Best talk show.

Yeah I remember the show, just not the content. So no footage around then? Surprise surprise!

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 03:33 PM
Racoon is an agent. She turns up every-time there is a contentious story, Maddie, Hollie, Savile etc. She claims she was at Duncroft. If she was, it wasn't at the same time as JS. She claims to have ''outed'' one lady who claims she was abused by JS (Bebe Roberts), saying she was there at the time and JS hadn't been there then, this is in the late 60s, before JS was a regular in the 70s.

She and a team of helpers tried to discredit the Duncroft story and failed. One in particular claims she was still in very close contact with Miss Jones, they were defending her name to no end.
.

http://parker-joseph.com/pjcjournal/2011/04/16/anna-raccoon-taken-at-face-value/

http://holliedemandsjustice.org/content/anna-raccoon-she-working-paedophile-rings-within-government/

Thanks for this information. What a disgusting person she appears to be.

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:34 PM
it would be far more interesting to know the details of andrew neil's connection with max clifford.

Or more precisely what max clifford has on andrew neil.

+1000 :)

anders7777
12-12-2012, 03:35 PM
Paul Burrell sues Max Clifford for bearch of confidentiality

Ex-Royal Butler: 'Max Clifford Sold Me Out'

news.sky.com/story/1024159/ex-royal-butler-max-clifford-sold-me-out (http://news.sky.com/story/1024159/ex-royal-butler-max-clifford-sold-me-out)


Maybe Claydog has something to add about this...

Ding ding ding!!!

welshwitch
12-12-2012, 03:38 PM
Mark Williams Thomas is a Freemason.

His lodge meetings are held in St. James.

Wonder if with our collective knowledge we can get lists of people belonging to certain lodges who have an involvement with Yewtree investigation - on both sides of the 'fence' so to speak?

Was dreaming last night about creating similar schedule for politicos who have been outed and associates.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
My enemies enemy is my friend

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 03:38 PM
What would you like to know ?

Nothing in particular. But can you explain whether or not super-injunctions can be taken out to protect the names of people who've actually been arrested?


I enjoy reading comments like this:

It would be far more interesting to know the details of Andrew Neil's connection with Max Clifford.

Or more precisely what Max Clifford has on Andrew Neil.

Much more pertinent than many other questions.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 03:38 PM
Having desentitised myself from BBC NEWS in recent weeks ( SINCE THE NEWSNIGHT FIASCO) I returned last week to see the reporting of Clifford.

10o`clock news 2nd story ITV lead story. Newsnight no mention of it what soever. No real surprise there.

Last night I attempted to watch the 10 o`clock news and realised that something is different.

It seems disjointed with no real focus on a lead story, avoidance of Savile etc is expected but the real World Story at the moment is SYRIA/ISRAEL AREA and yet there appears to be no real portrayal of what may be happening.

The last time I caught sight of William Hague was about a month back on this thread in a picture next to Jimmy Savile.

He has a history of fuelling the reality of potentialconflict/war tension and yet he is conspicuously quiet when something potentially catastrophic may be happening:confused:

I'm a news junky and have noticed the same thing / it is like a malaise hanging over every major outlet, the doldrums, silly season

Satanmass almost here

Dec 21 almost here

Sssshhh...

marf
12-12-2012, 03:41 PM
Mark Williams Thomas is a Freemason.

His lodge meetings are held in St. James.

I'm not sure about that ..think he lives in Woking.

Interesting that yesterday on This Morning he didn't mention at all about his programmes on Savile. He seemed to lead the interview rather the Schofield.

His ex mates in Yewtree must have been leaking to him and now they have stopped.

He's also turning into a PR for himself only merchant, not really interested in the vile victims...once a copper always like them...

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:42 PM
Moobs put up £50,000 in bail money for Joking...

Yes, and apparently without enquiring what the accusation was... like you do! Even if it was my best mate, life-long buddy, I'd wanna know what the possible charge was before handing over 50k. But then again, "he didn't need to ask" apparently... ;)

gojam
12-12-2012, 03:46 PM
Nothing in particular. But can you explain whether or not super-injunctions can be taken out to protect the names of people who've actually been arrested?


I enjoy reading comments like this:



Much more pertinent than many other questions.

Two people connected to yewtree have SIs (that I know of). Rolf Harris and Leslie Grantham.

Theoretically, it is possible but there is a big BUT.

It takes time to get an SI and as soon as a person is arrested they could reasonably be named.....

My understanding is that both Harris and Grantham got their SIs before they met the police. RHs house was searched the weekend before he was questioned and perhaps he got it after then. Whereas LG's name has been in the frame since the BBC started their Savile Inquiry and it came out that a 'BBC soapstar from the 1980s' was implicated.

goodness
12-12-2012, 03:46 PM
In checking out Glencoe Scotland, where the photo of Savile w/Prince Charles and the "ladies" was taken, I went to a Glencoe Scotland blog and found this blog entry and a photo of a very disturbing statue! Unfortunately, I couldn't paste it here. What do we know about Glencoe Scotland, where Savile lived!

http://grogandgruel.blogspot.com/2010/08/west-highland-way.html



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Thursday, 19 August 2010
West Highland Way

So, it's been a busy old summer. Perhaps everyone has come into the Alehouse to shelter from the rain. Perhaps we've just come of age and the word is now out that The Grog & Gruel is just a damn good pub. Or perhaps, it's because the end of the West Highland Way has moved from the Glen Nevis roundabout (was that ever official?) to just outside the doors of the pub. Well, nearly.

The new statue in Gordon Square, Fort William

(PHOTO HERE - I couldn't paste it - sorrygo to website to see)

Regardless of quite why we've been enjoying the sweet sound of cash registers ringing, it's quite refreshing to see a bit of effort being made to welcome tens of thousands of walkers at the end of their ramblings. They've even made a bit of effort to sort out Gordon Square. And look, they've given us a new statue too.

Err..., anyway, The Grog & Gruel is now the end checkpoint (or the first one if you're walking downhill) for getting the final stamp in your West Highland Way Log Book and claiming your certificate.
Posted by Ed Daynes at 13:52
Labels: West Highland Way

qeiii
12-12-2012, 03:47 PM
Tony Prince suggests on this obituary that vile should have been Prime Minister. He also saw him recently so was he in the majick Friday group too or whoever recognises those funeral hand signals.

Watch if you haven't seen before Prince on Vile-
http://youtu.be/ozbZ5JTLKcQ

We know that Prince Charlie always seems subservient to Vile in pics, in this interview with Tony Prince, not only does he say he should have been PM but goes on to say Vile gave the pope a blessing:eek:

Does this mean Vile was higher than either of these? Was he the Grandmaster? Was everyone subservient to him. It would explain so many things wouldn't it.

blue eagke
12-12-2012, 03:51 PM
In checking out Glencoe Scotland, where the photo of Savile w/Prince Charles and the "ladies" was taken, I went to a Glencoe Scotland blog and found this blog entry and a photo of a very disturbing statue! Unfortunately, I couldn't paste it here. What do we know about Glencoe Scotland, where Savile lived!

http://grogandgruel.blogspot.com/2010/08/west-highland-way.html



http://img14.picoodle.com/i5cc/blue_eagle/x60x_dd4_ud1b8.jpg

thentherewere4
12-12-2012, 03:52 PM
I'm not sure about that ..think he lives in Woking.

...

Mark Williams Thomas is a Master Mark Mason and belongs to a special lodge of association in St James:

http://www.glmmm.com/default.aspx

Doesn't mean he isn't a member elsewhere as well.

ceej
12-12-2012, 03:52 PM
Two people connected to yewtree have SIs (that I know of). Rolf Harris and Leslie Grantham.

Theoretically, it is possible but there is a big BUT.

It takes time to get an SI and as soon as a person is arrested they could reasonably be named.....

My understanding is that both Harris and Grantham got their SIs before they met the police. RHs house was searched the weekend before he was questioned and perhaps he got it after then. Whereas LG's name has been in the frame since the BBC started their Savile Inquiry and it came out that a 'BBC soapstar from the 1980s' was implicated.

What about the 3rd man?

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 03:58 PM
Two people connected to yewtree have SIs (that I know of). Rolf Harris and Leslie Grantham.

Theoretically, it is possible but there is a big BUT.

It takes time to get an SI and as soon as a person is arrested they could reasonably be named.....

My understanding is that both Harris and Grantham got their SIs before they met the police. RHs house was searched the weekend before he was questioned and perhaps he got it after then. Whereas LG's name has been in the frame since the BBC started their Savile Inquiry and it came out that a 'BBC soapstar from the 1980s' was implicated.


RH - Wasn't there a suggestion he'd been out of the country the week before? IIRC someone spoke to his brother in Oz and he said something like "I've not spoken to him as he was out the country (UK)..." can't find the link now. My point is this - could that have caused a delay with an SI and allowed MWT to post that tweet which he still stands by when people have asked about it since? I'm just puzzled as to how MWT got away with naming him and we've not heard a peep elsewhere in the MSM. Unless of course we want to go deep and say that he was "allowed" to let it slip! ;)

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 04:03 PM
Yeah I remember the show, just not the content. So no footage around then? Surprise surprise!

Nope, apologies, i made a mistake.

There were two interviews with VILE that i had lost track of....

One is the ANeil interview on ''Is this your life'' that he has now found.

(All i could find was written details about the show, i asked around and nobody could find it online.)

The second was a Krishnan Guru-Murthy interview (i think also from C4, that's another reason i was mixed up) where some ''youths'' put some pressing questions to VILE, there is a clip below. It would be interesting to get the whole tape though? and OFC, as well the Neil interview. The only mention i can find about the details on that one was that VILE came across as rather grumpy.


http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:vp66sj28aq8J:blogs.channel4.com/gurublog/jimmy-savile-cold-aggressive-menacing/2749+jimmy+savile+is+this+your+life+interview+teen agers+questions+sex+life&cd=10&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

gojam
12-12-2012, 04:05 PM
What about the 3rd man?

Two men were the subject of yewtree on Monday. One was arrested and one was questioned under caution

The BBC announcement that the man arrested was not a sleb threw me. I'm as much in the dark as everyone else now. I've not tried to hide that on my blog.

I wouldn't question the integrity of MWT. He is just trying to make sure that crims get caught.

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 04:06 PM
RH - Wasn't there a suggestion he'd been out of the country the week before? IIRC someone spoke to his brother in Oz and he said something like "I've not spoken to him as he was out the country (UK)..." can't find the link now. My point is this - could that have caused a delay with an SI and allowed MWT to post that tweet which he still stands by when people have asked about it since? I'm just puzzled as to how MWT got away with naming him and we've not heard a peep elsewhere in the MSM. Unless of course we want to go deep and say that he was "allowed" to let it slip! ;)

There's a difference between 'standing by my Tweet' and actually repeating the allegation. I haven't been following him but I'm sure he's careful with his words on Twitter. He must have been told the timing of the SI and Tweeted before it came into effect.

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 04:09 PM
Is anybody else having dreams about this stuff?

And does anybody know of any ways to jog your memory?

I seem to go to sleep at night/morning with loads of theories running through my head.

Then in the mornings i sometimes wake up with something new to research, certain codewords.

I had one today, but my neighbour/friend woke me up with a phone call and i lost the search words :confused:

marf
12-12-2012, 04:10 PM
We know that Prince Charlie always seems subservient to Vile in pics, in this interview with Tony Prince, not only does he say he should have been PM but goes on to say Vile gave the pope a blessing:eek:

Does this mean Vile was higher than either of these? Was he the Grandmaster? Was everyone subservient to him. It would explain so many things wouldn't it.

if that's the case bet there were Jesuits involved with him.
Oh there was ...
Giarchi ...

http://www.gettyimages.ca/detail/news-photo/jesuit-priest-father-george-giarchi-with-english-dj-and-news-photo/154699346

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 04:11 PM
Two men were the subject of yewtree on Monday. One was arrested and one was questioned under caution

The BBC announcement that the man arrested was not a sleb threw me. I'm as much in the dark as everyone else now. I've not tried to hide that on my blog.

I wouldn't question the integrity of MWT. He is just trying to make sure that crims get caught.

Have you written on your blog your thoughts about the masses of correspondence/files at Savile's PA's house? Do you think it was bait?

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:12 PM
Was probably a 'Friend of Israel' just like Cameron and most of the MP's in this country

http://www2.cfoi.co.uk/ conservative friends

http://www.lfi.org.uk/ labour friends

http://ldfi.org.uk/ lib dem friends


The corpse shagger is probably at 45 degrees attention under mad max at the mount of olives, facing Scarborough's sewage outlet into the sea...

gojam
12-12-2012, 04:12 PM
RH - Wasn't there a suggestion he'd been out of the country the week before? IIRC someone spoke to his brother in Oz and he said something like "I've not spoken to him as he was out the country (UK)..." can't find the link now. My point is this - could that have caused a delay with an SI and allowed MWT to post that tweet which he still stands by when people have asked about it since? I'm just puzzled as to how MWT got away with naming him and we've not heard a peep elsewhere in the MSM. Unless of course we want to go deep and say that he was "allowed" to let it slip! ;)

Here is the link he was in the USA- http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/uks-jimmy-savile-child-sex-scandal-linked-to-an-australian-music-legend/story-e6freuy9-1226527780646

You can only be in contempt of court and subject to an SI if you have been officially notified of it. MWT was able to name RH because he had not been notified, whereas the police and MSM had been notified and couldn't name him. Looking at MWT's tweets I would guess that soon after he was notified of the SI and has not repeated what he tweeted.

I've named RH on my blog. If I was officially notified I certainly wouldn't be able to repeat what I've written and I may have to take down what I've already posted AND I wouldn't be able to tell anybody why that was......

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 04:12 PM
Two people connected to yewtree have SIs (that I know of). Rolf Harris and Leslie Grantham.

Theoretically, it is possible but there is a big BUT.

It takes time to get an SI and as soon as a person is arrested they could reasonably be named.....

My understanding is that both Harris and Grantham got their SIs before they met the police. RHs house was searched the weekend before he was questioned and perhaps he got it after then. Whereas LG's name has been in the frame since the BBC started their Savile Inquiry and it came out that a 'BBC soapstar from the 1980s' was implicated.

Ok, thanks.

claydog
12-12-2012, 04:12 PM
Weishupt was a sanyam (spelling?) he became Catholic. - The Jesuits, the Black Pope are a hidden Jewish sect within the church, their founder and most leaders were Jewish. Their oaths Jewish. They always infiltrate!:eek:


I'm still waiting to hear back from the mods for permission on the advert in UK Column and also Brian Gerrish is addressing the questions himself.


D.:)


Great stuff! :)

pravda
12-12-2012, 04:13 PM
So Keyser would have been 34 when she gave birth if we presume the Child was Savilles mum, Agnes Monica Kelly.

There is not alot of info on Keyser compared to his other mistresses which makes it hard but why think Agnes Monica Kelly was the daughter of Keyser and Edward as opposed to any of the other royal mistresses?

'The duchess' was brought up in Durham by James Kelly and Ellen Thompson Eskdale, then later put in an orphanage, so presumably they were poor.
That doesn't really fit with being the daughter of a king and a well to do woman. They usually secreted their bastards in better circumstances.

Not saying it couldn't be true but how can the Duchess be linked to Keyser
ie time, place etc?

(edit to add - there really is no info about Agnes Keyser, no mother or father etc. just that her father was a 'wealthy stockbroker', so maybe she was born out of wedlock too!)

It wasn't an orphanage though, it was a Catholic boarding school for the middle classes.and Agnes was sent there with two of her sisters Margaret and Winifred, while their parents (?) were still alive ...I think its usage must have changed over time...

In the 1891 census, Agnes Kelly is listed as being aged 4 and born in "about 1887" in Consett, Co. Durham ...it is THIS Agnes Kelly who in the 1901 census was living in a children's home in Radford, Oxfordshire, aged 14. It was a catholic convent boarding school run by the "Sisters of Charity of St. Paul, .... for children of middle-class families."

http://archive.catholicherald.co.uk/article/20th-june-1941/7/radford-centenary-mission-dates-back-to-17th-centu

Also


Radford

I was at St Marys Convent, Radford, a boarding school run by nuns for young girls wanting to be nuns. I was there for a few years - quite harsh. Anyone else got any memories?

http://www.francisfrith.com/radford,oxfordshire/

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 04:13 PM
Nope, apologies, i made a mistake.

There were two interviews with VILE that i had lost track of....

One is the ANeil interview on ''Is this your life'' that he has now found.

(All i could find was written details about the show, i asked around and nobody could find it online.)

The second was a Krishnan Guru-Murthy interview (i think also from C4, that's another reason i was mixed up) where some ''youths'' put some pressing questions to VILE, there is a clip below. It would be interesting to get the whole tape though? and OFC, as well the Neil interview. The only mention i can find about the details on that one was that VILE came across as rather grumpy.


http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:vp66sj28aq8J:blogs.channel4.com/gurublog/jimmy-savile-cold-aggressive-menacing/2749+jimmy+savile+is+this+your+life+interview+teen agers+questions+sex+life&cd=10&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

Interesting video, and yes, the whole thing would be good to see. I noted this from the text by Krishnan Guru-Murthy:

"Janet Street Porter, who says she knew about Savile when she was at the BBC, was my boss at the time. She didn’t produce Open to Question, but she was the executive in charge as head of youth programmes.

I can only assume she did not know about the Savile allegations at the precise time that her new young presenter was in a studio filled with teenagers and Jimmy Savile."


... Never assume Krishnan, never assume! I'm sure she knew alright.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:13 PM
Yup, i noticed.

Headline:
SIMON IS TRUE TO FORM......

They're telling us straight

Maybe the wrong word to use :D

How about nine bob note? :D

gojam
12-12-2012, 04:14 PM
Have you written on your blog your thoughts about the masses of correspondence/files at Savile's PA's house? Do you think it was bait?

You have a link for that ? :)

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 04:14 PM
Here is the link he was in the USA- http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/uks-jimmy-savile-child-sex-scandal-linked-to-an-australian-music-legend/story-e6freuy9-1226527780646

You can only be in contempt of court and subject to an SI if you have been officially notified of it. MWT was able to name RH because he had not been notified, whereas the police and MSM had been notified and couldn't name him. Looking at MWT's tweets I would guess that soon after he was notified of the SI and has not repeated what he tweeted.

I've named RH on my blog. If I was officially notified I certainly wouldn't be able to repeat what I've written and I may have to take down what I've already posted AND I wouldn't be able to tell anybody why that was......

I was about to ask how you were able to say those names, but you've since answered it.

claydog
12-12-2012, 04:15 PM
Here is the link he was in the USA- http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/uks-jimmy-savile-child-sex-scandal-linked-to-an-australian-music-legend/story-e6freuy9-1226527780646

You can only be in contempt of court and subject to an SI if you have been officially notified of it. MWT was able to name RH because he had not been notified, whereas the police and MSM had been notified and couldn't name him. Looking at MWT's tweets I would guess that soon after he was notified of the SI and has not repeated what he tweeted.

I've named RH on my blog. If I was officially notified I certainly wouldn't be able to repeat what I've written and I may have to take down what I've already posted AND I wouldn't be able to tell anybody why that was......



Their lawyers would have jumped on any one naming Rolf if this was last year. This leads me to believe they are probably busy concerning themselves with other matters..

marf
12-12-2012, 04:16 PM
Who has these, when can we learn about his school and childhood. Someone has that family album strange how it never was seen even at funeral time.
Any school buddies or birthday party pictures?

Nothing really new but a link from a while back

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/features/3631736/Family-detective-Jimmy-Savile.html

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:16 PM
What would you like to know ?

Are you a weller fan? :D

welshwitch
12-12-2012, 04:17 PM
Is anybody else having dreams about this stuff?

And does anybody know of any ways to jog your memory?

I seem to go to sleep at night/morning with loads of theories running through my head.

Then in the mornings i sometimes wake up with something new to research, certain codewords.

I had one today, but my neighbour/friend woke me up with a phone call and i lost the search words :confused:


Me too - hence posts re Heath & later oh Kincora - a sense that the info needed to be revisited.

I take the view that if 3rd parties read this forum for info - or shills -then let em have it right in their faces. If they are looking for us to breach some reg - they have to read everything. Eventually - like NLP - the info must get thro in their minds and make them question.

:)

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 04:19 PM
You have a link for that ? :)

No, I mean when Exposure showed Savile's files at his PA's house, it struck me as odd that they would be at her house. 1, she'd be scared of people trying to get hold of it, 2, surely it was potential evidence and so should be in the possession of the police. Why did they need to show it at her place?

I was asking your opinion rather than stating it as fact.

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:19 PM
Mark Williams Thomas is a Freemason.

His lodge meetings are held in St. James.

Thanks, that's good enough for me! Chilly heat see Spivey was right :D

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 04:19 PM
Here is the link he was in the USA- http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/uks-jimmy-savile-child-sex-scandal-linked-to-an-australian-music-legend/story-e6freuy9-1226527780646

You can only be in contempt of court and subject to an SI if you have been officially notified of it. MWT was able to name RH because he had not been notified, whereas the police and MSM had been notified and couldn't name him. Looking at MWT's tweets I would guess that soon after he was notified of the SI and has not repeated what he tweeted.

I've named RH on my blog. If I was officially notified I certainly wouldn't be able to repeat what I've written and I may have to take down what I've already posted AND I wouldn't be able to tell anybody why that was......


Thanks. I was overlooking the notification thing, makes sense now. Just out of interest, do you know what the process of notification is? I guess it's obvious MSM are informed first, but surely someone like MWT would have been on the radar to be informed? Or is it just a case inform the MSM then sit back and wait for a complaint to come in so you can then slap a piece of paper or email in someone's face telling them shut up?

tameelf
12-12-2012, 04:20 PM
Who has these, when can we learn about his school and childhood. Someone has that family album strange how it never was seen even at funeral time.
Any school buddies or birthday party pictures?

Nothing really new but a link from a while back

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/features/3631736/Family-detective-Jimmy-Savile.html

i spent all day sunday searchin his schooling found nothing

gojam
12-12-2012, 04:21 PM
Are you a weller fan? :D

Love him :D

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:21 PM
Thanks for this information. What a disgusting person she appears to be.

She/he has YEARS OF FORM

OARS IN ALL OVER THE PLACE

ESP GUIDO FAWKES

claydog
12-12-2012, 04:22 PM
I'm not sure about that ..think he lives in Woking.

Interesting that yesterday on This Morning he didn't mention at all about his programmes on Savile. He seemed to lead the interview rather the Schofield.

His ex mates in Yewtree must have been leaking to him and now they have stopped.

He's also turning into a PR for himself only merchant, not really interested in the vile victims...once a copper always like them...



I was told he is a Freemason at the level that matters and to avoid him, that advice turned out to be helpful. He also a wannabe Clifford, self serving and not in any description a "child protection expert" He did fuck all in uniform so what makes him an expert now? Oh the BBC and media do..

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:23 PM
+1000 :)

Neil probably has as much if not more! Don't underestimate the Greek sponge!!! :D

gojam
12-12-2012, 04:24 PM
Thanks. I was overlooking the notification thing, makes sense now. Just out of interest, do you know what the process of notification is? I guess it's obvious MSM are informed first, but surely someone like MWT would have been on the radar to be informed? Or is it just a case inform the MSM then sit back and wait for a complaint to come in so you can then slap a piece of paper or email in someone's face telling them shut up?

I don't think MWT was on their radar at the time but he hasn't broken any law.

That is exactly it !!!

I must nip out.

claydog
12-12-2012, 04:24 PM
Thanks, that's good enough for me! Chilly heat see Spivey was right :D

A five minute telephone conversation with MWT told me all I need to know. But I was warned about him in 2008..

anders7777
12-12-2012, 04:24 PM
Wonder if with our collective knowledge we can get lists of people belonging to certain lodges who have an involvement with Yewtree investigation - on both sides of the 'fence' so to speak?

Was dreaming last night about creating similar schedule for politicos who have been outed and associates.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
My enemies enemy is my friend


I was working on that last night with the yewtree players

No obvious hits

But THEY wd be careful... After all recent fiascos...

claydog
12-12-2012, 04:28 PM
I don't think MWT was on their radar at the time but he hasn't broken any law.

That is exactly it !!!

I must nip out.

But twitter originality names Rolf, if Rolf had of done something due to having press jackals camped outside his house 247 then twitter would have been blamed for an internet witch hunt. MWT would have wriggled out due to being old bill and on the square. I wish I was still driving I would go to Bray and film the press jackals then put up a video. They hang around peoples homes then blame it on "public demand" they want an excuse to tighten up internet laws.

newjersey
12-12-2012, 04:34 PM
BBC just reported that 80% of Saville's victims were female and 80% were children..............end of story. Absolutely refusing to mention males. :mad:

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 04:35 PM
Thanks for this information. What a disgusting person she appears to be.


I wouldn't trust anything she says. She/he/they have been shown as a liar numerous times.

Just because they ARE using this story to put pressure on teh media/internets, just because she thinks she has outed one victim thus discredited the story, it still doesn't mean she is right in saying the whole thing is a fake.

We KNOW they're using this story to their own ends (anybody can see the internet being used in this), so she doesn't deny this, instead she uses this reason and her ''past'' to concoct a version where the whole thing is a fraud, ergo mostly the victims are liars.

That's basically her M.O, discredit the victims at ALL costs.

Just like Rose/Aaronovitch/Liddle/Littlejohn et al, except she claims to have inside knowledge, and she uses the internet and not the MSM.

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 04:35 PM
She/he has YEARS OF FORM

OARS IN ALL OVER THE PLACE

ESP GUIDO FAWKES

Is he a simliar charater? I remember many pages ago there was an issue over which clifford vid he put on his site. Im new to all this and learning something new every day, mostly from this forum to be honest
Mods if off topic please delete

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 04:38 PM
Is he a simliar charater? I remember many pages ago there was an issue over which clifford vid he put on his site. Im new to all this and learning something new every day, mostly from this forum to be honest
Mods if off topic please delete

He sent round an edited version with his logo on. The incriminating lines were taken out. Publicity?

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 04:38 PM
BBC just reported that 80% of Saville's victims were female and 80% were children..............end of story. Absolutely refusing to mention males. :mad:

Yup, they said they were going to go through the figures, really!?

Where are they then?

Maybe 20% were animals? :confused:

Did anybody notice the pause and kerfuffle when they were reporting the story?

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 04:39 PM
I wouldn't trust anything she says. She/he/they have been shown as a liar numerous times.

Just because they ARE using this story to put pressure on teh media/internets, just because she thinks she has outed one victim thus discredited the story, it still doesn't mean she is right in saying the whole thing is a fake.

We KNOW they're using this story to their own ends (anybody can see the internet being used in this), so she doesn't deny this, instead she uses this reason and her ''past'' to concoct a version where the whole thing is a fraud, ergo mostly the victims are liars.

That's basically her M.O, discredit the victims at ALL costs.

Just like Rose/Aaronovitch/Liddle/Littlejohn et al, except she claims to have inside knowledge, and she uses the internet and not the MSM.


Yep, follwed the links you provided. Got to say only newbies like me would of been initially taken in. Even then cant say many are exactly listening to her.
Might explain why the MSM never picked up on her story ( if even that bit was true) as they knew who she was and her past.
anyways once again thanks

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 04:40 PM
BBC just reported that 80% of Saville's victims were female and 80% were children..............end of story. Absolutely refusing to mention males. :mad:

See what you're saying, and I'm sure they're wording in a very crafty way, but the evidence is there - If 80% were female then the other 20% were?...

Unless they weren't human? :D

Anyone who bothers to look will take note of that fact and start asking questions. Hopefully.

newjersey
12-12-2012, 04:41 PM
They just did it again, shocking stuff, how many times can you come up with percentages that skirt around the issue that Saville also preyed on Males.

blue_bear
12-12-2012, 04:41 PM
BBC just reported that 80% of Saville's victims were female and 80% were children..............end of story. Absolutely refusing to mention males. :mad:

Well it's safe to say they think that 20% were male and 20% were adults. Am I missing something? :s

jewellerymaker
12-12-2012, 04:41 PM
"Lockdown on info.."

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/9821/princevideosfreemasons.jpg

"Sometimes info is a one way street."

Prince looks quite happy to be there. I think he's filming it for Savile to watch back later and see what a good crowd he pulled.

eyesopened
12-12-2012, 04:43 PM
He sent round an edited version with his logo on. The incriminating lines were taken out. Publicity?
Or diffuse the event. people look at "his " video and think whats all the fuss about, not realising the unedited version is out there.

newjersey
12-12-2012, 04:45 PM
Well it's safe to say they think that 20% were male and 20% were adults. Am I missing something? :s

Yes you are missing something, for the third time in 15 minutes they have not used the word male.

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 04:45 PM
De'ath clearly has an SI doesn't he? The online reports of Glitter and a "man in his 70's" being re-bailed and BBC news just now saying "a TV producer"...

natclak
12-12-2012, 04:57 PM
Going off on a tangent again sorry.

Do we already know this, that Saville was a porter at Broadmoor Hospital, before running dance halls?? http://www.diigo.com/item/image/3d4e0/108k?size=o

Also Savile went back down his old pit in the 70's...
Name:Steve Lyons
Comment:With reference to Jack Mitchell ,s statement that the crane was long gone in 1974. I started working here in january 74 and we rebuilt the big crane.It had been sent down in pieces from near Newcastle. The landscape looked like this then so there must have been another crane there at some time or maybe it was the second time it had been there. From this picture you would not be able to see it because it was lower down.It took 6 months to build and it was freezing out there. When it was running Jimmy Savile came and was allowed to work it for a few minutes. He had worked at the pit years earlier down the road. That workshop was how i remember it.
Date:11-Jan-2010 http://www.leodis.net/display.aspx?resourceIdentifier=20091217_169915&DISPLAY=FULL

chipstyxx
12-12-2012, 04:59 PM
See what you're saying, and I'm sure they're wording in a very crafty way, but the evidence is there - If 80% were female then the other 20% were?...

Unless they weren't human? :D

Anyone who bothers to look will take note of that fact and start asking questions. Hopefully.

So they mean 80% were girls (ie underage), the other 20% could be a mixture of women (over 16), boys, men, bodies whatever :p

I was thinking the other day that all those arrested have been hetero men (presumably with Cliffirord and Stuart Hall included) that are percieved as lecherous old men who's victims were girls or women.

It's a way of keeping the abuse of young boys (ie at care homes) out of the publics mind.
It also occured to me whilst watching shows like boardwalk empire /game of thrones, plenty of prostitution and exploitation of women and girls but never boys! It would be one step too far and get people thinking.

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 05:00 PM
De'ath clearly has an SI doesn't he? The online reports of Glitter and a "man in his 70's" being re-bailed and BBC news just now saying "a TV producer"...

Nope. They did name him just now on BBC news channel. He has been named numerous times already.

Probably the only reason they wouldn't mention his name would be nobody really knows who he is.

No idea if it was him who has been re-bailed with GG?

northernlass
12-12-2012, 05:05 PM
Yup, they said they were going to go through the figures, really!?

Where are they then?

Maybe 20% were animals? :confused:

Did anybody notice the pause and kerfuffle when they were reporting the story?
20 per cent dead bodies perhaps:confused::o

gojam
12-12-2012, 05:10 PM
De'ath clearly has an SI doesn't he? The online reports of Glitter and a "man in his 70's" being re-bailed and BBC news just now saying "a TV producer"...

If De'ath had an SI the BBC wouldn't have tweeted this (2nd down) - https://twitter.com/BBCCambs

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 05:10 PM
Former pop star Gary Glitter and a man in his 70s, reported to be former television producer Wilfred De'Ath, have been re-bailed by police investigating the Jimmy Savile sex abuse scandal.

Glitter, whose real name is Paul Gadd, was the first person to be arrested as part of Operation Yewtree, the investigation into allegations of sex abuse surrounding Savile and others.

The 68-year-old was detained at his central London home on October 28, before being questioned by officers and released on bail.

A man reported to be De'Ath, a former BBC employee who once produced a radio show presented by Savile, was arrested at his home in Cambridgeshire on November 11 and also bailed to return to police.

http://www.newsrt.co.uk/news/glitter-re-bailed-in-savile-inquiry-1052872.html

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 05:11 PM
More BREAKING...


Yewtree has another 20 suspects to be questioned....

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 05:13 PM
Spindler talking now....

Savile offending peaked in 70s...

We will be showing in the new year how he used public services to commit offences....

17 different police areas....

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 05:15 PM
So they mean 80% were girls (ie underage), the other 20% could be a mixture of women (over 16), boys, men, bodies whatever :p

I was thinking the other day that all those arrested have been hetero men (presumably with Cliffirord and Stuart Hall included) that are percieved as lecherous old men who's victims were girls or women.

It's a way of keeping the abuse of young boys (ie at care homes) out of the publics mind.
It also occured to me whilst watching shows like boardwalk empire /game of thrones, plenty of prostitution and exploitation of women and girls but never boys! It would be one step too far and get people thinking.


There's a thought - maybe the BBC don't believe a corspe still has a gender! :D

I would say that it could also be taking focus away from certain individuals. Not saying for one moment that paedophilia=homosexual (I know the difference) but obviously there are certain names who are known (or perceived) to be gay and child abusers. If they make it look like paedophilia is a heterosexual only thing (dirty old men on little girls) then certain individuals avoid the microscope. IMO it's neither homo or hetero, I've even heard it explained by a psychologist that it's a form of sexuality (for want of another word) in itself. I'm just pointing out how they so easily create distractions.

Think of when Call Me Dave said on This Morning about not wanting it to become a witch hunt against homosexual men - IMO that was a distraction. I'd even go as far as saying it gave any of those accused to jump up and say "I'm being targeted purely because of my sexuality" - a form of enablement if you like.

harry_brown
12-12-2012, 05:16 PM
If De'ath had an SI the BBC wouldn't have tweeted this (2nd down) - https://twitter.com/BBCCambs

Good spot. So why are others reluctant to name?

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 05:19 PM
Eh??

What happened to that post re The Times editor/potential Ben Fellows story?

Can we delete our own posts? :confused:

marf
12-12-2012, 05:19 PM
This happened in the late 60s and 70s from the Catholic Herald archives and Jesuit link. Maybe training time for vile.

http://archive.catholicherald.co.uk/article/29th-september-1967/3/flowery-fathers-hippie-social

The theme is "Drugs and Mysticism." You arrive on Friday, the programme instructs, with flowers and bells. On Saturday there's "Field practice with drugs" when Dr. Otto Belam will administer some innocuous drugs.

a squad of girls to parade outside busy Underground stations. They wear huge flowers and carry placards which say: "Have God, will travel."
One of the highlights of the two-week "preach-in" is a 10-mile charity walk led by Jimmy Savile, the disc jockey. Fr. Giarchi had a bit of trouble over him with a girl from an international news agency. The wires got crossed and she thought Jimmy Savile had become a Jesuit.
In an age of television he thinks that the Church's methods of communication have to be radically updated. There's nothing new in what Fr. Giarchi says; it's the way he says, it that's so engaging.

http://archive.catholicherald.co.uk/article/6th-october-1967/3/flowers-in-farm-street
And here
http://clearvoices.co.uk/giarchi/4558555272

northernlass
12-12-2012, 05:21 PM
sorry off topic but the news about "super rats "made me chortle..reminded me of the Water Rats:p

The mutant brown rats, which carry life-threatening diseases, have been emerging from their traditional havens in sewers and ditches and taking refuge in people's homes.

The problem has been made worse by recent wet weather, which has driven hordes of rats from flooded drains.

Some of the worst-hit areas are in the affluent home counties including Berkshire, Hampshire, Oxford and Henley-on-Thames, home to the Royal Regatta.:D

goodness
12-12-2012, 05:23 PM
This message is from Trevor Pitman, Deputy of the States of Jersey who started the petition "John Vine, UK independent Chief Inspector of Borders and Immigration: Restore the visa of banned journalist Leah McGrath Goodman #FreeJersey,"

GOOD NEWS: I have just submitted for a new UK visa. This would not have been possible, if not for the amazing support and signatures of you very fine people. With your continued support, my actually receiving the visa may be within my reach -- but it is not assured. While the UK authorities deliberate the final verdict, you can make a real difference. In the spirit of the holidays, please pass this petition on to anyone you might know who would consider it and sign it. Especially at this time of year, looking after the children -- wherever they might be -- is of the greatest priority. Thank you!

Leah
--

MORE ON MY VISA STORY BELOW

(From the blog of leahmcgrathgoodman.com):

PH SAYS:
DECEMBER 8, 2012 AT 1:50 PM
How are things progressing? It appears to be taking an exceptional amount of time to complete some simple form filling !!

REPLY
LEAH MCGRATH GOODMAN SAYS:
DECEMBER 10, 2012 AT 6:20 PM
To PH – and everyone else who has followed my misadventures:

If only it were that simple. Because of the bizarre way in which I was thrown out, my return has been anything but a straightforward process. Those involved in my case have had different goals and — from what I can glean — not all of them aligned with my wish to return to Jersey.

The main problem: Jersey objected last year to my entering the UK on a Business Visitor’s visa. This is what journalists normally use for trips of 6 months or less. For years, I have traveled in the UK on this visa and used it for trips to Jersey. Once Jersey forbade me to enter this island on the Business Visitor’s visa (initially, it approved it, but then changed its mind) my list of options for entering the country narrowed — greatly.

The UK has heavily restricted writers from entering the country in recent years (to be fair, this seems to be the case in the U.S., as well). This means we have been forced to comb through a netherworld of obscure visas that may or may not allow for my return. Remember, other journalists may travel to the UK on the Business Visitor’s visa, but not me. And, yes, I feel I was targeted. Finding another way to the goal has been a yearlong process.

Now for the good news: This past week, I applied for one of these more obscure visas. Jersey’s authorities have been working with the UK — and the MPs who have backed me — to retrofit a generic ‘Offshore Worker’ visa. They are overlaying it with some additional specifications for a writer. This visa has never been offered before — to anyone, it seems — but as far as I’m concerned, if it makes all those involved happy, I’ll take it. For the record, I have filed for one other visa this past year to return to the UK, but it was denied.

It is my sincere hope this newer application will be met with superior results.

Thank you — and thanks for all the support.

welshwitch
12-12-2012, 05:24 PM
This message is from Trevor Pitman, Deputy of the States of Jersey who started the petition &quot;John Vine, UK independent Chief Inspector of Borders and Immigration: Restore the visa of banned journalist Leah McGrath Goodman #FreeJersey,&quot; which you signed on Change.org.


GOOD NEWS: I have just submitted for a new UK visa. This would not have been possible, if not for the amazing support and signatures of you very fine people. With your continued support, my actually receiving the visa may be within my reach -- but it is not assured. While the UK authorities deliberate the final verdict, you can make a real difference. In the spirit of the holidays, please pass this petition on to anyone you might know who would consider it and sign it. Especially at this time of year, looking after the children -- wherever they might be -- is of the greatest priority. Thank you!

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 05:26 PM
I wonder who the MP's are? :confused:

blue eagke
12-12-2012, 05:27 PM
Eh??

What happened to that post re The Times editor/potential Ben Fellows story?

Can we delete our own posts? :confused:

Sorry. Yes I deleted it when I released I hadn't actually read the headline...

Harding resigns as Times editor

James Harding has resigned as editor of The Times after it was "made clear to me that News Corporation would like to appoint a new editor."


and realised he was effectively pushed and may have nothing to do with resigning because of story/stories + thought the link to Ben Fellows was too speculative.



NB you can delete posts via the edit button in the right corner of a post.

gojam
12-12-2012, 05:27 PM
My understanding of the stats =

20% Young males

20% adult females

60% young females

I can guess that no corpses or animals made a complaint to the yewtree officers and all cases are due to a complaint.

signalnorth
12-12-2012, 05:29 PM
Who has these, when can we learn about his school and childhood. Someone has that family album strange how it never was seen even at funeral time.
Any school buddies or birthday party pictures?

Nothing really new but a link from a while back

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/features/3631736/Family-detective-Jimmy-Savile.html

The complete absence of them is odd to my mind.

Another thing, someone recently said on here that they feel like we are missing something obvious in this whole thing, I feel just the same way

pravda
12-12-2012, 05:32 PM
heh,
why do you think the NHS was set up in the first place?
considering we live in a totalitarian state and have done since fuck knows when.....


the new duchess on the scene has ancestors from leeds
and these synchronicities are doin' my freaked out nut in

it's a crazy rollercoaster ride from here on in

can feel it, building
like a powder keg

yes, former mayors, no less

http://suite101.com/article/kate-middletons-ancestors-the-luptons-of-leeds-a356783

I posted this link way up the thread as I also found the Leeds connection interesting

oldp
12-12-2012, 05:33 PM
i spent all day sunday searchin his schooling found nothing

He is reported as going to St Anne's School, Leeds. I presume it's Holy Rosary and St Anne's Primary School, but can find nothing further.

obliette
12-12-2012, 05:36 PM
Meanwhile, police have set up Operation Fairbank to investigate allegations by Labour MP Tom Watson of a paedophile ring in high places,

Mr Watson said in October that police should investigate claims of a "powerful paedophile ring" linked to a previous prime minister's "senior adviser" and Parliament.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20697738

ceasar909
12-12-2012, 05:36 PM
http://img14.picoodle.com/i5cc/blue_eagle/x60x_dd4_ud1b8.jpg

disturbing even more so given the location and is most famous evil so called celeb.

gojam
12-12-2012, 05:38 PM
I wouldn't trust Ben Fellows as far as I could throw him.

I've taken him out of the equation completely.

silverfiligree
12-12-2012, 05:40 PM
i spent all day sunday searchin his schooling found nothing

TF, I just had a look in his autobiography 'As It Happens' and found this:

I mourn the passing of those factories of learning called 'elementary schools'. I joined the one known as St Anne's, in Leeds, at four and stayed til my fourteenth birthday.. Most pupils distinguished themselves in later life. At least two got hanged, several are self-made millionaires, I won forty No 1 awards for various showbiz successes, and there was one very polite pupil with a gorgeous sister, who went into films and has done O.K. His name was, and still is, Peter O'Toole.

Hope this helps! Maybe we could approach former classmates via Friends Reunited..?

claydog
12-12-2012, 05:45 PM
I wouldn't trust Ben Fellows as far as I could throw him.

I've taken him out of the equation completely.



Media mug puppet.

luv evreone
12-12-2012, 05:47 PM
Anybody hear that dude on BBC news channel talking about the Pat Finucane (Belfast solicitor's) murder?

He was saying an inquiry could get to the truth like it did with the Jimmy Savile case.

These people just love taking the piss out of us i think :rolleyes:

gojam
12-12-2012, 05:48 PM
Media mug puppet.

the best that could be said of him is that he is a self publicist idiot trying to make a name for himself..........the worst that could be said of him is worse than 'media mug puppet' (afterall the media haven't exactly swallowed his BS)